USA's future dirtballer?

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by johnny ballgame, Apr 14, 2008.

  1. johnny ballgame

    johnny ballgame Professional

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    15-year old Ryan Harrison qualifies for main draw at Houston clay courts?

    Apologies if already posted.
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2008
    #1
  2. vandre

    vandre Hall of Fame

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    hotdog! we just might have one in the hopper after all!

    that's cool! but let's remember to give him some time before we anoint him the second coming of chang or something!
     
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  3. edmondsm

    edmondsm Legend

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    Yeah lets not pull another Donald Young here. The kid is 15 and talented, let's leave it at that. Although I think he will win the French Open this year.:)
     
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  4. tacou

    tacou Legend

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    won his opening round as well.
     
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  5. Hank Hill

    Hank Hill New User

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    nice win in str8 sets over Cuevas - not sure how the clay at Houston compares to the euro red stuff though - either way a great result for him.
     
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  6. flyer

    flyer Hall of Fame

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    hahahahahhaha, great stuff
     
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  7. A.Davidson

    A.Davidson Semi-Pro

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    Good for him - any videos of him anywhere?
     
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  8. strife726

    strife726 Rookie

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    isn't this the tourney clay court expert Roddick won 3 times?
     
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  9. guernica1

    guernica1 Semi-Pro

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    Different club but yeah, I don't think its quite the same as Europe.

    I'm very surprised by the Cuevas win; Cuevas reached the semi's of a South American ATP event a couple months ago beating the likes of Acasuso on the way.

    Wish I had stayed to watch Ryan's qualifying match yesterday but best of luck to him the rest of the way. One thing is for sure whoever he plays in the next round is going to take him very seriously.
     
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  10. edmondsm

    edmondsm Legend

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    Houston is a place where Americans can play some matches on clay and earn some points, before going and getting humiliated in Europe.
     
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  11. Moose Malloy

    Moose Malloy Legend

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    HOUSTON (AP)—Fifteen-year-old Ryan Harrison beat Pablo Cuevas of Uruguay 6-4, 6-3 in the U.S. Clay Court Championship on Monday to become the 10th player in the Open Era to win a main-draw match before his 16th birthday.

    The Texan is also the youngest player to get a main-draw win on the ATP Tour since Rafael Nadal, the current No. 2 in the world, won his first tour match in Mallorca in 2002, and the third player this decade to do it before his 16th birthday.

    Richard Gasquet of France was 15 when he won his first match in Monte Carlo in 2002.

    Harrison, who will turn 16 on May 7, won 17 of 18 points during one stretch of the first set. He closed out the set on his first opportunity by breaking Cuevas’ serve at 15. In the second set, he faced only one break point.

    He broke the South American, who is ranked 95th in the world, in the fourth game of the final set and closed out the match on four straight points— including an ace to open his service game. He yelled, “Yeah” and pumped his fists a few times while looking toward his family in the crowd.

    “You always want to feel like you can win,” Harrison told the crowd after the victory. “To go out and make it happen is another thing.”

    A short time later, he admitted he hasn’t yet grasped the significance of his win.

    “I’m pretty sure when I get alone by myself later, probably just laying around the hotel, it’ll really kind of sink in what’s happened,” the teenager said. “Hopefully, I can keep it going.”

    Next up could be top-seeded James Blake, who plays wildcard entry Kei Nishikori of Japan in a first-round match scheduled for Wednesday night.

    Harrison, who grew up in Shreveport, La., and started playing when he was 2, is coached by his father, Pat Harrison, a pro in New Braunfels, Texas, who moved his family to the Lone Star State four years ago because of tennis. The younger Harrison is ranked No. 7 in the world in juniors.

    He entered the match Monday ranked No. 1,277 in men’s world rankings and was expected to improve that to about No. 704.

    “It gives you a wake-up call that you can play that level,” Harrison said. “Whenever you actually make something happen like that you feel like, ‘I can do this.”’
     
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  12. Djokovicfan4life

    Djokovicfan4life Legend

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    Unless clay courts become the standard in America, we won't have a "future dirtballer".

    You're good on the surfaces that you're accustomed to. Period.
     
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  13. guernica1

    guernica1 Semi-Pro

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    I think only a couple of the boys who've won an ATP match before age 16 never really panned out; Franco Davin, Gaudio's old coach comes to mind. All of them reached at least top 100 I believe, which of course is still an incredible accomplishment athletically.

    Most of the guys who have won before 16 on the ATP end up becoming stars. Best of luck to him going forward.
     
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  14. crawl4

    crawl4 Rookie

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    thats crazy:shock:
    will be interesting to see how he goes if he versus blake
     
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  15. schaefferm46

    schaefferm46 Rookie

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    its interesting that he had his first big win on clay. He is a very aggressive player, almost serve and volley. great win
     
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  16. Forehand Forever

    Forehand Forever Professional

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    Possible Blake match up for the next round. Someone put that match on YouTube.
     
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  17. Klatu Verata Necktie

    Klatu Verata Necktie Hall of Fame

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    How big is Ryan?
     
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  18. schaefferm46

    schaefferm46 Rookie

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    #18
  19. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    Yeah it'd be great if you had a clue what you were talking about. Were Courier and Chang not good on clay? Agassi was pretty good on the stuff too. There are countless foreigners who grow up on clay and are actually better on hard courts. Del Potro comes to mind.

    Often times a player's style will dictate his success on a particular surface, not simply what he or she grew up on.
     
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  20. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    So true, but Roddick did beat Grosjean years ago, and that's a guy who can give you plenty of trouble on clay.
     
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  21. daddy

    daddy Legend

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    Well many more come to mind. Maybe even Federer, but more notably Djokovic. Nalbandian is a good clay courter but for a guy who grew up on clay he surely had the best results on other surfaces.
     
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  22. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    Seems odd that Del Potro came to mind before those guys, but you're right.
     
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  23. Djokovicfan4life

    Djokovicfan4life Legend

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    Fair enough, I may not know very much about clay, but Agassi, Courier, and Chang were in an entirely different league than guys like Ginepri and Young. I do know that.
     
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  24. NLBwell

    NLBwell Legend

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    Most all the big tennis academies have some clay courts - green and red - and there are a lot of clay courts throughout the US. No reason a US player couldn't be a clay courter, since a lot of kids do grow up on clay at the clubs they play at. Its just that the percentages are against it.
     
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  25. Leelord337

    Leelord337 Hall of Fame

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  26. Chauvalito

    Chauvalito Hall of Fame

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    The Newcombe tennis ranch where Harrison trains has clay courts (synthetic)
     
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  27. flyer

    flyer Hall of Fame

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    Seems that he is almost a serve and volleyer, so its interesting/telling that he beat a top 100 claycourter on clay, does he have wheels? apparently his brother is more of a baseliner than he
     
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  28. Morrissey

    Morrissey Guest

    I think the only way to make an American a serious dirtballer is the send him to Europe to train and hone his skills on the dirt, maybe even get some coaching in Spain. I don't think any American can train someone to be a natural dirtballer. It's like second nature. If you want to make your kid a world class footballer you send him to Europe. Same goes for being a world class dirt baller.
     
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  29. Rob_C

    Rob_C Hall of Fame

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    From that clip, he doesn't leave the ground on his serve. Definitely unusual, especially since he apparently gets a lot of pace.
     
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  30. superman1

    superman1 Legend

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    Courier and Chang were natural movers on the clay, but Agassi wasn't. He just played on clay like it was a hard court, and it worked out pretty well for him. In the end it's still hitting a ball with a racquet, and if you can hit the ball well enough, you can make it on any surface. You get more time to set up, which is good, and your opponent also gets more time, but if you're like Agassi then you enjoy that aspect of it because it means your opponent has to run a lot more.

    If only Blake had an ounce of patience, he could actually make a decent claycourter.
     
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  31. IAMLegend

    IAMLegend Rookie

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    All these Brazilians and Argentinians superstars may have something different to say about that (as far as football).
     
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  32. daddy

    daddy Legend

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    If clay was only about patience....

    Anyways Agassi is a whole different league/ his strokes were the cleanest and his game style is baseline exchange so with consistancy and shotmaking of both wings, with excelent retern of serve and return game overall, with contructing his points to perfection and with not the fastest serve ever - he is as close as hard court guy can be to a clay court player.
     
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  33. tintin

    tintin Professional

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    well it's not but he's got to get to the 2nd round in Paris first before we crown him.
    Spadea, and the guy who lost to Roger last year showed they can both play on clay.I think out the Isner/Querrey/Young;Donald might be the one who;if he's serious about his tennis and doesn't have the hard court way is the way to play tennis on all surfaces mentality and puts his relunctance to fall and get his socks dirty;expect to be a rally for 2-3 minutes and if he's willing to learn ;he will be the better player out of the group
    Guys like Isner and querrey who are 1 dimentional;horrible movers and no endurance should skip the upcoming weeks and play at Wimbledon.
     
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  34. slice bh compliment

    slice bh compliment G.O.A.T.

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    Yeah, impressive kids, these Harrison boys.

    Funny, though, in the last rd of qualies, Ryan Harrison beat a guy I played like 15 or 16 years ago. Alex Reichel...who's got to be at least 36 by now.

    I'd love to see him play either Blake or Nishikori in the 2nd rd of the main.
     
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  35. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    Agreed because his game isn't so different from Agassi, except he has better wheels. He doesn't have the stroke consistency of Agassi, but if Blake were more patient he could do well on clay surely.

    I think American players need to train more on clay. It seems like dirt ballers have an easier time of doing well on hard courts than vice versa, despite the success of Agassi, Chang, and Courier.
     
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  36. johnny ballgame

    johnny ballgame Professional

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    Roddick also beat Chang at RG.
     
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  37. el sergento

    el sergento Hall of Fame

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    What's even more interesting is that his left foot comes forward off the serve and not the right foot which is the more traditional way. He gets some air off the left foot, hops slightly and then comes down about a foot into the court with the same left foot.

    U can see it better on this vid:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sUQg8TAJB-s
     
    #37
  38. el sergento

    el sergento Hall of Fame

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    Agassi, Chang, and Courier were all brought up on clay and were expected to break through at RG before any other tournaments. That's why everyone was surprised by Agassi's Wimbledon title.
     
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  39. Alexio92

    Alexio92 Professional

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    Anyone know if he has a juniortennis.com profile?
     
    #39
  40. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    They were brought up on clay? I didn't know that. How so?
     
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  41. Morrissey

    Morrissey Guest

    Blake needs more than just patience. Agassi was a different animal. He was such a great baseliner off both wings, he also constructed points very well, he didn't always go for broke like Blake does on every shot. Agassi mixed up medium pace, with angles, spin, drop shots and then outright pace. But he didn't play tennis like a brainless kook. I think his movement on clay was suspect, he always slid after the shot, not into the shot. But everything else made up for it. Blake just bashes every ball he sees and that's his strategy in every match on every point. That is literally it.
     
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  42. Moose Malloy

    Moose Malloy Legend

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    No they weren't. The 80s/early 90s were just a different time than now, much less specialization. Doing well on hardcourts & doing well on claycourts weren't mutually excusive(just look up Lendl & Wilander's records on hardcourt & clay)

    If you were a great player that was a baseliner, you were automatically considered a threat for the French, regardless of what surface you grew up on, & Chang, Agassi, proved that theory right.

    Sergi Bruguera was the player that really changed the way the French was viewed, he was the 1st true specialist to win the French, so top players now became more concerned with playing more on clay in order to be ready for the FO, while before many had a much shorter claycourt schedule because they thought they didn't need to play a lot on clay to be ready for the French.

    And then the consistently poor showings by Americans at the French began in the mid 90s(I know Agassi won it in '99, but if you look at '98,'97, I think all the americans in the draw lost before the 4th round, it was already apparent that they could now no longer compete with so many specialists that grew up on clay)

    Its kinda funny, but the opposite was true of the specialists in the 90s. There were hardly any hardcourts in Spain until the '92 Olympics, & hardly any did well on hardcourts for a very long time. Then the new generation that actually trained on hardcourts(Moya, etc) started doing well on hardcourts, now all the claycourters are pretty darn good on hard.

    It will be hard to change the landscape of US tennis, it would be quite expensive to add so many claycourts here, the sport just doesn't attract that many young players here, so what would be the point? Just so the US can someday do well at the French again, which no one watches here anyway? It's all about Wimbledon & the USO here, always has & always will be, & the US seems to do fine at both events still.
     
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  43. stormholloway

    stormholloway Legend

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    Doesn't this have a lot to do with patience?
     
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  44. GRANITECHIEF

    GRANITECHIEF Hall of Fame

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    I like how he tried to set up this point by bashing the drop shot. Didn't quite work that time.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGFCyu2coso
     
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  45. Morrissey

    Morrissey Guest

    Haha! If there's ever a guy who can bash a dropshot it's Blake.
     
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  46. Morrissey

    Morrissey Guest

    Agassi did things differently than Blake. He's comparing the both of them when he shouldn't. Agassi did well on clay because he used variety, as well as patience. Blake doesn't do anything that Agassi did, except hit the clean forehand. But Agassi played smarter, with more variety and patience on top of that. Blake just hits every ball hard with not much purpose.
     
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  47. el sergento

    el sergento Hall of Fame

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    I can't find any sources (I'm sure someone else can), but Courrier in particular has spoken about learning to play on clay as for Agassi in a documentary I saw they spoke about how the Courrier/Chang/Agassi generation developed on Clay as opposed to Sampras developing on his own and barely playing any junior tennis.

    It's pretty self evident though, who are the last 3 Americans to win the French?? Chang, Courrier and Aggasi.

    Even if they weren't brought up as pure Claycourters, like the Spanish armada of the 90's, they undoubtedly played their fair amount on clay during their developing years.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2008
    #47
  48. daddy

    daddy Legend

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    Didnt't people train a lot on clay in Boletieri's accademy? Someone on this very board presented me with some evidence on this, and I thougt pretty much like you do - that US players rarely play on clay before they hit a european clay season after they become pro's.
     
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  49. jgreen06

    jgreen06 Rookie

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    #49
  50. 35ft6

    35ft6 Legend

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    He looks pretty loose on the serve and forehand. Bodes well for him. Don't see technique limiting him in those areas. Looks like he'll be able to develop some major power.
     
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