What would have happened if the Rafa and Federer met in last years US Open?

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by THERAFA, Apr 10, 2009.

  1. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    What would have happened what would the score have been? The Rafa looked energy sapped throughout that US Open even in all his straight sets wins, but the matchup tactically is so in favor of the Rafa that do you think he'd have beat Federer or no?
     
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  2. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    Come to think of it teh Rafa looked really worn out (from Verdasco) in the Aust Open Final yet it didn't really get in the way, so I guess that post-Olympic tiredness wouldn't really have got in the way had he played Federer in USO Final. The question would more be about the court surface and whether you think that extra hardcourt speed would give Federer enough edge. Also consider Federer's form at the time, was he playing better in that US Open than he played in the Aust Open, or worse? Or is it all mental and Federer just can't beat the Rafa in a GS Final regardless of the court/form etc. ?
     
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  3. Josherer

    Josherer Professional

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    Fed was in form during that tourney. I would have expected him to win.

    Take this vid of Joker Vs Fed US Open semis for example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YFdUvSdl9Ms

    Both Fed and Djokovic were playing at such a high quality.
     
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  4. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    I think we are certain to get the Rafa Federer matchup in this year's US Open, I think Federer regardless of his struggles has an aura at the US Open and guys are scared of him there and give away leads to him because of how long its been since Federer lost at the US Open, so I'm sure we'll see the matchup this season.
     
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  5. Josherer

    Josherer Professional

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    Yeah you look to be right. I can't see Nadal being troubled by anyone really.

    IMO he only lost to DelPotro because he was so fatigued (plus he played poorly compared to usual)

    If Fed regains his from after his back injury (like he regained his form last eyar after illness) I think him vs Nadal in the US Open with the crowd roaring will be absolutly brilliant!
     
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  6. Josherer

    Josherer Professional

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    Yeah you look to be right. I can't see Nadal being troubled by anyone really.

    IMO he only lost to DelPotro because he was so fatigued (plus he played poorly compared to usual)

    If Fed regains his from after his back injury (like he regained his form last eyar after illness) I think him vs Nadal in the US Open with the crowd roaring will be absolutly brilliant!
     
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  7. Josherer

    Josherer Professional

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    Yeah you look to be right. I can't see Nadal being troubled by anyone really.

    IMO he only lost to DelPotro because he was so fatigued (plus he played poorly compared to usual)

    If Fed regains his from after his back injury (like he regained his form last eyar after illness) I think him vs Nadal in the US Open with the crowd roaring will be absolutly brilliant!
     
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  8. Hope

    Hope New User

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    IF is not a score in tennis. Nadal DID NOT get to the final.
     
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  9. miyagi

    miyagi Professional

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    Hmmm? I dont know if Fed played any better at USO (bar the final) than he did at the A.O.

    Besides Nadal was obviously very tired after the Vedasco match and Fed still couldn't win.

    Not convinced Fed can win at any point against Nadal in a slam situation but he might prove us wrong and start spanking Nadal!
     
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  10. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    I wouldn't worry about Del Potro in a REAL match (aka Grand Slam), there are a lot of players that could beat Nadal in a non-slam event but none of them could beat him in a slam.
     
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  11. Josherer

    Josherer Professional

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    Noob......
     
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  12. maximo

    maximo Banned

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    Christ, Fed's forehand has gone down the drain since the USO...
     
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  13. caulcano

    caulcano Hall of Fame

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    IMHO, it would have been close like the Wimbledon & AO final.
     
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  14. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    ^^ Yep that seems to be the trend, the Rafa clutchness seems to be the reason the Rafa is winnin each time, always 5-setters.
     
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  15. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    Huh? Do you deny that the matchup tactically favors Nadal heavily? How many straight wins is it now, 5? Just saying, even a tired Nadal (like at the Aust Open Final) would probably win, considering the trouble Federer has had everytime.
     
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  16. jelle v

    jelle v Hall of Fame

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    "The" Rafa..? Seriously.. :rolleyes:
     
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  17. Pirao

    Pirao Semi-Pro

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    Fed would have won, probably.
     
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  18. jamesblakefan#1

    jamesblakefan#1 G.O.A.T.

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    What if is always fun to do, not just in tennis,but in life. I think that its a fair question, especially now that rafas proven he can win a HC GS when so many said he couldnt, all while beating Fed in the process.

    IMO, Fed would've won because IF Rafa had beaten Murray in the Semis, he would've had to do it in a 5-setter seeing as how he was down after the rain delayed play for a day. So I think having to play 3 consecutive days would've been too much for Rafa.
     
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  19. vtmike

    vtmike Banned

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    Nadal would've been bagelled which would have improved Federer's confidence...This confidence would have prevented Fed's implosion in the fifth set of the AO '09!
     
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  20. P_Agony

    P_Agony Banned

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    After the Federer-Andreev match, Federer woke up, and demolished everything in his way, including Djokovic and Murray. Djokovic played some really high quality tennis there but Federer was just too goo. I believe he would have beat Rafa too, plus the courts are faster than in the AO.
     
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  21. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    That 2nd set Federer played v Murray in the USO Final is the worst set I've seen Federer play in a Grand Slam for a long time. The fact he got away with it said a lot about Murray's mental state. It was worse than the 5th set of Aust Open Final.
     
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  22. jelle v

    jelle v Hall of Fame

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    Yes we get it by now.. everyone chokes against Federer and every Nadal victory is epic.. Murray was horrible and Fed got lucky.. seriously, we get it..
     
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  23. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    Murray is a rookie, he reminds me of Agassi's first few slam Finals (Agassi lost RG 90, RG 91, US Open 90, and he was the favorite in 2 of those 3 Finals). There is no disguising this and its why Murray isn't a true threat yet.
     
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  24. Nadal_Freak

    Nadal_Freak Banned

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    Fed uses too much topspin which Nadal loves. It's not just about Fed using a one-handed backhand. I'm thinking Nadal in 5 sets.
     
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  25. cknobman

    cknobman Legend

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    Like your post says Rafa was energy sapped which his why he didnt make it in the first place.

    Roger was playing good at that time so it probably would have been an even worse beating than Roger gave Murray.
     
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  26. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    ^^ Yeah but Rafa looked energy sapped in the Aust Open Final too, played a pretty scrappy match, so its hard to say he wouldn't beat Federer based on that. Murray beat the Rafa in US semi, but Murray also beat the Rafa in several other matches of late, obviously Murray hurts the Rafa more than Federer does, he makes the Rafa run a lot more.
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2009
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  27. Nadal_Freak

    Nadal_Freak Banned

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    Agreed. Murray is a different kind of beast. He gives Rafa much more trouble. Nadal has to stay away from Murray's backhand which his main part of his game is best against exploiting with Federer.
     
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  28. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    Ever since the US Open I've considered Murray the most important player in the world for the Rafa to defeat. So the 6-1 6-2 result was major candy, very big psychologically.
     
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  29. Nadal_Freak

    Nadal_Freak Banned

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    Yeah that was an amazing performance from Nadal. Maybe his best match ever on hardcourts.
     
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  30. batz

    batz G.O.A.T.

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    Hold the bus a minute. You argued until you were blue in the face the other day that the ONLY reason Rafa lost to Murray at the USO was because he was tired due to the Olympics!:shock:
     
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  31. batz

    batz G.O.A.T.

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    The next time the two of them play in 50 mph winds, this thrashing might have a bearing on the psychology of the match. Just like the bagel Rafa got from Murray in Rotterdam might have a psycholgical bearing the next time he plays Murray carrying an injury.

    Leaving facetiousness to one side for a minute, I guess the point I'm trying to make is that you shouldn't read too much into the result at IW given the pretty unique context, just as you shouldn't read too much into Murray's bagelling in the defeat of Rafa at Rotterdam.
     
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  32. Nadal_Freak

    Nadal_Freak Banned

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    It was 25 mph winds. Get it right.
     
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  33. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    Murray makes the Rafa run A LOT, so when the Rafa is tired he will lose to Murray. Whereas Federer doesn't take advantage, he makes too many errors v the Rafa and the stamina therefore isn't tested 100%. Murray is more dangerous because he can extend the rally relentlessly.
     
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  34. batz

    batz G.O.A.T.

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    http://www.gototennisblog.com/2009/03/23/nadal-reminds-murray-numero-uno/

    That's the first link of a cursory google search. Turns out I was wrong; there were gusts to 60 mph according to that report.

    There are lots of other reports saying 40 mph to 60 mph. None of them seem to say 25mph though.

    What was that you were saying about getting it right?
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2009
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  35. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    The windiest conditions I ever SAW was Federer v Agassi QF at the US OPEN, so I wouldn't rule out seeing Murray in the same position in New York as he was in Miami. Agassi would take his racquet back for a forehand and then suddenly fall almost to his knees as the ball suddenly is unreachable. I don't care what the wind rate was in Miami, the swirl in Ashe Stadium makes the wind more difficult, at least in the Agassi-Federer match.
     
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  36. batz

    batz G.O.A.T.

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    So you can think of ONE other occasion when the wind was comparable to that day in Miami. Which kind of proves my point.

    Just to be clear; Rafa was 100% deserving of his victory that day. I just think it's kinda daft to be extrapolating things from a match where the conditions are unlikely to be repeated.
     
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  37. Josherer

    Josherer Professional

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    Yeah that's true. Though if Fed kept up his great form throughout US and was to meet Nadal in the finals I would have to give it to him.

    Then again lookng at the history one might favour Nadal even though Fed was playing so well.
     
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  38. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    What it does prove is that Murray is so fragile that his entire chance of victory at the US Open can go from good to zero (6-1 6-2) all because of windy conditions. I don't know of a top player with a difficency like that, and that is why you wouldn't put money on him winning the US Open. And who knows how many different wind conditions Murray would bow to; we'll find out over the years.
     
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  39. vtmike

    vtmike Banned

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    Nadal prevented himself from getting a straight sets beatdown by going out to Murray in the semis
     
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  40. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    Federer never beats the Rafa.
     
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  41. egn

    egn Hall of Fame

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    Agassi was different than Murray. Agassi was a troubled youth he used to throw big games when he was a junior to make his dad angry. He never knew how to handle the pressure games because he was used to giving up on them, Murray just got beat down. Murray was definitely a threat, half of tennis is mental. Murray was intimidated.

    It was two different kinds of energy saped. AO was short term damage, he was tired from a match, Rafa at the USO it was long term the wear and tear of the season was taking him down, I think the second is more dangerous to him than the first. Fed could have probably won the USO due to Rafa being exhausted, but I think Fed would have still found a way to lose.
     
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  42. vtmike

    vtmike Banned

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    Ok The Nadal_Freak 2.0
     
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  43. carlos djackal

    carlos djackal Professional

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    Although Fatigue IMO it could have been a close one just like in this year's AO but I still think Nadal would be the victor.....I just feel that Fed has his mental game collapsing when facing Nadal.....Nadal just owns Fed for a while now.....
     
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  44. jelle v

    jelle v Hall of Fame

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    The Federer has already beaten the Rafa... The Murray has also beaten the Rafa.. The Del Potro has beaten the Rafa.. the Rafa is not invincible..

    Seriously.. stop it with "the Rafa", it's just pathetic..
     
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  45. Josherer

    Josherer Professional

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    Hehe suttle :)
     
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  46. batz

    batz G.O.A.T.

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    Yeah, but he hasn't lost this year to a guy who'd never taken a set off him after being 3-0 and a break up in the final set. I don't know of any other top player with a deficiency like that, who knows how many other times Rafa will bow to that kind of collapse, we'll find out over the years.

    It's not just you who can wildly extrapolate stupid conclusions on the basis of what happened in one match.

    And just to be clear, we're not talking about 'windy conditions' we're talking about 45 -60 mph gusts. Miami had windy conditions - remind me again who won the title in those conditions?
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2009
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  47. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    You'll never see Del Pot beat the Rafa at a slam. Just about anyone in the top 20 whereas could beat the Rafa at a non-slam, very doable. The Rafa's mental a-game only comes in the slams, because he knows using it in the non-slams will result in longterm burnout. That isn't to say the Rafa isn't giving 100% in nonslam, in fact he is giving 100% physically in nonslams but he doesn't peel his eyes at the ball with the same intensity. I've experienced the same concept myself, in tennis training I'll give 100% (physically) but I won't fight mentally as hard as I would in a match. So he plays looser mentally in nonslams hence the massive amounts of unforced errors that he wouldn't commit in a slam match.
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2009
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  48. batz

    batz G.O.A.T.

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    And even if Rafa does lose to someone in a slam, it's only because he is tired - right?
     
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  49. THERAFA

    THERAFA Banned

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    If the Rafa lost to Federer in a slam it wouldn't be due to the Rafa's tiredness, because we know Federer can't exploit it, he doesn't move the Rafa around, doesn't keep the ball in play. If Federer beat the Rafa it would be for some other unforseen reason tactically related or mentally (if they switched minds and the Rafa became a choker).

    Whereas if Murray played the Rafa when the Rafa was running on empty then Murray would definitely win.
     
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  50. jelle v

    jelle v Hall of Fame

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    You are just one big troll, aren't you..?
     
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