Why does no one topspin their volleys?

Discussion in 'Tennis Tips/Instruction' started by _craze, Feb 4, 2013.

  1. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

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    Actually, the real definition at the moment is the computer rating and has nothing at all to do with the description of playing. So if she's a computer rated a 4.5, then she's a 4.5.

    In any case, we are getting far afield. I don't know why any of these threads are reasons for people to insult each other.

    Technique is not a religion. The only important thing is whether or not it works (though secondary considerations like tending to cause injury can come into play).

    I've explained why I don't think trying to hit topspin on most volleys would be successful, but I'm willing to experiment and see why it might be useful. Let's wait for the video and try it ourselves on the court.
     
  2. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

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    You're gonna wait a long time for that video . . . .
     
  3. RoddickAce

    RoddickAce Hall of Fame

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    One of my friends can actually consistently pull off really good angles with topspin volleys, landing basically 1 foot from the net. If in the right position and pulled off correctly, I think it actually IS a more effective shot than the slice since it exits the court quicker. (not off of huge passing shots but on moderate pace shots)
     
  4. _craze

    _craze New User

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    Any person can play and deceive the computer to get their rank. When their qualities don't match the descriptions against a fair challenge, it's easy to see.

    A much better/experienced player or an honest self-rate will always beat a computer going based on match results. Subjective, again, but if I hit my best and you see there's a reason I'm not at my given level, I won't outright deny it.

    As for the video, I'll try to see if I can get court time tonight. If I do have the video, I'll upload it. If not, I won't post anymore.
     
  5. _craze

    _craze New User

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    Yep, and it should be even more effective against a shot with more pace. If he's hitting angles like that, so consistently, I'd think it was on purpose.
     
  6. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

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    OK, I get your point. A player can sandbag and get a NTRP below his or her actual level. On the other hand, if you self-rate above your level you'll probably not have wins at a given level. A 3.5 isn't going to be able to maintain a 4.5 computer rating.
     
  7. psv255

    psv255 Professional

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    Having thought about this a bit, and I can totally see someone pulling this shot off; the biggest problem is timing and handling pace (which go somewhat hand in hand).
     
  8. Timbo's hopeless slice

    Timbo's hopeless slice Hall of Fame

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    my name is a joke, actually. I have a pretty decent all around game, but without doubt my best shot is my BH slice approach shot.

    I have also made my living as a coach for many years, and have a number of ex pupils playing College tennis on free rides, so I have had the opportunity to try pretty much every shot there is. I experimented with your silly little TS volley last night actually. It's possible, off weak balls, but it's pointless. A TS volley spends more time in the air and bounces higher. Both negatives in any context.

    Most amusing that you use JMac as an example. He was certainly unorthodox and prepared to try anything, and even he never bothered with a topspin volley!
     
  9. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    Very little advantage of topspin volley vs traditional deep sliced volleys.
    You're inside NML.
    Opponent doesn't have time to react.
    All this swinging volley craze from the WTA and ATP pros, that high volley is a winner with a traditional volley!!!!
     
  10. Relinquis

    Relinquis Hall of Fame

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    what about lob volleys? why does no one lob their volleys?
     
  11. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    Why not hit a really high lob with huge backspin very close to the net, so the opposing player has to reach over the net to hit the ball? Then call him on it and for running into the net.
     
  12. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

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    They do. It is called a "lob volley."

    I hit them all the time, but never on purpose. It happens when I hit a volley and don't recover fast enough. My racket is down, the opponent puts the bll at my feet, and it pops up over their head for a winner.

    Don't try this at home. Or anywhere else.
     
  13. NLBwell

    NLBwell Legend

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    I'll generally hit 1 or two lob volleys per doubles match.
     
  14. thecode

    thecode Banned

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    most want their volley to skid & stay low, not hop up like topspin shots often do
     
  15. gmatheis

    gmatheis Hall of Fame

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    I think the OP is on to something great here ... the rest of the tennis world is totally wrong.

    Roger's records are indeed in jeapardy now!
     
  16. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    I probably hit between 3-4 lob volleys each set.
    I usually play with weak hitting old folks, on my team, while the other team is usually young guns who like to poach.
    My partner hits a weak ball to the netperson, I step one step to the middle and lob volley off my shoetops.
    Since I can't run, my defense is defending the shots my racket can actually reach.
     
  17. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    no worries. we dont need any serves at all. lets stay on topic. just video of the topspin volley only to amaze us all! (and shut the critics up).
     
  18. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    Today at the courts I hit FOUR lob volleys on one point alone. Against old farts who can't run or change directions.
    And yes, level of play makes a huge difference, but this guy I mentioned who hit topspin volleys off both sides is about a 4.5 doubles player. Topspin with some sidespin added for a mishit volley that is very effective and consistent. Strong W grip, same face of the racket, not Kiteboard.
     
  19. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

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    My goodness. Nice sleuthing, Zap.

    You can tell self-rates who claim to be 4.5s but really aren't. They give themselves away by getting rude and nasty to anyone who questions their self-rate.

    Still waitin' for that video of a mad skillz topspin volley . . . .
     
  20. TheCheese

    TheCheese Professional

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    OP, can you just post the video so we at least know what you're talking about?

    Besides a half volley I've never seen someone purposely try to topspin a normal volley.
     
  21. mxmx

    mxmx Semi-Pro

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    Well...I lost a doubles match against a guy who often uses a topspin forehand right up against the net. But then he really needs a higher ball and wack it to put it away. It is effective for him...but only due to his natural ability and experience, and not proper technique. He would have been even better with proper technique. I mean heck, he uses SW on ALL his shots, even his single backhand and serve! If you play a lot, have skill, you can get away with murder...But if one has the option to choose before bad habits has settled, I'd by far choose the proper technique above the "maybe this is good" technique.
     
  22. mxmx

    mxmx Semi-Pro

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    please show us the video anyways. who cares if you sucked on the day? it's about the tennis right?
     
  23. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    so its tuesday here......checking in for the video......sorry to say i think others are right he was making it up. no video:( i guess its not a real shot after all
     
  24. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    Problem is, there ARE guys who can hit topspin volleys from shin to overhead.
    Come to the RoseGarden at Berkeley. This guy hits same face, strong W gripped, and volleys better than anyone there, including the few 4.0's who show up.
    It can be done, it's not easy and requires special skills.
    BTW, both his sons volley traditional way and use both sides of their rackets.
     
  25. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    Yea but I believe this guy said he was executing them using a continental grip. I would have like to have seen his vid.
     
  26. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    OK, you got me....
    With strong W, it's possible.
    It's also possible with a conti grip......at 3.5 levels of play.
     
  27. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    the guy is a fake! i was rooting for him too the whole time unlike the rest of you. alas, you guys were right
     
  28. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

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    Because of all the hard feelings, I doubt we'll see a video.

    I'm going to try to hit a few of these next time I'm out at the courts (with a continental grip), but I'm not confident it is a good idea against a fast ball.

    People take these discussions too seriously, and things normally go downhill once NTRP ratings discussions come into play. I think it is usually a good idea to leave NTRP out of most technique discussions, but there are still a lot of people that advise different techniques for different level players. I'm coming to the conclusion that most technique is applicable at all levels. But I'm still open to the idea that it might not be good to start a beginner out with a full western grip, etc.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2013
  29. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    have you seen any juniors hit lately?? they all hit western. like, super western
     
  30. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    which brings up another funny point-i saw a kid hit a 1hbh the other day. i was like 'whoa you hit a one hander' he seemed as surprised as i was lol
     
  31. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

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    I guess you're right. It is sort of the reverse of the past in which a lot of kids started with eastern fh grips and then rotated toward semi-western as they got older and hit more spin. Now we have juniors start with Hawaiian grips and then rotate toward semi-western as they grow.

    Obviously with guys like Djokovic dominating at the moment, that's proof there's nothing wrong with the Western grip, but I'm still not convinced it is the end-all be-all grip for players. I believe it is easier to drive the ball with a semi-western or extreme eastern rather than a full-western.
     
  32. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    Player height.
    Short guys hitting moonballs back and forth ='s western grips.
     
  33. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    oh i am with you. i see these 10yr olds hit and i am like "wtf i cant imagine how tennis will be played in 20yrs" its scary.
     

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