Vortex Extreme Spin Rackets

Discussion in 'Racquets' started by BlaackSheeep, Dec 29, 2009.

  1. 000KFACTOR90000

    000KFACTOR90000 Professional

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    No need to apologize, you didn't sound rude - I was just trying to correct the miscommunication. All good :)




    I'm looking forward to seeing this stick in action sometime !!
     
  2. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    I just found out that a wta player from panama who plated Fed cup played with the 108. Her name I belle hilton. I don't know what her maiden name was.
     
  3. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    I didn't know that.

    Why did Tom tell you to shorten the stick? It's gonna change the whe balance of the frame.
     
  4. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    Tlm,

    th racquet comes with this weird vibration dampener. I thought it was just decoration but it turns out to be a real dampener that works pretty well.....don't toss it
     
  5. tlm

    tlm Legend

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    Just got home from the courts, the vortex played much better with the fxp multi at 70 lbs. instead of the poly that came with it at 65lbs. which was way to powerful.

    This racket does have my interest now,i could hit out+keep the ball in the court pretty well.The best thing so far was my backhand slice it was much better than with any racket i have used.

    The topsin backhand seemed better also.My forehand seemed about the same as with my kobra, maybe a little more jump.

    It was funny i could hit my looping heavy topspin forehand about the same as normal,but i could also flatten it out really well also.I was surprised at how well i could hit fast flat forehands with good control.

    As far as serve goes it was about the same as normal with a little more spin.The return of serve seemed much better+easier.

    When i ordered the racket Tom suggested to shorten it by a half inch.He also said that when they do that they add some weight to the handle to compensate for what they cut off.

    I told him that would be fine because i dont want the racket any lighter than what it is.Then i noticed on the billing that it said add weight to head.I looked+sure enough they mistakenly put the lead tape under the bumper guard on top.

    I am going to cut the strings out so i can remove the lead tape on top.I will then add it to the handle were it belongs.I never like tape on top of my rackets because it always makes them more powerful. This racket does not need more power.

    So i am interested in this racket+i will see how well it plays after getting the weight correct+string.
     
  6. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    Hey Tim,

    I'm really glad you are interested in it . I thought you were going to hate it. There is a slight learning curve and you are already comfy with the kobra so it will take a little time to appreciate the vortex

    Why did Tom tell you to shorten it? Maybe to lessen the power?

    I am no one to Argue with Tom but what I LOVE about the stick is how headlight it is and how maneuverable it is. Adding lead to the head is a big mistake in my opinion . I completely agree with you.

    It took me about 5 or 6 sets to really appreciate the stick. I like to serve and volley and shots I never got to before I was now able to volley for winners .

    In my opinion there were three reasons for this :



    1- shots hit at ones feet when at the nemust be volleyed with the top of a racquet. Conventional racquet
    are very tight near the top and there is very little power there. The vortex on the other hand is the oposite. It's very loose at the top and quite powerful. It's like hitting the sweet spot on a conventional stick.


    2- it's really head light and very maneuvarable.

    3. It's longer than most racquets an I can physically reach for more balls. I can barely get a racquet on it And I can still hit a winner.

    Having said all that you are a baseliner and hit a completely different shot than I do . I need the power from the baseline and you don't . So we may have completely different experiences . But I can tell you that as a serve and volleyer I LOVE this stick and I would not shorten it.

    Adding weight to the handle as you suggested makes a whole lot of sense of you are shortening

    I tried many different string in this stick, I LOVE this string called Pro Supex blue gear at 60 pounds .You will not believe the spin. It almost automatically gives you topspin. I HIGHLY reccomend it.

    Also keep in mind that in a week your strings will play completely differently. The blue gear seems to get better the longer it's in the racquet and it never breaks.

    Anyway, I am looking forward to your review big time. Coming from someone who has the complete opposite game from me I am very interested in what you have to say.

    I will definitely stay tuned for your review!!

    Cheers.
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2010
  7. tailofdog

    tailofdog Semi-Pro

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    Faith

    It gives me FAITH that they also do some frame modification at their warehouse and have a sense of racquet balance.
    I am really wondering if they will ever bring up the reasons for the thick frames and the other innovations outside the string pattern?
     
  8. tlm

    tlm Legend

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    I cut out the strings so i could remove the bumper guard in order to get rid of the lead tape.They put in 5 grams of lead on the top, what a mistake.I never like weight on the head.They screwed up + put the weight in the wrong location.

    So i put 8 grams of lead in the handle, which makes it feel much better.It weighs just a few grams more than what it did, but it is now 10 points headlight.

    I will get a chance to hit with it again tomorrow,it should have better control with the lead removed from the head of the racket.

    As far as your question murray mound, Tom did suggest to shorten it to improve control.As far as were they added the weight that was a mistake, Tom said they would put it in the handle.

    You are correct having a racket more headlight does improve maneuverability.But being longer does not, it actually makes it less maneuverable.Remember also that we are only talking about one half inch.
     
  9. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    I just got my ars kicked with the vortex so I'm not a happy camper.....

    But I still made some
    incredible volleys that I never could do before. best volleys of my life....it wasnt the racquets fault.
     
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2010
  10. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    Syed again last night and this time I was unstoppable .

    I may have hit the greatest shot of my life for a winner last night. I still can't believe I did that!

    That's what I'm finding with this stick. Your normal everyday bread amd butter topspin ground stroke mat sail out at first. But your desperation hail Mary shots go in for winners.

    That's what the learning curve is for me with this stick. I have to tale some power off my topspin forehand but for eberything else this stick is simply unbelievable.

    I think Tim & Tom may have been right all along. I think I possibly should have shortened the stick for more control.

    Bottom line: this stick is awesome for most shots and it's my current favorite stick on the market.
     
  11. tlm

    tlm Legend

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    I agree with what you are saying murray mound.There is some magic to this racket, but i dont know if i can get enough control out of it.
    I have been trying different string jobs to see if i can tone it down enough.
     
  12. tailofdog

    tailofdog Semi-Pro

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    The Thought Is Good

    I always look at the specs to get a feel for what a racquet does and the light weight and thick beam may not scream no control but, they at least wisper it!
     
  13. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    Pro supex big ace 16 guage. Trust me.

    I personally use pro supex blue hear for the outrageous amount of spin. But the big axe has more control and will probably suit you better.
     
  14. tlm

    tlm Legend

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    I am trying to stay away from poly, but i might have to try some to make this racket play with more control.
    I just put in pro supex maxim touch, which usually has real good control.Hopefully it will tone it down some.
     
  15. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    I never tried that one. So why dont you try the strings that come with the racquet? They are multi in the crosses....why not just string the whole racquet with the Vortex Multi?
     
  16. tlm

    tlm Legend

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    The racket i received came with full poly.I know about a lot of different strings. So why would i try a string i never tried?
     
  17. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    why not? I find that when I keep doing the same things things I will get the same results.

    It came with a full poly? Are you sure? Normally it comes with a hybrid. The two strings look almost exactly the same. The only way to tell is by actually feeling. The multi feels softer.
     
  18. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    I looked at the site and like many things on the site its not correct. it does say it comes with a full poly string job but i dont believe thats accdurate.

    in the past I have spoke to Tom and he reccomends the hybrid....but I have also tried simply a full vortex string multi job.

    He sells the vortex hybrid string job. The multi comes in both 16 and 15 guage....see below:

    http://store.vortextennis.com//pindex.asp
     
  19. tlm

    tlm Legend

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    The racket came with full poly.Trying strings that i am familiar with makes good sense. What do you think that their multi is magic or something?

    I am trying strings that i know to be low powered+some new low powered strings that i have never tried before.Every racket plays different so you have to try them with many string jobs to find what works best.

    But i am really starting to think that this racket is to powerful for me.I am not giving up yet i still have more strings to try.But it does not look promising, tom mentioned that they were working on a smaller frame. I hope that it comes out soon.
     
  20. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    It may not be the right racquet for you at all.

    As to why try new strings? Better question is why not? What have you got to lose? Maybe you will be surprised? Worst comes to worst you are in the same position you are now.

    For example the Vortex racquet. It may be all wrong for you. But what have you lost in trying it out? At least it was fun if nothing else.
     
  21. joe sch

    joe sch Hall of Fame

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    I think it really depends on your game ?
    If your a flat more old school hitter than the Vortex maybe too powerful. If you really enjoy spinning then this racket should be even more successful for these weapons. I really like the copoly string at low tension but this requires fast racket head accelleration and bigger strokes to keep the balls in the court with more spin. I would also really like to see a 95 version since I dont like most 100+ rackets but do really like the ES100. For example, I like the donnay pro1 95 but not the OS models.
     
  22. tlm

    tlm Legend

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    How low of tension are you talking about? As far as old school style of play i am anything but. I use western grip + very fast racket head speed with a lot of topspin+rarely come to net.
    I know that you can put extra spin + control some of the power out of a rocket launcher, but only to a degree.
    Plus there are still times you have to just block a ball back any way you can + dont have time to add spin.That is when a granny stick will hinder you.
     
  23. joe sch

    joe sch Hall of Fame

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    "granniy stick" ?

    Its pretty similar to the babs that Nadal uses except with the sparser string pattern for more spin and better frame design. I dont have any trouble using it to block back or slice defensive returns. For lower tenision, I suggest like 50 lbs.
     
  24. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    I don't have any control problems either .

    It's no granny stick . In fact I think you said that the specs are virtually identical to the stick you normally use.

    I agre with Joe .....you should try the vortex co-poly setup. The strings are awesome and meant for the stick. I can't umdersamd why you are so adverse to it......I think you may be pleasently surprised.
     
  25. tlm

    tlm Legend

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    Ya the specs are similar to rafas racket which is also powerful.The vortex is close in specs to the kobra that i am using also.
    The big difference being the open string pattern which obviously makes it a lot more powerful than a racket that has a tighter pattern.
     
  26. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    I guess it has more to do with your style of play and the strings you use . The hybrid multi with the poly at 16 guage for the ES is what I think you should try before forming an opinion.

    These strings were tested out amd made specifically for this racquet. Of you don't at least try them them you really can't form an honest opinion.

    The strings are the "soul" of the racquet. You cannot use your normal strings amd expect them to play exactly the same way in a cometely different am radical racquet.

    plEase try the hybrid and then give is your opinion. If you still feel the 100 is too powerful for you then so be it.

    Be advised the wta professional plays with the stick amd so do many division one players amd a host of national 4.5 players. Again ease try the strings that were made to work with the stick.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2010
  27. joe sch

    joe sch Hall of Fame

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    The strings to try are MSV hex.
    They are a co-poly so not as stiff as poly's.
    The racket plays wonderful strung at 50 lbs.
    I like the thinner guage, like 1.2mm or 17g

    This setup was made for the racket and how I got them and how I restring them.
    Go thicker if you dont want to break them as often.
    They do make a ping sound but the spin is awesome.
    I even prefer no dampener and enjoy that feedback.
     
  28. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    I defer to Joe. The man is an expert.
     
  29. tlm

    tlm Legend

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    I know that the strings can make or break a racket, that is why i am trying many different strings.They sent me the racket with a black poly that looked like msv.
    I thought i was getting this magic hybrid set up that you are talking up so much, even though you have said that blue gear played the best.Tom said he was sending it with their hybrid, but whatever the setup that came with it was it was way to powerful for me.

    I am well aware of msv strings, i was using them 3 years ago.They are nothing special, just another so so copoly.Now you are suggesting 17 gauge msv at 50 lbs. i know that would be a certified rocket launcher.

    They sent the racket with what appeared to be msv+it was at 65lbs.+was way to powerful for my swing style.I am not done yet but it just does not look promising right now.
     
  30. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    The blue gear is right for me. It probably would be wrong for you. It's the most powerful string ever made in my opinion . But I am able to control that power by using a ton of topspin.

    I thought you would like the hybrid strings the best but Joe thought differently. I am defering to Joe as he is the head of woodtennis.com and I respect his opinion.

    Finally although you have tried msv before you hbe not tried it in this particular racquet.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2010
  31. tlm

    tlm Legend

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    Wow now you are saying that blue gear is the
    most powerful string ever made. Blue gear is not powerful at all it is known as a low powered control string.
     
  32. tailofdog

    tailofdog Semi-Pro

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    Using Same Tension

    I have always used 45 to 50lb on all racquets. If a racquet is spraying balls i work on control, If i belive it is a ball GUN i drop the racquet. I have more faith in string than different tension (ISOSPEED ENERGETIC) is a multi with qualities that a good poly has. I find if i feel like playing with tension it, is only because the racquet feels like a board. I have found that if i can not pick up a racquet and feel i like it straight away it usually means it is a DUD! for me
     
  33. joe sch

    joe sch Hall of Fame

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    Im very surprised you got a racket strung at 65lbs. They must have thought you requested a high tension ? Id like to know exactly what hybrid you received ? 50lb rocket launcher ? For me, that tension is a topspin launcher. I must admit I use an eastern grip so when I do hit more flat, the balls still stay in the court. I think you just need a racket with more control so should probably be playing a 16x19 or 18x20 and counter to what this racket is all about. Id recommend one of the youtek models, those are great control player rackets.
     
  34. joe sch

    joe sch Hall of Fame

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    Im pretty much the same. A good racket for me will usually play really well from the start, otherwise its probably not for me. Most modern rackets are too stiff for me.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2010
  35. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    what do you mean by "now"? I have never said they were a low powered string.

    In any event here is a posters review at stringforum.net :

    "This is the most powerful Poly I have ever played with in my entire life. If you have huge strokes this is not the string for you. But if you are looking for a string to give you power then look no further!"

    I don't know who told you that blue gear is a low powered string but I cam tell you from my own person experience that this is the absolute most powerful and most spin producing string I have ever played with in all my life. Inthe other had the feel is not so good.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2010
  36. tailofdog

    tailofdog Semi-Pro

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    70 Ok?

    You find the 70 OK? on the VORTEX? Different racquets play differently. I have a VANTAGE 70 and had a DUNLOP 500 Tour 70 both of which kill body parts but, i used a girls racquet which was a TI 6 reincarnation while she hit with mine and it was ok on comfort but, i know it would have been stiff
     
  37. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    String my vortex at 60. I'm thinking of trying 65 but I'm sting so damn well with it I don't want ti tinker for a while.
     
  38. joe sch

    joe sch Hall of Fame

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    Yes, it does not seem anywhere near 70 to me, actually seems more like 50 rdc, probably because of the string pattern and 50 lb tension.
     
  39. joe sch

    joe sch Hall of Fame

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    I know what you mean about tinkering.
    I hit soo well with these rackets that I thought Id add 1 oz of lead to the throat and it would be even better. Nope, the racket became too powerful. I dropped the lead down to 0.5 oz and it still was not an improvement over the standard setup. This really surprised me since I like 13 to 14 oz rackets usually. I do plan to try some lead inside the grip but have not yet.
     
  40. tlm

    tlm Legend

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    I am still trying different set ups with this racket.I put leoina 66 which i was told was a real low powered string. I tried it at 68 lbs. indoors+it was better but still a little powerful.
    So i put leoina in the mains+head rip control 16 gauge in the crosses at 65lbs. Head rip control can usually tame the power down in any stick.

    It was nice enough to play outside today, so i gave it a try outdoors. All the other times have been indoors.

    This set up outdoors played very well, i had very good control+just the right amount of power.I used it for all but a couple of games, i wanted to use the kobra a little to compare the 2.

    The kobra played well to but not as good as the vortex, i was definitely impressed.I am going to go inside tomorrow night + see if it plays as well.
     
  41. jbleiman

    jbleiman Rookie

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    i've had mine for about 10 days...es116...the jury is still out...it is a beautiful made racquet and has a very plush feel....i've played maybe 6-7 sets with it and there is a learning curve...i think i am getting better playing the racquet...my current racquet is a wilson n3...which i really like...my serve is alittle more powerful with the vortex...my topspin is slightly better with the vortex...my slice-which is my number one shot-forehand and backhand-it seems is better with the n3-i keet it lower and have more bite,although i am improving with the vortex,touch shots-drop shot and lob-amstill more comfortable with the n3...so i will give it the full month and we'll see
     
  42. tlm

    tlm Legend

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    The es 100 that i am using is excellent on the slice backhand, that is where it stands out the most.
     
  43. jbleiman

    jbleiman Rookie

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    i have an excellent slice backhand..it is very good with the vortex just somewhat better with the n3...but as i said i have improved with the vortex so we'll see if i can get it equal to the n3 or surpass it with alittle more playing time
     
  44. jbleiman

    jbleiman Rookie

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    so far i am alittle disappointed that the spin on the vortex doesn't seem any better than the n3..although i will say i get excellent spin from the n3....the control from the vortex is getting closer to the n3 the more i use it
     
  45. jbleiman

    jbleiman Rookie

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    they sent me the racquet strung at 50lbs with their megaspin string..i think the cross is a multi but i'm not sure..if i restring it i might go with gaucho gut at 40lbs
     
  46. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    . How big is your n3? You may need a smaller stick that slices through the air a bit more? You can return the 116 amd switch it for the 108 or the 100. I gotta admit that for me slices and topspin were some of the best shots for me with the stick ....so I am a bit surprised you came to a different conclusion.

    How is your serve and return of serve? That's where I thought the 116 really shined ......But for slices I like a real "knife" the 116 was way to big for me for serious slices. I play with the 100. I think the 108 be better suited for your game. Give a smaller head a try....certainly nothing to lose.
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2010
  47. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    I just looked up the specs of your n3. I see it's 113 and almost 9 points head heavy.

    That's almost the complete opposite of the Vortex as they are about 7-8 points head light.

    I would give the 108 a try strung at 55. Give it a whirl....if it's still not working then I'm afraid vortex cannot beat your trusty n3.

    Just remember how long it took you to find the correct string tension an type for your n3. Your using the "stock" tension which is made for the general public. It was string at 45 amd laying there for quite a while so it's as low as 35.
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2010
  48. tailofdog

    tailofdog Semi-Pro

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    Wonder Wand?

    Is this guys name Tom Olmstead? If so he bought out the old Wonder Wand brand rights.
     
  49. Murray Mound

    Murray Mound Banned

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    Yup. What the hell were those racquets? I can't find anything on the net.
     
  50. tailofdog

    tailofdog Semi-Pro

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    Itis There

    Look a little harder and you will find it.
    He bought a discontinued company called WONDER WAND. I played with a guy today that had one. It was a WONDER WAND INTRUDER that had (LOW TENSION DYNAMICS) on the side of the racquet. Ye said he bought it from a guy name Tom when he was in California 5 yrs ago. I just put 2and2 together and looked up WONDER WAND and saw that he aquired that company in 2008 and also set up to improve the brand with modern materials and tech.
    By the way the racquet this guys racquet was ok. Fairly thick beam and unusual throat. You can see the beginning of the Vortex design!
     

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