Tourna Big Hitter Black 7

Discussion in 'Strings' started by SteveI, Dec 25, 2011.

  1. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    Quick comparison of BHB7 17 and Black Widow 17 since a couple of people have enquired.

    Yes, they're both back and 7 sided. No, they're not the same string. In fact, they feel and perform very differently.

    Black Widow is unbelievably soft, very comfortable, more muted and more dampened feeling than BHB7. It fact, Black Widow barely feels like a poly. Touch play is very good because of its softness and the fact that it doesn't have the springiness of BHB7. You can feel the ball so much more with volleys. However, if you like crisp feeling strings, you probably won't like Black Widow. Also it doesn't have the spin of BHB7 and doesn't allow you to hit quite as heavy a ball. Also there's no way Black Widow 17 is 1.26mm - its much closer to 1.20mm. It would be worth trying the '16' gauge if you normally choose 17 gauge strings from other manufacturers.

    BHB7 is more the performance orientated string and there are many comments about it already in this thread.

    Comparison of Weiscannon B5E 17 and BHB7 17 from another thread:

    http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showpost.php?p=6311712&postcount=5
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2012
  2. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    Slightly OT but I had an excellent hitting session this evening with my BLX 6.1 95 (18x20) freshly strung with BHBR16.

    Absolutely sublime and perfectly balanced combination - the 6.1 and that pattern provides the control and the BHBR16 provides the action and liveliness on the ball. It's such a beautifully harmonious combination of racquet and string if you ever find yourself in a position where you can play a constant attacking game or you're playing a counterpuncher - it just allows you to rain complete destruction on them. Blitzkrieg tennis at its best.
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2012
  3. Uvijek Argen

    Uvijek Argen Semi-Pro

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    Thanks for taking your time comparing those too Torres.
     
  4. TenFanLA

    TenFanLA Hall of Fame

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    Torres (or anyone else who has used BHB7 16g), have you tried BHB7 16g? If so how does it compare to BHB7 17g and BHBR 16g? My ideal power level would be "x" where:

    BHBR 17 1.2mm > Cyclone 18 1.2mm > x > B5E and ALU.

    I cannot use ALU even in a hybrid because it kills my arm and B5E ain't that friendly either in cold weather. BHBR 17 and Cyclone 18 are too lively against hard hitters in my MG Rad Pro 16x19. So I'm thinking about giving BHB7 16g a shot.
     
  5. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    ^ I'm testing the 16 at the moment, but even without finishing my playtest, I can 99% guarantee that power will be in the "x" spot as that range between Cyclone 18 and B5E 17 is huge! I'll be doing a comparison of 17 v 16 but need a couple more weeks with the string in a variety of different conditions and against different players to firm up my views.
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2012
  6. dre

    dre New User

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    Looking forward to the results !
     
  7. TenFanLA

    TenFanLA Hall of Fame

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    Just ordered the BHB7 16g reel from TW. I was going to just order a few sets with some grips but they are out of sets until 2/16/12 and I can't wait that long. Oh well, at least I got free shipping. I'll test it out on 16x19 100" MG Rad Pro and give my input from another perspective. I'm not as detailed or patient as Torres so you will get my immediate reaction right away. It's the "First Drive" report as opposed to "Full, Detailed" report.
     
  8. Orion3

    Orion3 Semi-Pro

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    Guys - how does this compare with CoFocus Hex?

    Spin and tension maintenance wise?

    I'm currently using CoFocus as my cross with VS mains - think it is the best hybrid setup I've tried to date. However, getting CoFocus in the UK isn't that easy, so I was looking to buy a reel of Focus Hex.

    That said, I was always a big fan of BHBR and am wondering if the BHB7 would be a better buy to use as a cross with my current setup?


    Thanks in advance
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2012
  9. ryushen21

    ryushen21 Hall of Fame

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    I just read through the last couple pages. Has anyone done a direct comparison between BHB7 and SP Tornado in a full bed setup? I'm looking for a cheaper alternative to Tornado and this looks like it could work for me.
     
  10. Bmr

    Bmr Rookie

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    Torres,

    You know I was playtesting a BLX 95 16x18 last year and actually hit really well with it (think it was just NXT in it). Still considering making the switch. It really improved the volleys/serving and my groundstrokes weren't bad. I hit with my friends BLX 90 and that was just too difficult to play with and too heavy. The 18x20 and other denser string patterns don't suit my game, either.

    It sounds like the BHBR is really playing well for you. What has been your main string over the past year or two?

    Have you hit with the new Prostaff line?
     
  11. COPEY

    COPEY Hall of Fame

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    I take it you're in the UK? If you're in the U.S., and Tornado is your string of choice, you've got it made.
     
  12. ryushen21

    ryushen21 Hall of Fame

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    I'm actually in the US.
     
  13. BigT

    BigT Professional

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    How pronounced are the 7 edges? Can you see them from just looking at the string?
     
  14. tennis11

    tennis11 New User

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    To BigT not to get off topic, but does pros pro offer discount to college players? and what string of yours is most similar to alu rough in a 16 gauge
     
  15. COPEY

    COPEY Hall of Fame

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    Well hey, check out the prices of your string in the UK, partner - you'll be pleasantly surprised. If you can wait a week to 10 days for it, it's well worth it.
     
  16. Orion3

    Orion3 Semi-Pro

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    HELP please

    Played last night and afterwards started to feel discomfort in my elbow :(

    As much as I don't want it to be, I know its the start of TE.

    It's only re-started since switching to CoFocus, so I think I still have some choices.

    1) String one of my sticks in pure gut - so I can play until the TE goes away.
    2) Switch back to BHBR as a cross
    3) Find another poly to cross with

    I liked BHBR as a cross but love the CoFocus!?!?!?

    Anyone tried the BHB7 as a cross in a Gut/Poly setup yet?

    Thanks again
     
  17. J_aces

    J_aces Semi-Pro

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    What's better about the cofocus cross compared to bhbr?
     
  18. Orion3

    Orion3 Semi-Pro

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    Better... seems to hold its tension better and generally has a much longer playable life.

    Spin wise - not a huge difference. The gut mains seem to glide across both the CoFocus and BHBR very well.
     
  19. Bmr

    Bmr Rookie

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    Strings have arrived...

    Well, I strung up one of my SPB's last night with the BHBR at 57/58 in the mains and a pound or two lower in the cross. The string looks and feels almost exactly the same as Luxilon ALU Power Rough. I am going to playtest it tonight and see how it goes.

    The BHB7 looks a lot like Pro Supex Blue Gear. Not sure it plays anything like that but it sure looks similar. I remember playtesting that string a couple years ago.
     
  20. SteveI

    SteveI Legend

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    The BHB7 plays nothing like the Blue Gear in my experience. The Blue Gear came out years ago.. and was really one of the 1st go arounds with this type of string. I was not impressed. Stiff.. no feel...not much power. Great spin but not much more and did not really hold tension very well. I playtested the Blue Gear for many hours hoping it would be a winner. It sort of made my arm sore.. and I never won a set playing with it. I could not wait to cut it out.
     
  21. Bmr

    Bmr Rookie

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    Steve,

    Yep...that was pretty much the same experience I had with it. I remember everyone was raving about Pro Supex for awhile there but I never really got into it.

    I'm really hoping that one of these strings i'm playtesting will dethrone the Polylon SP. Really i'm just looking for the right feel and then start messing with the tension to see where the happy medium is.
     
  22. TenFanLA

    TenFanLA Hall of Fame

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    Just received my BHB7 16g reel. Gonna go string up one of my rackets now. Even though it's 7-sided it looks and feels more like 4-sided a la Tour Bite.
     
  23. dre

    dre New User

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    why did you go with the 16g vs 17g ?
    I'm looking forward to your review.
     
  24. tennisinoc

    tennisinoc Semi-Pro

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    I have read that BHB7 is more springy vs. BE5.
    What kind of "springy" are we talking about?
    (ie. like a multi, gut, synth gut, etc.?)
    From the many Polys that i have tried, Poly and springy would not be in a description of how a Poly plays to me.
    I feel Polys play more Dead and muted than any type of the other string types mentioned. I'm confused about this "Springy" description.
    Can someone please explain this better? Thanks.
     
  25. Bmr

    Bmr Rookie

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    First hit impressions...

    Ok boys and girls- had my first hit with the BHBR16 tonight. Started off volleying at the net to warm up. I remember being pleasantly surprised with the feel, depth and touch I was getting with this string. I definitely give the edge to this string over the SP in that department. My hope is that this would also carry through into the groundies.

    First, I started off with a few forehands. I noticed that this string felt less springy (trampoline effect) than the Polylon SP, but still crisp. The ball was definitely landing a bit short, but I think it was exacerbated by the fact that this string doesn't produce as much kick on the groundies as the SP. This also allowed me to hit a flatter shot, which I was lacking on the SP. This is not to say that you can't produce a lot of spin...it is just not as pronounced as the Gosen. I also noticed that while you are more prone to wild shots with the SP, groundies will often have so much spin and land in even when you think they are going out. While the BHBR16 could produce similar spin, I definitely was a few inches out on shots that I normally land in. That could just be more of an adjustment on my part though, and also messing around with tensions a bit.

    Second, my backhand. Woah...this totally fixed by issue with too much spin. I was able to flatten out the shots and hit with a lot more consistency. Also, the slice was incredible with this string. I kept it low and it really dug into the court. Very happy with the backhand side.

    Now... serving. This string definitely has a different feel to it vs. the Polylon SP and you can really notice when serving. It seems to grab the string more instead of having a massive slippery effect with the SP. That meant I was able to hit harder, flatter serves with more consistency...but also meant that my second serve did not give my opponents nearly as much trouble as it does with the SP. The kick I get off my serve and groundies with the SP is amazing. I still haven't found a string that matches it. It is so unpredictable and so wild with the way it kicks that many people have trouble getting a good read on it.

    I have yet to test the Tour Bite and BHB7, but in a perfect world I could find a string that has the best qualities I like while still maintaining a good serve and volley option.

    Overall, I would say that the feel the BHBR gives you is fantastic and it is definitely a top runner as a replacement for me at this point. Compared to the Luxilon ALU Power Rough, it may be a little softer but I can definitely see similarities between the two strings. At at the cost of the Tourna option, you definitely have a no brainer there.
     
  26. TenFanLA

    TenFanLA Hall of Fame

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    I went with 16g because usually Tourna's 16g = 1.25mm which is 17g for most companies. I use 100" 16x19, fairly powerful MG Rad Pro so I need more control over more power.
     
  27. TenFanLA

    TenFanLA Hall of Fame

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    Mini-1st hit review with BHB7 16g at 52lbs full bed

    I usually wait 24 hours after stringing to hit with the racket but I had to run out there to play an hour of doubles. As far as stringing and appearance, BHB7 is what I call "Cyclo Bite." It has the feel and the coating of Cyclone and the rectangular shape of Tour Bite. It's a hassle to string like Tour Bite. But not a big deal if the string plays great...

    Ran out on to the court and could tell right away this was a "springy" type of poly like Cyclone, BHBR, etc. as opposed to firm polys like ALU, B5E. After the 1st hit I could tell BHB7 is a SPIN MACHINE. Kick serves sometimes created comical kicks where the ball would suddenly hop well over my opponent's outstretched backhand. Slice serves were wicked. Flat serves had good power.

    Groundstrokes were a blast. I could hit with as much spin as I pleased, from relatively little to Djokovic to Nadal type of ridiculous topspin. My opponents had a really hard time catching and timing the ball with their 1HBH. BHB7 is stiffer and a little harder on the arm than BHBR. BHB7 allowed me to hit screaming flat FH's more easily and consistently than BHBR did.

    The weakness: volleys, lobs, some touch shots. Blocking back hard passing shots were not bad but digging up heaving topspin shots from my shoelaces were tough because the balls would fly long. The same with defensive lobs and drop shots.

    Bottom line: For topspin, baseline bashers this would be a great string. You can put all sorts of nasty spin on the ball and control it better than with BHBR. BHB7 would go great in a 18x20 players racket. For S&V and doubles players it is not the ideal string. Also 16x19 powerful rackets may be too much with BHB7. If I used 18x20 lower powered Rad MP I'd go with BHB7. But with my 16x19 Rad Pro, B5E/Nvy gives me the right amount of controlled power and confidence in a real match situation. I will carry 2 sticks with B5E/Nvy, and 1 with BHB7 for slow conditions or if I meet a pusher.
     
  28. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    @ BMR - good read. BHBR is such a unique string. Nothing like it on the market in my opinion, certainly not in terms of the amount of movement it generates on the ball, unpredictable trajectories off the bounce etc. You'll probably find that as it stretches and loses tension that control suffers a bit. It's one of those strings that as it loses tension you might take a fraction off the pace, rather than rip 70mph forehands, and instead let the string do its thing in terms of the disruption it causes to opponents. Its' hard to describe, but you'll see over time, particularly if you ask for feedback from opponent and look at their increased UE count.

    @ TenFan. Good feedback TF. I recall that you usually string as lowish tensions. I think its springier the lower the tension. What tension did you string at? Are you planning to increase the tension a bit with the next string job?
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2012
  29. TenFanLA

    TenFanLA Hall of Fame

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    I went 52lbs full bed. I may go 55 or 57 but hitting with 52 an hour off the stringer is probably similar to 55 after 24 hours. So I might have to go 57lbs. But for doubles where I hit a LOT of volleys and defensive lobs I like the firm, very predictable bed of B5E/Nvy. I'll probably also try out LTec 0S/4S next week. Yes, I'm a fool. There is a sucker born every minute. But who knows...
     
  30. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    Nothing foolish about a string that defies the laws of molecular chemistry, the laws of physics, never goes never dead, outperforms every other single string on the market, and plays just as well in hour 30 (without any degradation of performance) as it does in hour 1!
     
  31. Bmr

    Bmr Rookie

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    Torres-

    What would you say the biggest notable difference is between BHBR and BHB7? The more I hit with the BHBR last night, the more I realized that you can flatten out your shot *and* hit with spin if you wanted to; however, I had to slightly modify my swing a bit to generate the extra kick.

    How would you compare the two when you are volleying? I have a feeling the BHBR may be the better of two when it comes to touch, depth and placement of the ball. I was feeling kinda giddy hitting some of those volleys and putting the ball pretty much wherever I wanted. I had no idea that the SP was that bad. The ball just seems to trampoline off the racquet too much and this makes touch shots and lobs very difficult for me. If the BHB7 is pretty close to the BHBR and it gives me more of the kick action that I want, then that may be the string for me. Only time will tell. I'll report on the BHB7 next week when I have a chance to string up another racquet. I'll also report on the Tour Bite as I am very interested to see how it fares.

    Almost forgot...in a full bed the BHBR felt pretty comfortable on my arm. I didn't notice any kind of problems from the hitting session. Between the BHBR and the SP, but sure if one was more comfortable than the other...maybe give the nod to BHBR just because of the lower tension.
     
  32. Cfidave

    Cfidave Professional

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    Been an avid fan of BHBR for a while now, but decided to try the new miracle string. Went with Ltec OS mains and Ltec 3s crosses at 44/47, strung using the simplified JET method, which is basically very slow pulling and 5-10 second wait, before clamping ( using an electronic constant pull machine).

    The Ltec bed felt good, in all respects: spin, power, touch, were all above average. Comfort was also good for full bed of poly. Compared to the BHBR it offered no significant advantages, in terms of playability. I would even say the BHBR seem to pocket the ball better, and offer a tad more control. As far as it lasting 30 hours, I will never know , as I very much doubt I will keep it in the racquet that long.
     
  33. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    The two biggest noticeable differences I would say would be:-

    1. The spin generated by BHB7 is much more in a forward rotational direction. You can hit a heavier ball in terms of the ball rotating forwards and skipping or jumping forwards off the bounce. BHBR generates more side to side action and unpredictable lateral trajectories off the bounce. In that sense, BHB7 is more predictable and directionally accurate than BHBR but BHBR is more unpredictable for opponents and disruptive to their rhythm and timing off the bounce and the position which the ball takes in the air.

    2. BHB7 maintains its performance levels noticeably longer than BHBR. BHBR is amazing in the first hour or so. Pretty good in hours 2 and 3, but after that there's a gradual loss of control as the string stretches and loses tension. Due to their inherent elasticity, I prefer both strings fairly tight. I am 100% convinced that the best gauge of BHBR is 16 (rather than 17) for any racquet including smaller headed, closed pattern sticks. Haven't come to a universal view yet for BHB7 in terms of 16 or 17.

    Personally, I don't think either are the best polys for volleying as they're a bit springier than is ideal for volleys. That said, the 16s are better as they're slightly stiffer, and stringing the stringbed up fairly tight also improves volleys without it being detrimental to groundstrokes. If you have time for volleys, then fine, but if you're having the ball nailed at you, you can often find yourself volleying quite flat and you don't want a springy stringbed in that situation.
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2012
  34. mikeler

    mikeler G.O.A.T.

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    Finally an LTec comparison with a popular poly!
     
  35. mixedmedia

    mixedmedia Professional

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    I was thinking the same thing. Thank you!
     
  36. TenFanLA

    TenFanLA Hall of Fame

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    Cf, what is your playing level and style? What racket do you use? I noticed that a couple of highly advanced players (Arches3 and GoSurfBoy) really liked LTec A LOT. But they were playing with 0S/4S which according to John Youngblood are suitable for high level, hard hitters who look for control as #1 criterion. I believe another player, Levy, used the same/similar setup as yours and also liked it very much. I suspect that your playing level/style are similar.

    Personally I like BHB7 over BHBR due to better directional control and consistency, and I like B5E/Nvy over BHB7 for doubles play for the same reason. So I think the player's level, style and the corresponding LTec setup may have a lot to do with how much they like LTec. From the limited number of data (posts) it seems that the more advanced the player, the more benefit they derive from LTec. I am getting some 0S/4S early next week and testing it out. At ~4.5 I'll see how it works for me. It could be that LTec does not benefit a player at my level. I hope that's not the case but we shall see...
     
  37. Cfidave

    Cfidave Professional

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    Ten fan, I am a solid 4.5 using a Head Youtec Prestige Pro. I am an aggresive baseliner for the most part, strong forehand, one handed backhand, fairly big serve. I think my expectations were a bit too high on the Ltec strings, due to all the hype. When I compare the Ltec setup to BHBR, I just don't see any one area that they (Ltec) out performs the latter. if both strings cost the same, I would choose BHBR. This of course, excludes the possible longevity advantage that Ltec may or may not have.
     
  38. spillai

    spillai Rookie

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    Stick: K Zen Team with added lead tape
    Usual String Setup: SPPP
    Setup: full Bed at 52
    I realized after playing that these strings would be better at a higher tension such as 55.

    Stringing: Stringing went very easy.Weaving was easier than SPPP because it is not as soft.

    Groundies:
    I thought that on ground strokes, the spin was incredible. I hit multiple balls that would usually go out, but they always dropped just in! I could hit as hard as I wanted. 9/10

    Serves:
    Agree with previous posters, this string is not for flat serves. I couldn't generate much power and get it in at the same time on my flat serves. The spin serves had monster kick! 8/10

    Volleys:
    Volleys were very nice with this string. I was able to really control them. Touch volleys were also easy with these strings. 9/10

    Feel:
    BHB7 is pretty soft compared to the SPPP. Nothing to really complain about in feel. 9/10

    Durability:
    I have about 20 hours on this string at the moment. No complaints. 9/10

    Overall: 8.75/10 Great string. However, I think I will use SPPP instead. I like the softer string that also allows me to hit with more power.
    __________________
     
  39. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    There's no issue with flat serves and this string. I really don't know whether some posters are feeling under pressure to agree with someone else but there's no issue with flat serves. How can power be fine for groundstrokes but then you say you can't generate any power on the serve? It's not like you've suddenly swapped strings between hitting groundstrokes and hitting serves. If you can't hit flat serves well with this string, there's something off with your technique.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2012
  40. SteveI

    SteveI Legend

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    Hi Torres,

    I think my issue with hitting effective flat serves with BHB7 17G is related to my frame being strung a bit too tight. To try to generate more power, I believe I was over-swinging on the serve.. ie trying to muscle the ball. This reduced my power even more and caused more faults. When I get another reel in and have the chance to test the string at a lower tension, I will report my results. I still have the string in my frame, but it is no where near fresh. I think for my game and frame, I should be about 50 #s. I was 55 #s. I am pretty sure I can drop the tension and still have great control and power off the ground. Reducing the tension should also improve feel and comfort.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2012
  41. spillai

    spillai Rookie

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    I would have to disagree. I'm using the same technique if not better than I did with the BHBR. I just feel its harder than normal to hit a fast flat serve. Sorry if you don't agree
     
  42. Bmr

    Bmr Rookie

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    I played a bit more with the BHBR over the weekend. I noticed that a lot of the forehands that I did not hit completely were landing ~ 6 inches out. I definitely had a lot more leeway with the other string..so my confidence was not as high as it usually is. I hope to test the Tour Bite and BHB7 side by side this week and i'll give you guys a rundown (if it stops raining).
     
  43. SteveI

    SteveI Legend

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    When I was testing the BHB7.. My control was excellent, spin was tight and predictable. BHB7 over BHBR for me. While I got a higher bounce with the BHBR..I almost never missed with the BHB7. My next reel is BHB7. I might test the 16G over the 17G before I order...anyone played both??? I will be using the string in a 100 16 x 19..

    Thanks.
     
  44. kiteboard

    kiteboard Hall of Fame

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    I have and have also hybrid them with bhb7 mains, bhbr as cross together. Lot of spin/power and control. Twisted strings are better used as crosses than as mains.
     
  45. SteveI

    SteveI Legend

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    Thanks.. I will give that one a try. Did you use 17G for both?
     
  46. TenFanLA

    TenFanLA Hall of Fame

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    I also prefer BHB7 over BHBR due to better control. I have only used BHB7 in 16g in my 100", 16x19 MG Rad Pro and I personally wouldn't want to go to 17g because 16g is pretty much 1.25mm which is usually a 17g.
     
  47. Torres

    Torres Banned

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    That's BHBR down to a tee. Provided you've strung it at a sufficiently high tension, it's sensational during the first couple of hours - there really is no other string like it. After that there's a gradual loss of control whether due to tension loss or the string stretching and becoming more elastic. It is a string that's more suited to control sticks.

    Whilst I'm not necessarily advocating this, taking a fraction off the pace during hours 2+ and letting the string do 'do its thing' does yield results in that you still get the spin and disruptive action on the ball. But I agree with you to the extent after the first 2-3 hours, its a not a 'fire and forget' string and unlike some polys its not something to use if you want to hit with abandon - you really would need a stiffer, more low powered string for that.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2012
  48. Bmr

    Bmr Rookie

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    Aug 11, 2006
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    304
    Torres,

    Yep..i'm starting to think it might be a little bit too much for my frame. However, the backhand and volleys are fantastic. I definitely can't hit out on the forehand like i'm used to. Of course raising tension a couple pounds could take care of that.

    Really excited to see the results from the BHB7 and the Tour Bite. I'll string em up early this week and try to hit on Wednesday or Thursday. I am going to try and keep the tensions consistent though so I can get an accurate gauge of what's going on with the string.
     
  49. Torres

    Torres Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2011
    Messages:
    4,766
    ^ I think you'll need different tensions for each string because they're different, particularly in terms of elasticity. BHBR is the most elastic so that should be at the highest tension, then it would be BHB7, then Tour Bite.

    My racquets (BLX 6.1 95/18x20) go something like this:

    BHBR 16 54-55lbs CP
    BHB7 17 53-54 CP
    TourBite 1.20 52 CP

    Obviously, you would need to tailor and experiment with tensions to find the the optimum setup for your circumstances.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2012
  50. Bmr

    Bmr Rookie

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2006
    Messages:
    304
    FYI, here's a good thread on Tour Bite as well. I'm going to see how hard it is on the arm compared to BHB7.

    Torres,

    I'm really tempted to give BHBR a shot on a Wilson 95 BLX demo. Have you hit with the new line yet?
     

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