Wilson will shut down Vortex

Discussion in 'Racquets' started by The Dark Knight, Oct 7, 2012.

  1. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    With lesser number of strings taking the load, will they break easier?
     
    #51
  2. dmcb101

    dmcb101 Semi-Pro

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    I think the idea is that the mains will move more because of less friction due to the decrease in cross strings. The increased movement will make the main strings rub more on the crosses and eventually they will break.
     
    #52
  3. Chotobaka

    Chotobaka Hall of Fame

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    In your case, it might just stand for "stupid". Ya dig?
     
    #53
  4. Ronaldo

    Ronaldo G.O.A.T.

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    Suggest skipping every other main and cross in the sweetspot where most balls are struck. The trampoline effect and uneven response has to be incredible. Maybe poly alleviates the problems. Anyone with a stringer should try it.
     
    #54
  5. ChicagoJack

    ChicagoJack Hall of Fame

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    Uugh. Dude, what is your deal? Not the first time Ive seen you post stuff like this. It would be super awesome if you could back waaay offa the name calling.

    -Jack
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2012
    #55
  6. Ronaldo

    Ronaldo G.O.A.T.

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    Can you tube the 1st four mains?
     
    #56
  7. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Anything that increases spin should be banned - doesn't matter what it is or what the technology is. Spin should come from your technique and hard practice and not from your racquet or your strings.
     
    #57
  8. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Actually, next will be the lasagna stringed racquets. :shock:
     
    #58
  9. themitchmann

    themitchmann Hall of Fame

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    That wouldn't be legal. The stringbed cannot be less dense in the center than the rest of the pattern. Therefore, you need to completely redesign the racquet/string pattern.

    Also, the only pics I've seen online of one of the new Prince racquets has a 16x16 pattern. Being used by Antonia Lottner.
     
    #59
  10. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    Actually you want to reduce the trampoline effect.

    The trampoline effect is what causes a loss of control but gives power.

    By reducing the number of cross strings you have less trampoline effect and more spin and control.


    Think of it this way.....if you had only mains and no crosses you would have great spin but little trampoline effect.

    The spaghetti racquets had enormous spin but no power. By reducing the crosses Wilson has created less power /trampoline and more spin through the mains moving. Power comes from the crosses and spin comes from the mains.

    Less power with more spin will allow you to swing harder and still control the ball. Without the trampoline effect you can swing hard....racket head spead is another factor in spin.
     
    #60
  11. Sander001

    Sander001 Hall of Fame

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    So since your 16x19 racquet produces more spin than an18x20, it should be banned; it's an unfair advantage.
    Must be quite the ethical struggle each time you step on the tennis court.
     
    #61
  12. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    Ya know I was thinking ....

    They should make one in a 90 inch frame .

    I bet it would help Fed?
     
    #62
  13. Rock Strongo

    Rock Strongo Legend

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    We should all be playing the old 22x30 Pro Kennex Micro racquets strung at a very high tension, all to completely eliminate ANY spin.
     
    #63
  14. SoBad

    SoBad Legend

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    I am switching to a 18#20 Tfight320.
     
    #64
  15. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    Too much steam for ya? ....bit too wild ? i understand you need somethimg a bit more tame like an 18x20......its always about control for women. :).
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2012
    #65
  16. Ronaldo

    Ronaldo G.O.A.T.

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    The Steam may just be full of hot air.
     
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  17. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    Lol ....good one !

    You have to take it for a ride and find out !
     
    #67
  18. SFrazeur

    SFrazeur Legend

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    Increases spin over what standard?

    -SF
     
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  19. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    If that's true, then yes, it should be banned. But the thing is, I get just as much spin, sometimes even more spin, with 18x20 racquets as I do with 16x19 racquets. Why? Because I generate spin with my technique and not with my racquet or strings. I generate just as much spin with multis as I do with poly strings, which is why I don't use poly. I don't choose racquets because of string pattern because I can hit with as much spin with any pattern.
     
    #69
  20. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    The standard 65 sq. in. wood racquet with the standard 18x20 pattern strung with the standard natural gut strings. :)

    The reason why 85 sq. in. racquet are called MIDsize and 107 sq. in. racquets are called OVERsize is because 65 sq. in. racquets are the STANDARD size.
     
    #70
  21. dmcb101

    dmcb101 Semi-Pro

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    I think the game has evolved and it is silly to try and "standardize" equipment so that people can hit with better technique. Regardless of who is playing, the ones with the best technique will be the best over those who have the same equipment with poor technique. The only thing that can come from using a wood racquet and 18X20 string pattern is the same old game. When everyone uses new technology the game evolves (whether you think that is good or bad) at an equal level from the club player up to the pro's; the best technique will always prevail regardless of the technology!
     
    #71
  22. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    Then you better file a case against Federer, because he has been using a special open pattern in the sweetzone.
     
    #72
  23. Justin-JP

    Justin-JP Rookie

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    Sounds to me like you want the 'standard' from your generation to last forever. This is 2012, not 1980. You're also using a graphite racket with an open pattern in contradiction with your argument.

    Everyone generates spin with technique, regardless of how slow or poor that form maybe. If you cannot produce more spin with poly, then well, it says something for your technique to develop racket head speed. I now understand why you feel bitter about tech enhancements; you'd love to make use of them (see the racket you have) but do not have the form to do so, and thus, poly et al should be banned.
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2012
    #73
  24. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    What's so special about it? :confused:

    His racquet has equal string spacing in the sweetzone. It was the retail version of the nCode90 that had denser string spacing in the sweetzone than the rest of the stringbed. So there was never anything "special" about his stringbed. It was the retail nCode90 that had a "special" stringbed.
     
    #74
  25. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    And why should standards change? Aren't the standards for equipment in baseball the same in 2012 as they were in 1980? Isn't the size of the standard tennis court the same in 2012 as it was in 1980?

    I don't produce spin with poly because I hit flat and I swing pretty fast. And I don't use poly because I don't want my arm to fall off and I want to be able to play tennis for the rest of my life.
     
    #75
  26. SoBad

    SoBad Legend

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    As an insecure fragile babushka I look for the ultimate control in a frame because I can generate all the power using my technique.:cry:
     
    #76
  27. Sander001

    Sander001 Hall of Fame

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    So if that's your belief, then why are you getting defensive about a technology you know does not work?
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2012
    #77
  28. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    Insecure babuska? I think not. I'm definitely a fan.....I'd like to see your technique some time. :)
     
    #78
  29. Justin-JP

    Justin-JP Rookie

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    Why should standards not change? We're not talking dimensions of the court but advancements in equipment technology used to play said sports. Every sport has seen some technological advancement, no matter how small, and will continue to do so as companies push out their latest and greatest 'new' tech. Some are gimmicky and some work (poly), and some push it too far (spaghetti strings).

    Anyways, you've killed your own argument by using modern tech and with a spin friendly open pattern to boot. Not only that, the only reason you're not using a poly is that is does not suit your style of play and is hard on your arm. You then begrudge anyone else's game where poly works for them. These are hardly valid reasons.
     
    #79
  30. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    Dude you don't get it......breakpoint is a classic type of player.

    Seriously if it were up to him we would all go back to wood and gut strings.

    That's what he believes in and there's nothing wrong with that.

    To him babolat is a dirty word. He wants the game to go back to when it was pure......he doesn't believe in technology.

    Just to be clear , I don't agree with him . I LOVE technology and all te new ideas more than anyone. I play with a vortex!!! But I respect his point of view......no reason to argue.
     
    #80
  31. SoBad

    SoBad Legend

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    I hit with a lot of topspin and moonball ALOT, beware...
     
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  32. SFrazeur

    SFrazeur Legend

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    And this is why you personally use a wood racquet strung with natural gut. . .ooh right, you don't. If you believe so strongly then why are you not? Fight the good fight then.

    -SF
     
    #82
  33. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    So what's with the four horses in your avatar? Amd are you seriously from Jamiaca NY?

    I used to be around 179th and hillside a while back....long story.
     
    #83
  34. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    It obviously does work or else Wilson wouldn't be coming out with these racquets. But it shouldn't be allowed to work because players shouldn't be allowed to use it. If players want to generate more spin, they should go work on their technique, not just buy a new racquet.
     
    #84
  35. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Was there something wrong with tennis back in 1980? Absolutely not! In fact, tennis was more popular in the U.S. in 1980 and more people played tennis in 1980 during the wood ear than they do now. So obviously people back then had no problem with wood racquets and gut strings and probably liked them more than they like the modern graphite racquets and poly strings of today, which is why more people played tennis back then than they do now.

    I did use a wood racquet a few years ago and still was able to beat players who used modern graphite racquets. I stopped because they crack easily and I didn't want to break mine. I would be more than happy to go back to using wood racquets if everyone else would as well to even out the competition. In fact, I'm a huge advocate (along with McEnroe and Navratilova) of going back to wood racquets. Tennis was so much more pure back then. I use the racquet I use now because it's the closest thing to a wood racquet still on the market.
     
    #85
  36. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    I do use a wood racquet and I still would if everyone else also used wood racquets. It has to be fair. It wouldn't be fair to be the only batter in baseball to use a wooden bat if all the other batters get to use powerful aluminum bats, would it?

    As it is, I use the closest thing to a wood racquet still available (PS 6.0 85).
     
    #86
  37. tailofdog

    tailofdog Semi-Pro

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    #87
  38. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    I understand you Break.....I don't agree with you but I get it.

    Your view point is a beautiful thing actually .

    Maybe all this new technology is wrong .....

    Personally I like it because it makes tennis easier and more fun . I also find today's tennis way more exciting than the old days

    But I do get you and I'm not saying your wrong.....how can you be? It's your opinion and it's a beautiful one . So I say bravo to you.

    And now I also see why you are such a fan of Sampras and Federer. It all makes sense.....they are both oldschool......but Nadal with his high tech Babolat and Luxilon strings is an affront to everything that you believe in. I get it breakpoint ......I really do. And I respect it.

    I on the other hand have different reasons for rooting for Nadal......nothing to so with tech........

    It's actually that I hate the establishment. I'm a rebel......

    My idols are Mcenroe, Nastase, Connors, Agassi ( early days with punk hair), Safin, Nadal, Seles , Serena......all have that bit of wildness ...... They all sort of rock the establishment .....and thats why I'm a fan.
     
    #88
  39. SoBad

    SoBad Legend

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    i knew it - you are one of those black-pakistani dudes that walk around 179pl with pipes and pitbulls and make strange comments toward wht ppl...
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3V0g1gM2P6o
     
    #89
  40. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    Charashow.....did I say that right?

    Did you see....and I'm gonna say this wrong ...

    Nochne dozor? night watch .....great Russian vampire movie.
     
    #90
  41. SoBad

    SoBad Legend

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    I don't know - I am going to watch Baron now until I fall asleep.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWjQ9kUNe_8

    P.S. Or maybe they will break down the door and use fire extinguishers to put out the fire burning inside my heart and soul.
     
    #91
  42. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    LOL.....I was supposed to go to Europe today .....eastern Europe actually .....but lost my freaking passport . So I'm a bit bummed out.

    So just took an ambien....should be asleep in an hour.

    Ambien works pretty well for fires in the heart and soul as well....lol.
     
    #92
  43. SoBad

    SoBad Legend

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    The TTW community is falling asleep. They just sit around, taking pharma pills and drinking drinks, smoking various smokes, until they fall asleep. The lost and stolen passports are deep in the past.
     
    #93
  44. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    Comparison of the steam 99s and Vortex tour 100. I'm not exactly certain of the specs for either racquet....these are rumored specs .


    Steam 99S -

    10.7 unstrung ,
    99 sq. inch.,
    16x15,
    22-24-22mm ,

    Vortex tour 100

    100 square inches
    Length: 27 in.
    Weight: 11 ounces unstrung
    Balance: 12 pts HL unstrung
    Pattern: 14m x 17c
    Flex: 70#RA
    Beam: 21.5mm straight beam
     
    #94
  45. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    Tennis is a sport that changes over time so the idea that it should remain fixed in the wood era is absurd, but I'm sure there's wooden framed grass court tournaments that one can enjoy.
     
    #95
  46. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Why? Is it written in stone somewhere?

    Aren't the dimensions of the court and the height of the net the same as it's been for the past couple of hundred years? If they could standardize on those things, why couldn't they also standardize on the racquets and strings?

    People drive themselves crazy trying the hundreds of different strings and different racquets out there and not knowing if they're using the best combination and always wondering if there's something even better out there. Imagine if there was only one racquet and one string. You can stop obsessing over your choice of racquet and string and just focus on improving your game knowing that neither you nor your opponent has an advantage in equipment. Spending your time practicing your strokes will improve your game much more than spending all your time researching and trying the hundreds of strings and racquets and combinations of them until you tear your hair out.
     
    #96
  47. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    There's always a mix of continuity and change with the court obviously a point of continuity, but racquets are not.

    The shift to the larger framed, topspin oriented game is a positive development but I'd watch old-style tennis if it were available.

    The essential problem is that the game is dominated by horizontal movement from the back of the court and vertical movement forward and back from the net has disappeared.

    This is indeed something that might be engineered back into the game, and it partly is with the increased use of the drop shot but the approach and volley is too high risk a shot these days.

    And thats a pity.
     
    #97
  48. themitchmann

    themitchmann Hall of Fame

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    If everything is standardized regarding racquets, then we would loss a number if racquet companies (and therefore jobs) in the process.

    Offering variety adds to the marketplace.
     
    #98
  49. themitchmann

    themitchmann Hall of Fame

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    But, I do agree with BP that it would be a great thing for people to focus on improving technique over switching to a new stick.
     
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  50. Shaolin

    Shaolin Hall of Fame

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    Hey Breakpoint, in your avatar you have a picture of a guy who is using a more powerful/tech assisted frame from what he used for 20+ years. Just thought you should know.

    Ps, he's using a Luxilon hybrid now.
     

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