Why NADAL is the unequivocal number 1!!

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by Bjorn99, Jun 8, 2008.

  1. Bjorn99

    Bjorn99 Professional

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2006
    Messages:
    1,443
    First of all, he has the body type that is required for the new game, crush and run. Djokovic and Federer both move beautifully, but in terms of compression, only Fed, on a day of his choosing, even comes close.

    Now we now know, that Nadal, carefully and slowly, has improved his serve to the point that it is ALMOST a weapon on a good day. Not always, but it has a little bit of a bite now. No longer a weakness to feed on.

    But where this guy has SIGNIFICANTLY improved, is his backhand. He has snap, whereas before it was a world class bunt. It is ALMOST, where his forehand is now. He has improved it so much, I can hardly believe it.

    The reason Mlle Federer tanked the third, is because for the first time, Nadal ran him ragged. All because the backhand, which used to be the spot where Federer could at least pause and rest a bit, has now improved to the point where it is not that much of an option any more. For a rest that is.

    I have to say, it was great to see Mlle having to run from side to side, in the manner in which he/she torments people and has, for quite a few years.

    No question in my mind, unless Federer hits the chalk on every serve at Wimbledon, there is no way he EVER beats Nadal again, on any surface. Not with the way Nadal can run him now. No way.

    Backcourt bullies like Agassi and Federer wuss out big time, when someone pulls their take the ball early and locate ON THEM. I used to love watching Pete Sampras beat the canary legged Agassi at his own game. Never like Sampras much, but liked the tinsel town fake Agassi even less. And it was great to see him try and scramble for a game or two, before he knew the jig was up.
     
    #1
  2. FlamEnemY

    FlamEnemY Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    May 6, 2008
    Messages:
    3,554
    Yeah, crush and run does wonders for your long career.
    Let's just wait until after the USO, shall we ?
     
    #2
  3. Bjorn99

    Bjorn99 Professional

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2006
    Messages:
    1,443
    He obviously knows how to keep going, after all he had major ankle surgery as a teen. He will flame out, but for now, he is the MAN.
     
    #3
  4. onkystomper

    onkystomper Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2006
    Messages:
    1,513
    WHy he is not the unequivicol number 1 is because the rankings do not lie. So lets not get into this BS again.
     
    #4
  5. AznHylite

    AznHylite Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2007
    Messages:
    487
    Location:
    Vancouver BC
    I think he'll have to retire by 26...
     
    #5
  6. babbette

    babbette Legend

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2006
    Messages:
    5,959
    Although i am like in the top 5 Nadal fans EVER.... :mrgreen: I don't like to talk up his chances on hardcourts and Grass, although he is a force to reckon with on those surfaces aswell. He doesn't dominate on those surfaces like on clay, so let's just see what happens. Everyone is still high from his Clay domination and not thinking straight:-?
     
    #6
  7. CyBorg

    CyBorg Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2007
    Messages:
    5,544
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    You forgot to sign out and sign in as Simon Cowell.
     
    #7
  8. babbette

    babbette Legend

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2006
    Messages:
    5,959
    people, stop saying that! :cry:
     
    #8
  9. AznHylite

    AznHylite Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2007
    Messages:
    487
    Location:
    Vancouver BC
    Well, with the pressure he's putting on his body, I don't think he'll last very long. I'm just giving out a number which I think is sort of realistic. Obviously I don't want him to retire so early, but it's definitely a possibility.
     
    #9
  10. Forehand_Punisher

    Forehand_Punisher Rookie

    Joined:
    May 23, 2008
    Messages:
    149
    I appreciate your enthusiasm, however your reasons why Nadal is the "unequivocal number 1" are a little less than convincing. Nadal no doubt absolutely steam rolled Federer today, but Nadal's record on other surfaces needs to improve before he takes over the #1 slot.

    I believe he has 27 titles so far in his career. 22 were on clay, 5 on hard court, and obviously 0 on grass or carpet.

    Federer has 54 titles. 35 on hard court, 9 on grass, 7 on clay, and 3 on carpet.

    If Nadal improves his play on other surfaces then sure, he's headed for the #1 spot. Federer is still the unequivocal #1 however.
     
    #10
  11. babbette

    babbette Legend

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2006
    Messages:
    5,959
    .............:cry:
     
    #11
  12. deme08

    deme08 Professional

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2008
    Messages:
    1,020

    Well said and END of the stupid thread.
     
    #12
  13. Bjorn99

    Bjorn99 Professional

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2006
    Messages:
    1,443
    I appreciate some peoples comments and not so much some others,but the salient point was the tremendous improvement in this guys backhand.

    I don't think Nole and Federer are going to be able to deal with this improvement on hard courts and grass. They are going to be running a whole lot more than ever before against Nadal.

    Hey, I am going on record as saying that this guy was starting to impress me, well before this clay court season began. OVer and out, Simon Colwell.

    I am actually very good friends with one of the four people on Idol, but Colwell is not the one.
     
    #13
  14. tlm

    tlm Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2004
    Messages:
    7,516
    Before we compare titles lets talk about the fact that fed didnt even win a gs until he was 22.

    Rafa just turned 22+ he already has 4, also he is improving his game while fed is on the fast decline!!!!!!!!!
     
    #14
  15. rabidcow

    rabidcow Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2007
    Messages:
    739
    I think not only has he improved his backhand but he has a mental edge on the boys. I think he will go on to win the rest of the slams this year
     
    #15
  16. Chopin

    Chopin Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2004
    Messages:
    4,104
    Location:
    St. John, USVI
    Nadal is an amazing player and today he played as close to perfect tennis as you're going to see on clay.

    That being said, Wimbledon is a different animal all together and there are a host of players that are dangerous to him on grass.

    Federer should have a lot of confidence going to into Wimbledon, he's back in form compared to the beginning of the year. Nadal was simply unbeatable today and Federer never really got his teeth into the match.
     
    #16
  17. xxxabc123xxx

    xxxabc123xxx New User

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2008
    Messages:
    54
    What the hell are you talking about, thread creator, "Backcourt bully" Federer. In this year's final, Federer came into net almost every point and got passed or dump the volley into the net most of the time. If he had been more patient and stayed in the back, I think the scoreline would have been closer (still lose ins straights though)
     
    #17
  18. wangs78

    wangs78 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2007
    Messages:
    1,896
    Location:
    New York
    Fed clearly is still not at his best. His serve is not the weapon it should be, his forehand is erratic and his backhand is merely adequate. His movement also seems seems a bit leaden compared to him at his prime.

    The question is, is he clearly past his prime, never to regain his former form, o r has he just been in a funk for the last several months? I still think that Fed in peak form will beat anyone, except for Nadal on clay when Nadal is also in peak form, but it's quite possible that we'll never see Fed in peak form again on the big stage. I think we'll know by the end of this season.
     
    #18
  19. AM28143

    AM28143 Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2007
    Messages:
    512
    Dude, every year, after the FO, everyone claims that Nadal will take over men's tennis. But then he burns out a littile bit as the year progresses, and everyone says he should retire. The truth is, Nadal is a incredible clay-court tennis player who hasn't found out a way to win on other surfaces.

    -Adam :)
     
    #19
  20. KRFLegal

    KRFLegal Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2008
    Messages:
    111
    I think the preliminary evidence from this year's matches is that Djokovic is improving faster on the hard courts than Nadal...Djokovic was the #1 player coming into the clay court season this year (with AO and Indian Wells victories), so he had a better early hard court season than Nadal...in fact, Nadal didn't win a tournament until the clay court season this year...

    Djokovic defeated Nadal 6-3, 6-2 at Indian Wells this year...that's a strong result for Djokovic.

    We'll see how the the US Open, and the run up to it goes...I think Djokovic will be a bigger story than Nadal...
     
    #20
  21. Bogie

    Bogie Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2005
    Messages:
    1,842
    actually, if you look at it, gasquet is still #9 right now even though he wouldn't be able to beat anyone in the top 100 at this point so the rankings can be a little misleading. you can have a great run adn then completely melt down and still stay at the top of the rankings for another year it seems.
     
    #21
  22. Chopin

    Chopin Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2004
    Messages:
    4,104
    Location:
    St. John, USVI
    Federer is actually in very good form compared with the beginning of the year; people just don't understand clay court tennis and the ups and downs of pro tennis.
    I wonder if some people even watch tennis matches on this board.
     
    #22
  23. BGB.CA

    BGB.CA Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2007
    Messages:
    135
    I wouldn't be so quick to give the crown to Nadal. Like Mcenroe said today I have no problem giving him the greatest clay courter ever crown however other than on clay his season hasn't really been that spectacular. He lost to Roddick for the first time since 2004 and lost to Davydenko for the first time ever earlier in the season and even lost to JC Ferero on clay in a week where JC went on to lose in the next round.
    I think his performance in RG Final (and in the entire torunament) just goes to show us what he is capable of when he catches fire, much like Federer did when he handed Hewitt 2 bagels in the USO final. His backhand and serve have definately improved but I'll wait till the end of the season to pass judgement on his position in the game, personally I would bet on the rankings being exactly the same at the end of the year, but it really wouldn't be too surprising to see any of those guys in the top spot.
     
    #23
  24. Fee

    Fee Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2004
    Messages:
    7,308
    Location:
    In front of my computer, obviously
    Best post in this thread.

    Second best post in this thread.
     
    #24
  25. tennis_hand

    tennis_hand Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2006
    Messages:
    4,427
    He is the man for now.

    if he can continuously do this until he is 27, then he is beyond human-like and only born once in a century. All of us, including Fed fans, Joker fans will nod.
     
    #25
  26. Pistol_Pete

    Pistol_Pete New User

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2005
    Messages:
    59
    Nadal dominates on clay! Did anyone notice that Djokovic is now better than Federer on clay (based on results vs. Nadal)?
     
    #26
  27. Breaker

    Breaker Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2005
    Messages:
    7,725
    I hope you're not serious, I guess Bellucci is now number three on clay based on that logic.
     
    #27
  28. tennis_hand

    tennis_hand Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2006
    Messages:
    4,427
    i didn't know Pete fans learnt this logic. lol.
     
    #28
  29. tennis08tarheels

    tennis08tarheels Professional

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2007
    Messages:
    1,209
    Location:
    North Carolina
    1 Federer, R. 6675
    2 Nadal, R. 5585

    Who's the unequivocal #1 again?
     
    #29
  30. coloskier

    coloskier Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2007
    Messages:
    5,541
    One difference that we may see coming into Wimbledon is that Nadal breezed through RG so fast that he didn't have any of his normal 5 set matches so he is in much better physical shape coming into Wimbledon. That being said, I don't see him making it past the semis this year at Wimbledon, depending on the draw. If he has either Blake or Roddick in his half he could be in for trouble, unlike the draw he had last year. He still has problems against flat hitters and big servers on a faster court, just like Fed has problems with high topspin to his backhand.
     
    #30
  31. daddy

    daddy Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2007
    Messages:
    5,686
    Location:
    Moon Balls
    This is reasonable, but I would just add that we should give him a credit for reaching latter stages of Hc/Grass tournaments and actually having a few hard court wins under his belt which is something claycourters did not do that much in the past. Please do not throw evidence such as JC Ferrero and Kuerten and other clay courters who did ok on faster surfaces, its fair to say Rafa is a bit ahead of the field ( claycourt ).
     
    #31
  32. CGMemphis

    CGMemphis Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2007
    Messages:
    389
    Location:
    Memphis, TN
    Shall we count the errors in your initial diatribe here? Yes I think we shall.

    Nadal did improve his backhand yes. His serve yes. Run Roger ragged? No. He focused on his backhand repeatedly, over, over and over. Did you even watch the telecast? The ball was bouncing up around neck to eye level and Feds one hand backhand doesnt deal well with the ball that high. Nadal knows this on clay. On grass that ball will bounce about knee to waist high, right into Feds strike zone. He ran him around, but more than 60% of his shots focused on his backhand.

    You know Roger is a man. Your brash arrogance and idiotic tone and posting is pretty pathetic. Are you about 17? IF not you are acting like it, Sir. We will address this more in a few here.

    I take it your not a Federer fan and thats fine, I am not either. But Fed greatness at Wimbledon more than Nadals at the FO. You can at least look that up can you not? Its obvious you know how to use a computer. Fed is 5 consecutive wins at Wimbledon, Nadal is 4 at the FO. Yes, I can see Nadal winning 5 in a row at the FO. For your comment on any surface, we shall see, his game is geared for clay, not hard courts.

    Its Nadals serve you have to worry about on grass, not Feds. Go back and watch last years finals.

    Backcourt bullies, interesting term. Feds game is 50/50 backcourt vs Serve and Volley. Do you pay any attention to his game? This is common knowledge.

    Agassi on the other hand, yes was more a basher and it suited him. Later in his career he took the volley game to a different level that suited him and it helped him tremendously. Helped him win a career record of 870 - 274 matches won versus lost. Nadal is only 297 - 73.

    Ummm Sampras and Agassi played 34 matches, with Sampras winning 20, thats only 6 more than Agassi. I wouldnt call that a huge leap nor running him down and beating him at his own game. Learn your history.

    You can rip Agassi for his early image, neon and all. Thats the only thing I will concede to your diatribe. However, that image pulled countless number of people into playing than game the just about any other player has.

    Agassi is only 1 of 5 men to ever win a career grandslam. Rafa nor Fed have that yet. I dont see Rafas body holding out til hes 36 like Andre was.

    Agassi has one a gold medal at the olympics, 17 Masters events, more than any other male player ever, 8 grandslams, went from 141 to number 6 in one year, the biggest pleap ever. He was considered the fittest player on tour, even in his later years until his back was too much to overcome.

    I think it would pay you well to do some research on Federer, Nadal, Agassi, Sampras or just about any other player before making arrogant comments that you cannot back up.

    Have your personal preferences and opnions, but dont act a fool.
     
    #32
  33. Serpententacle

    Serpententacle Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2007
    Messages:
    1,561
    Location:
    Raleigh, NC
    I DO think that Nadal has a legit chance at Wimbledon. Don't count him out.

    His chances on hard courts are not good. Hard courts do a number on one's body.

    Just my interjections.
     
    #33
  34. BallzofSkill

    BallzofSkill Professional

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2008
    Messages:
    801
    you're giving reasons why rafa is good, not why he is unequivocally no. 1. Federer shows that's he's no. 1. Unequivocally.
     
    #34
  35. obnoxious2

    obnoxious2 Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2008
    Messages:
    629
    Your whole post was basically an attack on Agassi while you slurp on Rafa's balls. Get over it. Rafa moves like no other on clay but he's still plenty vulnerable on hardcourt and grass. Did you not see the way Davydenko demolisthed him at the Sony Ericsson Open? Rafa's other court games are going to get better but he's still unsure of how the ball will react at times or where he should be placing it.
     
    #35
  36. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2008
    Messages:
    30,972
    Location:
    New York
    Nadal is #1 in the race ranking so far.
     
    #36
  37. daddy

    daddy Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2007
    Messages:
    5,686
    Location:
    Moon Balls
    As he is usually, for the last couple of seasons. He losses to Federer in latter stages of the season, that was the pattern until now.
     
    #37
  38. cknobman

    cknobman Legend

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2007
    Messages:
    6,103
    Location:
    Saudi Arabia
    If your trying to prove that Nadals backhand has improved then making an assanine comment like "Fed will never beat Nadal again on any surface period" isnt the right,smart,logical,sane,sensible thing to do.

    Posting retarted crap like that will just get flamers and people who make fun of your blind stupidity.
     
    #38
  39. Eviscerator

    Eviscerator Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2006
    Messages:
    1,709
    Location:
    S. Florida
    Take away the strings that allow him to hit like that, and he would seem more human, even on clay. Don't get me wrong he is talented, a fighter, and all around great player. However technology in the form of modern racquet's give all players too much of a boost. Add to that the extreme spin generated by the strings of the last 5 years or so, and any talented pro can swing away with full force with a reasonable expectation that the shots will drop in.

    :roll:

    You must be a Nadal fanatic or just lack common sense to make such a comment. Even considering the aforementioned equipment issue, and the fact that they slowed the grass game down significantly, Federer has never lost to Nadal at Wimbledon. So to say Federer will never win another match at Wimbledon or any other surface is just absurd.
     
    #39
  40. eric draven

    eric draven Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2004
    Messages:
    385
    I agree, two Wimbledon finals in a row for a clay-courter is an excellent result and Nadal has closed the gap on Federer since last year. But, I wouldn't count Nadal out on the hard courts either. In the FO final it was the closest I've seen Rafa play to the baseline in all of his FO finals. He's learned to flatten his shots out more (when the opportunity presents itself) and I'll be interested to see how his game translates to grass and hardcourts now. I think it will be harder to be aggressive against him on those surfaces.
     
    #40
  41. Bjorn99

    Bjorn99 Professional

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2006
    Messages:
    1,443
    Aaaaaah, there are truly some sensitive and stupid people here. Oh well, as long as Nadals knee holds up this time at Wimbledon, we will see either him or Djokovic holding the trophy. We won't have to see some fairy swish his hair and imitate Bill Tilden.
     
    #41
  42. hoodjem

    hoodjem G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2007
    Messages:
    12,743
    Location:
    Bierlandt
    Cares who?




    Ohh, sorry, back to the point: is "crush and run" as effective as "shock and awe"?

    At Nadal's present rate of crush and run, he will overtake Borg in three years . . . not in FO championships, but in retiring even earlier.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2008
    #42
  43. GOD_BLESS_RAFA

    GOD_BLESS_RAFA Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2006
    Messages:
    600
    All that matters is that Nadal is free from serious injuries, especially in hard seasonS ...yes seasonS: the first season is at the beginning of the year and the second is in the last of the year...This is it!
    He is number 2 but he knows how to single himself out of number 1 and number 3 and the other players...;)
     
    #43
  44. cknobman

    cknobman Legend

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2007
    Messages:
    6,103
    Location:
    Saudi Arabia
    Well lets look at it like this:

    ------------Currently------ Same Time Last Year
    Federer:----- 6675--------------- 7515
    Nadal: -------5585 ---------------5225
    Djokovic: ----5225 ----------------3010

    If you noticed both Roger and Rafa have lost ground compared to last year. You could say some of the points Roger lost were do to his mono and some were lost due to a general decline in performance. Rafa has lost fewer points but still over 300 short of last year. Novak on the other hand has gained over 2000 points.

    Now Nadal had a good clay court season and all but he is entering the part of the year where is no longer superman. Despite what some Nadal fans think it will not be easy for him to get to Wimby finals or win it this year especially if he faces Novak again(he was lucky last year that Novak was too tired to play).

    Im not saying Fed has it easy the rest of the year and if he certainley dosnt buckle down and get serious he will not be in good shape but I will say that Nadal has it alot harder for the rest of the year than Fed because there is only a few hudred points between Novak and Rafa and Novak has the advantage surface wise from here on out.
     
    #44
  45. prince

    prince Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2004
    Messages:
    752

    clay season is over - regular guys on the tour can beat him at any tournament other than clay surface..
     
    #45
  46. Thor

    Thor Professional

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2006
    Messages:
    972
    Location:
    Valhala
    Actually he gained 300 points,and thats with the packed claycourt schedule that caused him an early exit at Rome.

    Fed actually lost more - but he played Estoril for the first time and gained 200.
     
    #46
  47. cueboyzn

    cueboyzn Professional

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2007
    Messages:
    991
    Location:
    SA
    Originally Posted by Bjorn99:
    No question in my mind, unless Federer hits the chalk on every serve at Wimbledon, there is no way he EVER beats Nadal again, on any surface. Not with the way Nadal can run him now. No way.


    Hahahahah. Your a joke pal!!

    On other surfaces the "Nadal ball" does not kick up above Federer's strike zone. Forehand, and especially, backhand.

    Grass, Hard, Carpet... Lets see what happens the rest of the year. :twisted:
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2008
    #47
  48. fednad

    fednad Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    May 7, 2007
    Messages:
    2,738
    #48
  49. cknobman

    cknobman Legend

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2007
    Messages:
    6,103
    Location:
    Saudi Arabia
    Oops sorry bout that.
     
    #49
  50. Guamanian G

    Guamanian G Rookie

    Joined:
    May 19, 2008
    Messages:
    170
    Location:
    all over the court
    i totally agree with you. I f anyone is a baseline bum, it's nadal.
    Federer is one of the most versatile players on the tour.
    Also, might I add, Federer is not on the fast decline. It's just that his opponents are getting better and feds frustration carries on to the court.
    I predict that the wimbledon final will be: Federer vs Djokavic:)
     
    #50

Share This Page