What happens if Fed loses in Montreal to Djoker/Murray/Nadal?

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by sureshs, Aug 6, 2009.

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  1. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    The people he never faced in the last 2 "Slams" and who can beat him on any given day.

    Will it discount his last 2 Slams? Can someone be GOAT without being GOTT (Greatest Of This Time)? Or will the excuse of family and children be used and the fact that only Slams matter to him now, his priorities have changed, he just wants to hang in there till the London Olympics, etc etc?
     
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  2. clayman2000

    clayman2000 Hall of Fame

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    How will it discount his last 2 slams? Each of them were in the tourneys, excpet for Nadal at Wimby.

    Fed beat the KOC slayer Soderling at FO who was on fire, and at Wimby on a better surface for the Yoker

    Then Fed beat both guys who took out Murray and Djoker, in sucession.

    If that happens in Montreal or Cincy all it will mean is that Djoker and Murray, are made for 3 sets and that Fed steps it up when it really matters.

    If Federer looses to Nadal, it means Nadal still has Fed's number. Nadal is in a different league than those other two. After all he was the no 1 player for the better part of a year
     
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  3. drwood

    drwood Hall of Fame

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    No, because everyone knows they have beat him IN SLAMS for it to really matter -- for example, what has Djoker done in slams since winning the Australian last year? Nothing. Plus Djoker has bigger things to worry about -- like how he's been owned by Haas this year.
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2009
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  4. GameSampras

    GameSampras Banned

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    I think it will definitely hinder his confidence playing level at the USO. Last year his confidence was down going into the USO and Andreev the glorified crapper almost beat Fed at the USO.

    Murray was in his first slam finals last year and was feeling the pressure. This year if Murray makes it, I dont think it will be the same
     
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  5. Sartorius

    Sartorius Professional

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    Yes, his latest French and Wimbledon titles will be discounted officially. If the loss includes a bagel, then his Australian Open points will come off too.

    In any case, he will also recieve a 6 month ban, hence he won't be able to participate in USO.

    I also heard that Sampras will be given a WC to USO to have a shot at increasing his own GS record as a further punishment for Federer.
     
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  6. GameSampras

    GameSampras Banned

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    And I think if Nadal beats Fed at the USO, his wimbeldon and RG wins will almost be discounted as "in the lack of prescence of Rafa" and people will begin talking about Fed cant be GOAT cause he still cant overcome his rival at a slam
     
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  7. Tiberius

    Tiberius Banned

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    Was Murray also under pressure in his first AO QF, first FO QF, first Wim SF?
     
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  8. drwood

    drwood Hall of Fame

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    The key is that Murray has to make it...he was under the radar last year until he beat Nadal. He'll be a marked man this year -- and as we all know, he didn't handle it that well in Australia.
     
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  9. Blinkism

    Blinkism Legend

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    hahaha!10char
     
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  10. GameSampras

    GameSampras Banned

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    Yea he didnt.. But from all account wasnt he sick with the flu? I still think Murray is at his best on hardcourts.. And to Murray's credit, he did run into a red hot Verdasco. Hell Nadal only almost fell victim to him as well. And who knows even Fed may have.. Verdasco was playing the best tennis of his career
     
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  11. Sartorius

    Sartorius Professional

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    Oh, and do people really believe that Djokovic and Murray (even Nadal...) are Federer's contemporaries?..

    Even if you do, will you say that Murray is a "better player of this time" if he ends up with a positive h2h against Federer and wins, let's say, 5 Grand Slams?..
     
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  12. clayman2000

    clayman2000 Hall of Fame

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    You mean his second AO R16?
     
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  13. This...i can understand...i would really be extremely dissapointed if that happened...
     
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  14. I see Murray and Tsonga and Roddick as Feds toughest opponents in USO...
     
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  15. All-rounder

    All-rounder Legend

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    Then he will win US open and AO open
     
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  16. tennisfan25

    tennisfan25 New User

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    What happens if Fed loses in Montreal to Djoker/Murray/Nadal?
    The world will end.
     
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  17. stanfordtennis alum

    stanfordtennis alum Hall of Fame

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    is he loses, it's because the other player outplayed and gotta give credit when credit is due
     
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  18. theroleoftheunderdog

    theroleoftheunderdog Professional

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    federer should just lose first round so some idiots have less to "discount" his slam wins
     
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  19. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    I already mentioned that
     
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  20. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    Maybe some of the oldies can answer this one: did Laver have a dismal record against anyone, like Federer has against Nadal? I am trying to see if Laver or Fed is the real GOAT.
     
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  21. burosky

    burosky Professional

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    What happens if he loses? Only one thing is for sure. He doesn't end up as the champion this year.
     
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  22. cknobman

    cknobman Legend

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    If you ask me the match being a "final" had nothing in particular with Murray and his performance. I think Murray is more of a general overall "choker" or "underachiever" at slams in general. Seriously, since last years USO his slam losses have been shameful. For someone of Murray's hyped up caliber to loose to the common likes of Verdasco, Roddick, and Gonzo?

    So IF (and thats a big IF) Murray makes it back to the finals this year I fully expect him to choke against whoever he plays (it would be really sweet if it was Rafa).
     
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  23. VivalaVida

    VivalaVida Banned

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    So what if he does? He lost to Karlovic and Simon last year and still powered to the USO trophy.
     
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  24. FedFan_2009

    FedFan_2009 Banned

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    Another stupid thread, more fodder for my ignore list.
     
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  25. cknobman

    cknobman Legend

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    If Fed loses in Montreal then he just packs up and moves on, no biggie. It will be his first tourney since Wimby so I doubt hes entering it expecting to win much like Rafa who hasnt played in months. Both Fed and Rafa will just be hoping for some match time.
     
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  26. r2473

    r2473 Legend

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    It is a single elimination tournament, so he won't advance to the next round. If it is the finals, he will be the "finalist" and not the champion.

    Hope this helps.
     
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  27. Steve132

    Steve132 Professional

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    More wishful thinking. The only people who make these arguments are Sampras fans trying to maintain their hero's fading GOAT claims.
     
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  28. フェデラー

    フェデラー Hall of Fame

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    How will Nadal feel WHEN he slips to 3?
     
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  29. ChanceEncounter

    ChanceEncounter Professional

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    Yeah, he should just start losing before he gets to Djoker, Murray, and Nadal, so H2H no longer becomes a factor.
     
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  30. Clydey2times

    Clydey2times Hall of Fame

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    Firstly, he hasn't been to the QFs of the AO. Secondly, he simply lost to the better player on the day at the French and at Wimbledon.

    There's no doubt his performance in last year's USO final was nervy, though.
     
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  31. Clydey2times

    Clydey2times Hall of Fame

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    It was a virus he had in Australia, yeah. He didn't actually fully recover in it until Miami. That's why he ended up withdrawing from Dubai. Doctors initially suspected that it was mono.
     
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  32. Clydey2times

    Clydey2times Hall of Fame

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    Firstly, he was sick in Australia. Secondly, Gonzo is a better clay courter than Murray. That result wasn't an upset. Murray is not the same player on clay as he is on hard. The only disappoint loss was his loss to Roddick. And even then, Roddick played a great match. It happens. It came down to one or two points and Roddick played them better.
     
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  33. bigfoot910

    bigfoot910 Rookie

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    What happens? He has one more loss on his record...

    Does it discount his victories? Would this loss somehow go back in time and make all of the other opponents play with ping pong paddles, or make them all forfeit?

    God I hate these threads and I'm not even a Fed fan...
     
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  34. Clydey2times

    Clydey2times Hall of Fame

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    It means he will have lost to the better player on the day. Nothing more, nothing less.
     
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  35. Lsmkenpo

    Lsmkenpo Hall of Fame

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    It would mean nothing whatsoever, these tourneys are a few weeks before the US open they are warmup tourneys why would a favorite for the USopen go all out to win Cincy, and risk hurting their chances at the Open?

    Anyone who goes to these tourneys has to know players that are established favorites are not giving it 100% out there, Federer often tanks and so does Nadal at these hardcourt tourneys this point in the season,they have nothing left to prove playing these, they would probably prefer to skip them entirely if they would not get fined and publicly ridiculed by the ATP, part of the business of the game.

    Federer has lost to Hrbaty and Nadal to Monaco at Cincy, think that would ever happen at a grandslam event?
     
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  36. Clydey2times

    Clydey2times Hall of Fame

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    Absolute nonsense. They do not tank matches. That's just baseless nonsense.
     
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  37. Lsmkenpo

    Lsmkenpo Hall of Fame

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    BS, they do, watched Federer , Nadal and Djokovic tank at Cincy live over the past 4 years.

    Only an ignorant fool would believe that players such as Federer and Nadal value winning Cincy, more than rest and being 100% for the USopen.
     
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  38. P_Agony

    P_Agony Banned

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    You are unbelievable.

    Because Fed is 1-0 against Pete, all of Pete's Wimbledon titles should be discounted as "in the lack of prescence of Fed".
     
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  39. Clydey2times

    Clydey2times Hall of Fame

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    Really? Djokovic tanked the final last year, I guess? Nadal tanked the semi-final? Get a clue.

    Only a moron would think that these guys actually go out and tank a match.
     
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  40. Lsmkenpo

    Lsmkenpo Hall of Fame

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    Year earlier Moron, it is 90+ degrees and extremely humid there, he looked as if he was going to pass out and tanked the match.

    Only a Murray fanboy ****** relishes 3 set warmup tourney victories.
     
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  41. P_Agony

    P_Agony Banned

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    They don't tank but they certainly don't always try their best, especially in Cincy (before the US Open) and in Paris (before the TMC).
     
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  42. Clydey2times

    Clydey2times Hall of Fame

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    Yeah, those tournies are meaningless. It's not like the combined total of MS points is worth more than the combined total of GS points. Oh wait...
     
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  43. Tiberius

    Tiberius Banned

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    Haha Got him there!
     
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  44. Clydey2times

    Clydey2times Hall of Fame

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    Paris is different. Players often show up for bonus money there because it's the end of a long season. Cinci is different. I'm sorry, but the top players do not just give up on valuable points.
     
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  45. Lsmkenpo

    Lsmkenpo Hall of Fame

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    Yeah, I am sure if given a choice of winning a GS or winning 3 Masters series events a player would choose the masters series event victories.:) Your argument is a joke.:roll:

    Think Murray would trade some of his warmup tourney victories for a grandslam title?
     
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  46. Clydey2times

    Clydey2times Hall of Fame

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    Of course he would. Congratulations on missing the point, though.

    MS events are more than just warmup tournaments. They are prestigious events in their own right. Even if you disagree with that, there are too many points on offer at those events for players to not give their all. There are more points on offer in MS events over the course of a season than there are at the majors. The likes of Fed and Rafa cannot maintain their ranking if they tank.
     
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  47. Lsmkenpo

    Lsmkenpo Hall of Fame

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    Question, have you ever been to Cincy watched the matches and the practices? The top players are not giving it 100% every round, it is extremely hot and humid and 1 week before the Usopen. If you haven't been there than your opinion is based on pure speculation, mine is based on observation.

    When was the last time Federer lost to any player outside the top 5 in a GS, it has been years, same can not be said about the masters series, wonder why?

    Do you honestly believe if these tournies were not mandatory players such as Federer and Nadal would chose to play both of them back to back right before the Usopen?
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2009
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  48. Clydey2times

    Clydey2times Hall of Fame

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    Of course they would. Monte Carlo wasn't mandatory and Federer showed up, knowing that it would be a huge disadvantage to let his rivals gain so many points. The players simply cannot skip those events. It's too tight at the top. They would simultaneously lose points while their rivals gained points.
     
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  49. Clydey2times

    Clydey2times Hall of Fame

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    Tougher to win 3 out of 5 sets against Federer. He has lost two sets in majors many times over the last year to players outside of the top 5.
     
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  50. raiden031

    raiden031 Legend

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    I can't believe people are considering the idea that losing in one event takes away from the fact that he has won the last two slams and also made history in the process. Sorry but 15 slams is 15 slams no matter what happens afterwards.

    I think the impact it has is dependent on how Fed feels about the tournament. Fed does not take every tournament seriously so if he's using this as a warmup, then it will mean nothing to lose. If he thinks he should be in top form and struggles, then it might affect his confidence going into the USO. We'll see what happens. I think Fed is still the favorite at USO barring injury regardless of what happens leading up to it. Doesn't mean he will win it because he has been having some close calls and sooner or later he has to lose.
     
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