Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by Dutch-Guy, May 22, 2009.
The title says it all.
Vote and comment.
Potential route to the final (top 4) :
R3: PH Mathieu
SF: Djokovic/Del Potro
QF: Del Potro/Tsonga/Monaco
Federer or Djokovic. They both have it easy until the quarters.
Nadal, b/c he's gonna steamroll everyone, at least until the QF.
Roger's draw through to the semis is laughable :Berdych, Blake and Roddick in his quarter.Having Djokovic in his half is great for the tournament though, should be a great battle if they meet.Rafa on the other hand has a very tough draw with all the outside threats Verdasco, Ferrer, Gonzalez, Davydenko, Wawrinka and Murray are all in the top half.
-Nadal beat Ferrer in the last 3 meetings (all incidentally on clay)
-Nadal has a 9-0 h2h with Verdasco who has NEVER taken A SET off Nadal on clay
-Wawrinka has never taken a set off Nadal in all meetings
-Nadal beat Gonzalez the past 5 meetings without dropping a set
-The only challenges I see up to the semi's for Nadal are Davydenko and Murray. Nadal is 7-2 against Murray, with Murray winning the US Open match and the Rotterdam Match where Nadal was clearly injured by the end. Now Davydenko might pose somewhat of a challenge. He is 2-4 against Nadal and has actually taken 1 set off Nadal(in Rome 2007) in the 3 clay meetings they had.
Toughness of a draw is all relative, just like how putting Soderling or Tsonga on Fed's side of the draw on a fast court is "easy" while it is a tough draw for Nadal. So in this case, both Fed and Nadal have easy draws in general. Fed's stats against his opponents are really dominant as well so up until the QF's Nadal has the slightly tougher draw as of the 7 clay meetings, Ferrer did beat Nadal once, back in 2004. But once you get to the semi's, I don't think it's even questionable that Djokovic is much more of a challenge to Fed or Nadal on clay than Murray. So the draw evens out, and maybe Fed has a slightly harder draw just because of Djokovic.
Easiest to hardest:
Federer has by far easiest quarter
Nadal. He doesn't face a threat until the finals. Let's be real here.
Now you're saying Nadal has the hardest? He's gonna steamroll everyone! And now Murray moved ahead of Djokovic on the ease scale too. Didn't we discuss this already, how you are so wrong???
Fed has the easiet draw of the top-4.It's as if he made that draw himself
This is what i have been saying from the beginning. Nadal and Djokovic have tough quarters. Murray has easier than the first two and Federer's is a joke.
And no I am not wrong. You are.
Nadal has the easiest, because he's the only player in the draw that doesn't have to beat Nadal to win the tournament.:shock:
easiest- federer and djokovic joint. there's nothing to pick between them in terms of the easy beatability of their opposition for players of their class.
nadal's hardest match before the final will be his quarter final. fed and djoko will have to play each other in the semis, making up for the ease with which they'll ghost through the first few rounds.
Federer's quarter is a joke, I agree.. However, in the last 4 and a half years Federer tends to make the semis at least, so I would still sign for a change between Federer and Nadal, because to Federer it doesn't matter that much whether he meets Ferrer or Roddick.. What matters is whether he'll meet Murray or Djokovic. Therefore I'm not happy with Federer's draw.
I see Tsonga, Monaco or Del Potro being a reasonably tough quarterfinal opponent for Novak, but apart from that 'tough quarter' is a bit of a stretch, don't you think? By the way, you always say Novak's second best to Nadal on clay, therefore you will admit that Novak has an easier semifinal prospect than Federer.
Nadal has all the clay courts specialists in his draw:Verdasco,Almagro,Ferrer,Davydenko and Gonzalez.Whereas Fed has a repeat of the Madrid draw,with Blake and Roddick in his quarter.
wait, why in the world would anyone think that rafa had the toughest draw? It's rafa on clay at RG. It won't be tough for him until the final where he will face either nole or roger and even then I have a feeling it won't be that tough.
This is a fair assessment of a draw from a Federer fan.
Exactly, if Fed had Nadal's draw, we'd have people complaining about how tough Nadal's draw was cuz of Djokovic, while Fed gets a "cakewalk" because he holds amazing numbers against most of the players in Nadal's side of the draw now. And if you note the stats in my post earlier, it's easy to see that not many of those players have taken a set off nadal on clay.
Still remember what Verdasco and Djokovic did to him in Madrid?
Did you see the beating he gave to Almagro last yr, when everyone though that'd be a tough match. He doesn't have a tough match until the finals, sorry to be cynical about it.
yes I did, but madrid is completely different from RG. Watch, rafa will steam roll is opponents on the way to the final.
Yes, Verdasco lost in straight sets like all his other clay court matches against Nadal while Djokovic pushed Nadal to the brink. Djokovic is on Fed's half of the draw this time.
Verdasco gave Rafa a tough match(he was 0-4 down in the second set)
Nole almost beat him(he saved 3 match points).
So this scenario can repeat in RG,though RG is different than Madrid.
Further he has Ferrer,Almagro,Davydenko and Gonzo,all great clay court players.
OMG this is a disgrace... Nadal is playing Q? shameless atp conspiracy against him...
how low can they go? make him play against Bye next time?
That doesn't change the fact that his draw is still the toughest.
Quite right. Nadal has the easiest route to the finals. Murray the hardest (he likely has to beat Nadal). Fed and Djokovic have equally difficult semifinal matches assuming they play each other, as they both have exhibited fine clay form this season, with Djokovic being the more consistent one. Unless there is an upset, it will be Nadal vs Fed or Djoker. What a treat. Let's hope it happens.
Nadal has the easiest simply because he is far better than anyone else.
Ya, exactly, and Djokovic is on Fed's half of the draw. So although Nadals quarter is slightly tougher, I think Djokovic evens Fed's draw out.
If you look at the 6th post in this thread, you'll see that most of the players in Nadal's quarter haven't taken more than 1-2 sets off Nadal on clay ever. Davydenko is a really underrated player and in my opinion he is what makes Nadal's Quarter tougher than Fed's quarter.
That remark was partly a joke, partly to say that you can not look at a draw and say that guy has the toughest, because for Rafa Nadal no draw will be as tough as it is for Andreas Seppi. Federer holds amazing numbers against almost every non top4 player except maybe Gilles Simon. Does that mean Verdasco, Ferrer and Davydenko are easy? No it just means Federer's achieved a lot in the past. Just like Nadal.. We can talk all we want, but in the end, Federer, Nadal and Djokovic will make the semis, Nadal will win the tournament and Federer-Djokovic will be the match of the tournament.
that's true. The only person I think that can be somewhat of a threat based on recent performances is nole and rafa won't face nole until the final or he might not meet him at all.
Almagro's the most overrated player on tour, at least on clay. He hasn't beaten anyone important on clay. He got beatdown by Nadal last yr at the FO. Almagro is no threat to Nadal.
And Murray has the most difficult because he's the weakest of the top 4 on clay.
Fed has the easiest draw. Roddick/del Potro/Blake lol?
Dude... the guy got his *** handed by Frederico Gil (my guy) in Sauipe...
overrated does not describe him...
In Nadal's draw the only person with a sniff of bothering Nadal up untill he meets Djoker/Fed in the final is Verdasco.
No.Federer's side of the draw is definitely the mug half. Take Djokovic out and he basically has a bye to the final.
In terms of quality of opponents Fed and Murray have the easiest.
You keep repeating the same thing without any argument. Would you see Federer go out earlier than the semis if you swapped him with Rafa? I defenitely don't. He might have more trouble, but in a best of 5 he'd still come out on top, because he always does in best of 5. Having Djokovic in his half could decide the tournament though.
This is all you need to know a/b the guy. He lost to one-legged Nalbandian in Barcelona, the match before he went down with hip surgery. He's lost to Gulbis, Youzhny, and Kohlschreiber as of late. And he got triple breadsticked last yr vs Nadal. So yeah, he's no threat to Rafa.
Looks like Roger is going to keep his slam semi final appreances in a row record with the clown draw he has got.
I'm assuming this poll meant who has the easiest route to the semi's?
I voted Federer, but the easiest route to the final is Nadal.
And Murray has the hardest draw relative to his level on clay.
Fed's draw is ridiculous.
What argument do you want me to give you? I said that Rafa has the toughest draw coz he has good clay court players in his side whereas Fed hasn't.Nadal is happy to avoid Djokovic, though he's got Ferrer,Verdasco and Gonzo in his section whom he'd probably preferred to have avoided.
I know theres not even one dangerous player he could meet.
btw: your google sugestion!...:shock:
You're a disgrace for making such a stupid comment.
want problems you idiot?
or are you too brain stiif to get a joke?
He's just making fun of some people who tend to whine a lot about draws. If you want to be the best you should beat anyone. Draws are irrelevant.
i was just having a laugh and that "wanger" takes a stab at me out of the blue...
I predicted that Roger would get Blake and Roddick in his section...as its obvious that Federer has the easiest draw BY FAR! Mental midgets and pigeons, and all the real clay court threats in Rafa's section.*Sigh*.
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