What's your average first serve speed? How is your most used one spinning?

Discussion in 'Tennis Tips/Instruction' started by DeShaun, Jan 12, 2012.

  1. DeShaun

    DeShaun Banned

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    I average in the low to mid eighties. Slice-topspin that either stays low and seems to penetrate quite well, or kicks pretty fast with mild gyrating effect to navel height (rarely any higher) and jumps up and crawl on people. So, I guess it's a body serve or a hot slider that tends to be my most common first serve.
    . . .now, first serve percentage is a different story.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2012
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  2. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    you got video proof?

    my first serves are at about 130mph. maybe 140 on a good day
     
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  3. DeShaun

    DeShaun Banned

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    Aw, no. I'm going to try to get some this week though. I didn't think claiming an 82.5mph top-slice would set off anyone's alarm, that it was anything worth bragging about. Was just saying it as cold fact.
     
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  4. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    now you are saying 82.5?? you must have a radar gun or something. post the video!
     
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  5. DeShaun

    DeShaun Banned

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    My friend said he owns a radar gun. I know that he owns an Ipad, because he's made videos already of me. I'm going to see about him bringing that stuff to the court. He has said that this was his intent.
     
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  6. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    haha i am just teasing you. 82 is pretty good though. i doubt i can hit that high consistently.
     
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  7. TennisCJC

    TennisCJC Legend

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    I know guys that were clocked - one in the mid-90s and the other around 120. Using them as a reference, I would say my harder first serves are the the 80s with occasionally one in the 90s. Maybe very rare one breaks 100 - such as the serve at 5-2 40-love where you just go for it and it happens to go in.
     
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  8. J011yroger

    J011yroger G.O.A.T.

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    I'll try to grab some fresh batteries for the radar. It seems quite a bit slower since I hurt my back, and one of my main goals for spring is to get it back up to speed.

    J
     
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  9. r2473

    r2473 Legend

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    Where do you point the gun? Watch from 2:00 (yes, I know you know this stuff, but I always wonder how an average guy would set up a speed gun to test for serve speed).

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vV8vtO-uzfY
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2012
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  10. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

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    Depends on your radar. I have a gun style radar and it is safest to mount it slightly above and behind the person serving. Ideally, it would be mounted at around 9 feet for me, but I don't have a tripod that tall. Instead, I normally have someone just hold it and measure it by holding down the trigger when I serve. The only downside is sometimes it locks onto the racket or my arm before the ball is hit and I register readings of 14mph, when I'm serving closer to 100mph.

    I've also shot radar on the far side of the court, and it registers about the same as if behind the person. So if I'm in range it still works well, but I don't want to risk breaking it by serving at the gun.
     
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  11. HunterST

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    I use a speedtrac and usually put it just behind the net. I always got around 85-88 MPH. I haven't tested it in about 8 months or so, though.

    If it's true that putting it around the net makes for a slightly lower number, I guess that would put them around 90-95 or so?
     
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  12. Up&comer

    Up&comer Hall of Fame

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    I max out around 110-115. That's IF I hit it flat and hard. I can't be that consistent with it. Average is probably around 100. Slice with a little kick.
     
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  13. RoddickAce

    RoddickAce Hall of Fame

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    I averaged 165.25kph at Rogers cup with flat serves, so like 102.68mph.

    I don't really have a most used type of first serve. I tend to vary my first serve a lot, depending on my opponent's return strengths/weaknesses.

    I haven't clocked my slices and kicks, but they are most likely at least 10-15 mph slower. So realistically, my first serve average speed is probably lower, in the low to mid 90's mph.
     
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  14. dizzlmcwizzl

    dizzlmcwizzl Hall of Fame

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    I once had my serve gunned at the Cincinnati masters event and they clocked it at 129 mph to win the serve competition for the day. But I did not really trust that equipment

    I have used a personal radar gun but have always been dissatisfied with the number ... I have a cheap one that has read as high as 110 but usually I get results between 15 and 100... Unfortunately no one is willing to stand in front of me and standing behind me is a challenge to get a good angle.

    I recently have begun taping my play and using the frame rate speed calculator on talk tennis has given me what I think is a more accurate number for serve speed ..... but who really knows.

    On the most recent match I measured 10 hard flat 1st serves with the numbers ranged from 105 - 115. But about half the time on my first serve I hit a kicker and those serves typically run about 85-90 mph. According to the TT serve speed calculator.
     
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  15. pvaudio

    pvaudio Legend

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    That's because you can cheat. You are not serving on a court, you're serving in a 7ft square (I know this because I've been there) and can easily get ridiculous numbers that wouldn't be anywhere near the box.
     
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  16. pvaudio

    pvaudio Legend

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    The maximum that I ever hit was a few years ago (Indianapolis) at 122. Flat serves now are in the 1-teens, with my normal first serve being in the low 100s.
     
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  17. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

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    The fastest I've hit on radar is 115mph, but I'm certain that I've hit faster in actual matches. However, my serve changes from day-to-day. Sometimes, I can hit in the 110mph range without difficulty, and then the next day I can struggle to get 100mph.

    I've never had anyone actually take statistics on a whole match or even a set of my serves. I'd bet that I average in the 90s on 1st serves and probably average in the 70s on my 2nd serves (might be even slower on the 2nd).

    The 3.0 to 5.0 crowd I play with do not tend to hit fast serves. The 5.0 ranked player I sometimes hit with does not hit a big flat serve. His serves mostly have topspin, and I'd estimate his first serve averages in the 80mph range.
     
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  18. dr325i

    dr325i Legend

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    how do you cheat the speed?
    100 mph on an open court and in a 5 ft box is 100 mph. Unless you measure your speed at a different point (net vs point of contact)...which changes everything
     
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  19. maggmaster

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    Because the serve would never go in on a court...
     
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  20. dr325i

    dr325i Legend

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    Ah, so we only count the "good" serves?
    Why do they clock faulted serves at the real matches?
     
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  21. dizzlmcwizzl

    dizzlmcwizzl Hall of Fame

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    I will say that on this day I was trying to use my normal serving motion and not attempting to do anything but hit it hard.

    After I took the lead for the day the guy that was running the machine had to point out to the girls he was chatting up that he could beat my score ... when he served he walked up and hit the ball while he was moving forward in a manner you would never hit an actual serve ... he was able to get into the 130's pretty easily since he had had probably never tried to put one in the service box.
     
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  22. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    wow.......all you guys claim to hit 100mph as average first serve?????? ok lets start putting up some video guys
     
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  23. Passion4Tennis

    Passion4Tennis Rookie

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    Yeah, I was about to say the same thing earlier today. I know there are some high level players on this site that are capable of it, but I think they are in the minority. I've never used a radar gun before, but I seriously doubt mine are close to 100. I would say that my first serve avg. is probably between 70-85mph, and I feel that is a more realistic number for the 4.0 and under crowd. Although I have faced a few 4.0's that probably can hit 100 or close to it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2012
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  24. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    yea.....i want to see how many of these guys actually put up proof...i say maybe 1
     
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  25. Passion4Tennis

    Passion4Tennis Rookie

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    I think Drak used his radar gun on some high level players he knew, and most of them were surprised that their serves weren't as big as they thought.
     
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  26. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    exactly....these guys are stating they were clocked by radar guns too. so they dont have that excuse!!!
     
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  27. dizzlmcwizzl

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    1st ... let me state up front that I know this is a fools errand. No matter what evidence I present I am aware that I will trashed and any reputation I have will be sullied ... However these are two honest attempts to show that I am not full of shiz ...


    The first is a video I prepared for another thread where I am attempting to improve both my fitness and my skill level. I did not do the clever editing and I deleted the original footage so counting frames for me is a lot harder. However, I think it is clear that the ball was struck well. 1st Video.

    The second video is the only original footage I have left on my computer. I had not edited it before because the angle is screwy ... however I did the frame rate calculator on the original footage and to the best of my knowledge this is an accurate snapshot of a flat 1st serve. I tried to be very particular by taking off 2 feet but I dont think it was that much. I also think I added 0.25 frames when I did not need to ... but again trying to reduce the carnage. 2nd Video.
     
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  28. J011yroger

    J011yroger G.O.A.T.

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    http://vimeo.com/6043100

    Serving with a stiff back, and a random old ball from my bag using a $2.99 Pancho Gonzales woodie that I found at 'The Salvation Army'.

    109mph at the net should translate to around 121mph off the racquet face on pro radar.

    J
     
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  29. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

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    One person said he averages 100mph, so I'm not sure how that translates into "all you guys"?:confused:
     
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  30. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

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    Most tournaments have a radar system that is mounted behind the players and measures peak speed off the racket. Spectators can see the speed if it registers correctly. The radar gun doesn't know if the ball was good or out, which is why it is displayed.

    It isn't nearly as difficult to repeatedly strike a ball hard, as to hit it hard and into the court. I had a player who was about 5'4" tall and he could serve near 100mph with a semi-western grip. However, that serve only went into the box about once in every twenty attempts.
     
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  31. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    The reality is that very few club players can reach 100 mph
     
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  32. RoddickAce

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    I wouldn't consider myself a high level player. High 4.0-low 4.5 max.

    The serves I got clocked at Rogers Cup, the radar was behind the net, near the back of the service box, and as I posted earlier, averaged around 102-103mph.

    I know at least 3-4 guys at around my level that can hit faster serves than me.

    edit:
    105mph Serve at Rogers Cup:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqSi1zgBfy8 - My friends didn't record all my serves, and this was the only one I could dig up for now. I missed this one wide, but it is at 169kph or 105 mph.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxE6HuFow0Y&feature=related - These are my normal serves now. I don't feel I spent extra effort to hit the 100mph serves at the Rogers Cup.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2012
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  33. HunterST

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    #33
  34. newton296

    newton296 Rookie

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    was at same tournament and the best I could hit out of 3 tries was 103 mph. but I would say I was losing about 10-15 mph due the fact that I had no warm up, a borrowed racquet, and some pretty beat up balls. I would love to try again with my volkl pb815 and some fresh balls.
     
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  35. RoddickAce

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    Hey Jolly, just curious about my serve speed then. What about 105mph at the back of the opponent's service box?
     
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  36. dizzlmcwizzl

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    The cage they had presented a problem for me. They positioned it so that you had to face the sun and if I stood in the middle of the cage I would be staring right into the sun and have to deal with a drooping net. So I had to stand right in front of the gun and angled slightly so I could take my normal swing. Combine that with the oversized prince racket they had to for me to borrow and the balls that had already been used by a 1000 people I figure I could have done a little better than I did ...
     
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  37. dr325i

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    #37
  38. NLBwell

    NLBwell Legend

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    Looking at the videos I don't think there is that much difference between them. Your serve looks to be in the 90s and the others are probably more like 110. They are practicing, not going full-throttle.
     
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  39. Dadof10s

    Dadof10s Banned

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    To me Hunter's serves look maybe 80ish. Sorry but no way the serve he posted is in the 90s. I would agree the practice pros were hitting 110 or so.
     
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  40. HunterST

    HunterST Hall of Fame

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    Yeah, the kicks aren't going 120 and look how much faster they look than the serves of any rec players who say they hit close to 120. For a more fair comparison, we can look at his partner who is hitting much flatter and probably around 115-120. I've clocked my serve many times, and it's usually about 85-88 for first serves.

    At any rate, I wasn't comparing mine to Verdasco's. I was showing what serves that do go 110+ look like. No one online who claims to hit 120 have serves that look like either of those pros (keep in mind they are warming up/practicing). Posters on here have serves that look much more comparable in speed to mine.
     
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  41. dr325i

    dr325i Legend

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    I would not say no one...
    I have hit against the posters that CAN hit 120 -- not consistently and not accurately.
    The point we all miss is that the pros do it consistently (Fed for example hits 80% of his first serves in the range 120-125); and they aim for the specific point in the box while hitting this. The best/fastest server on this board may hit 120 mph, but rarely very close to the target he aimed for...
     
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  42. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

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    A 100mph flat serve is not some incredible feat for someone with decent form. Jolly posted a 100mph + serve. Does that look freaky fast?

    Also, don't base the serve speed on how it looks. Use a radar gun to measure your speed. The reason Verdasco's serve looks impressive in that video is due to the amount of spin, not the speed. Take away some spin and it is not hard to bring 100mph.

    I have a radar gun and found that it is not unusual for young athletic high school players (most could probably compete at 3.5) to be able to hit 100mph serves if they go for it. One of my players (I'd rate 3.5 but athletic and wild) hit a 115mph serve when he was seeing how fast he could serve. He had a good throwing arm.
     
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  43. rkelley

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    Put me into the group that would call Verdasco's serve in the video well below 120. I'd guess is mid 90's. There's a ton of spin and action on that ball though, and it's kicking up high. It's a good serve. It's harder to return than a flat serve with little spin going the same speed. I don't think he was trying to bomb it in.
     
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  44. RoddickAce

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmHeDYQ89zY&t=2m3s

    He gradually hit harder and harder, so there were some flatter, harder serves near the end.
     
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  45. Larrysümmers

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    i usually hit around 120-135mph on average. sometimes i like to gun some around 140-150mph when im really on and feel like pounding the serve. a handful of years ago i hit a 155mph serve. heck once i served so hard it got stuck in the red clay ;D
     
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  46. NLBwell

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    Nice to see you posting here Andy!
     
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  47. spacediver

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    what makes you think that the radar gun was measuring the speed of the ball as it passes the net? Just because the gun is at the net doesn't mean it measures the ball as it crosses the net.
     
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  48. NLBwell

    NLBwell Legend

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    This isn't about where the radar is placed, but about how quickly the radar picks up the ball in flight. Expensive radar guns will pick up the ball right off the racket, the boxes at the net later in flight.
    The general consensus among those knowledgable in a thread several years ago came to about 5 to 10 mph. Based on that I'd say Jolly's serve was about 114 to 119 mph.
     
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  49. Rock Strongo

    Rock Strongo Legend

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    My serve speed is actually something I get praise for by coaches and younger players at my club (note, I said speed, not percentage because my first serve% is horrible) and I've been timed at 162 km/h while wearing everyday clothing and no shoes with an old Prince Powerflex with VERY old strings though most serves were around the 125-130 mark. Given I've warmed up properly and is dressed and equipped for the occasion I could average 130-135 and max out at around 165-170. However I miss most every time I try to go flat out.

    My most used one can spin up to around just under shoulder height on someone who's 5'10 though I have kicked over people on clay (it's the back-killer). I'll try to record a video of me hitting with my friend once he's able, which isn't that often because we live too far apart and generally once see eachother during school breaks but we might play together some day and I'll bring my camera for that occasion.

    Speaking of said friend, he's 2½ years younger than me (he's 15 if you may wonder) and he's in posession of a massive serve. He says he thinks he can reach 200 km/h and having been on the receiving end of it I don't see any reason why it wouldn't.

    But then he trains like 6 billion hours a week and is one of the best in his age group here in Sweden (compared to me who was talented at 8-11 but then stopped for a few years due to lack of money and now only plays an hour a week) but overall I think he could hit bigger serves than most here.

    We've talked about getting a radar but they're too expensive and we haven't looked at our respective clubs yet, but I'll get a camera and a court during spring break and hopefully borrow a radar on that so that I can provide the mighty proof.
     
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  50. J011yroger

    J011yroger G.O.A.T.

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    That is pro radar, it should pick the ball up fairly soon after it leaves your racquet.

    I would guess your 105, would be comprable to 105 on TV, it is just with the cheapo units that there is more angle error, and it picks the ball up later.

    Radar has gotten much more accurate in the last 20 years, I remember when Sampras would serve big,in the early 90s it would be around 125, and now he is clocking in the 130s, same with Mac, now serving 125s on the seniors tour, and rarely over 110-115 in his prime.

    J
     
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