Wilson will shut down Vortex

Discussion in 'Racquets' started by The Dark Knight, Oct 7, 2012.

  1. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    I hit those balls with either slice back or relatively flat and hard which goes over the net by an inch. In either case, poly is not going to help me with spin.
     
  2. Gasolina

    Gasolina Professional

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    Why all the hate for these new racquets? If a person wants or doesn't want to use the racquet then let them be. Let them make the decision.

    I use 17 guage co-poly strings at low tensions on 1 16x19 HL flexy racquet. My game revolves around spin. I don't think its cheating if you're just using available gear that works well for your game.
     
  3. Sander001

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  4. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    So are you saying that I'm just a better player than you since I can get just as much spin out of an 18x20 racquet and you can't? OK, I guess the truth comes out. :)
     
  5. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    But that's the point. Maybe this gear shouldn't be made available. Maybe it should be the player that generates the spin and not his gear.

    I mean if Borg could generate lots of spin using a 65 sq. in. wood racquet with an 18x20 pattern strung with natural gut, every player should be able too if they worked hard enough on their strokes.
     
  6. DoctorBackhand

    DoctorBackhand Rookie

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    Borg was also a tennis pro whose profession it was to play tennis.
    For those of us who play for fun, I don't see why having a modern racket is a big deal.

    In fact, I don't really get what your fascination is here that causes you to obsess over what racket other people use. If you are winning, you shouldn't really care what racket your opponent uses if your better than them.

    Isn't that why Federer still uses a 90?:wink:
     
  7. Sander001

    Sander001 Hall of Fame

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    No mods for obvious troll bait? Well then.
    Since you like truth coming out, then you'll be glad that we've all discovered that you're an elitist snob with a superiority complex. :)
     
  8. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    On the forehand side ?

    What do you do in doubles?

    If a ball is sliced low at you then you must lift it to get by the net man.

    What about on the run to the the forehand? You slice that as well?

    I'm not questioning you I'm just curious ?
     
  9. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Yes, I know but my point is that it CAN be done because we saw Borg do it. Even today, if you use an APD you're not going to hit the ball just like Nadal. But we know it CAN be done because we see Nadal do it all day long.

    I just think we need to stop this nuclear arms race now and stop all of these ever increasingly more powerful and more spinny racquets and strings. It should be the player producing the power and spin, not the racquet and strings.
     
  10. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Yes, I often slice my forehand to lift low balls over the net, especially on the run. It works great. :) But if I get to the ball a bit earlier, I'll drive it flat with very little net clearance, especially in doubles in which I try to hit all shots very low over the net to make it more difficult for my opponents to hit aggressive volleys.
     
  11. Chotobaka

    Chotobaka Hall of Fame

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    Excellent way to end the point quickly in doubles. Unfortunately, not in your favor.
     
  12. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    I do it more often in singles than in doubles unless both opponents are in the back court. In doubles, if both opponents are at the net and I get to the low ball late, I'll either flick the ball down the middle or down the sideline or at an sharp angle or lob over their heads. :)
     
  13. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    But why not use topspin sometimes? I mean I'm not prejudiced against any stroke . I use them all.....so does Federer and actually all the pros.

    And they alway have ......Borg used topspin , Laver had some top as well believe it or not.
     
  14. dmcb101

    dmcb101 Semi-Pro

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  15. Readers

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    You are stupid, if you play with 65 woody now, you LOSE.
     
  16. Readers

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    So you have 1 RPM slice as well? LOL.
     
  17. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Um....and you think that was my point?

    If EVERYONE used a 65 sq. in. wood racquet, who would win? I'd bet you that the better player would win and not the one with the better racquet or strings. THAT'S my point!

    So who did you say was "stupid"?
     
  18. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    How many people switch to poly strings because they slice every single ball? You don't need poly strings to help you slice better.
     
  19. Readers

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    Doesn't matter, by your logic, it has to be banned.
     
  20. Readers

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    You are, why would everyone use 65 sq woody when 90-110 sq graphite let them play better and WIN? That's called progress you idiot. 90-110 sq graphite = play better tennis= beat people with 65 woody.
     
  21. Readers

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    BTW when everyone use 90-110 sq graphite frame, better player still wins, you indeed do not have a point and is hopelessly retarded.
     
  22. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Why would all fencers use swords when an AK-47 would do the job so much better and make it easier for them to win? Isn't that progress? Why do baseball players use wooden bats when aluminum bats would make it easier for them to hit home runs? Isn't that progress? Why do cyclists ride bicycles when motorcycles would make it so much easier for them to win races? Isn't that progress?

    Oh, and how is today's tennis "better" than before? Because it isn't! It's worse! That's regression, not progress.
     
  23. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    If that's the case, why are there so many threads saying that Federer needs to switch to a bigger racquet if he wants to keep winning? Obviously, a lot of people think a bigger racquet makes it easier for you to win than a smaller one, right? So why do people think Federer would play better if he switched to Murray's or Djokovic's or Nadal's racquet?

    During the wood era, I NEVER heard anyone say that McEnroe would win more if he switched from his wood racquet to Borg's wood racquet or Gerulaitis' wood racquet. Why? Because everyone knew that they were all pretty much the same and didn't give any player an advantage over another. That's obviously no longer true today. Or else why do so many people here keep buying or trying new racquets and new strings all the time? Obviously, they feel they gain an advantage with them.
     
  24. Readers

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    Dude you are totally retarded, first, no one in sports of fencing is trying to kill, so AK-47 or 74 won't work... also there rules about racquet, no one is going to bring a wall or a ball shooting machine-gun on court.

    You are just so stupid.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2012
  25. Readers

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    Because he plays BETTER with a bigger racquet.

    Because the world is progressing, that's why things never happened before happens now.
     
  26. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    The rule should be no racquet bigger than 65 sq. in. and no poly strings. Just like the rule in fencing is no rifles allowed and the rule at the Tour de France is no motorcycles allowed. Just because something exists or can be made doesn't mean it should be allowed in the sport because it changes the sport. Everyone agrees that tennis does not resemble the sport it was 40 years ago and that it's completely different today. And no one is going to argue that allowing motorcycles would completely change the sport of cycling. That's why they don't allow them.
     
  27. Readers

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    Sorry, but it's a good thing we don't have retards making rules for tennis.

    Also, stop comparing powered illegal **** to legit tennis gear without power source.
     
  28. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    So then you admit that the racquet today makes a difference and that it's not just who the better player is that will win. No one discussed the differences in wood racquets when one player beat another during the wood era. No one ever said that this pro should switch to a different wood racquet if he wants to play better. Everyone knew that it was the player himself who won or lost and that the racquet he used made no difference whatsoever. Not so today, is it?
     
  29. Readers

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    No, you are stupid, everyone is using the racquet that let them play the best, so the better player still wins.

    If some pro is just stupid as you are and refuse to use the racquet that let them play the best tennis, they are just bad players, as intelligence is part of tennis skill set
     
  30. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    How many time does the word "power" appear in advertising for today's modern racquets?

    And there are restrictions to the weight and size of bicycles and the type of tires that can be used in competition. Why are there essentially no restrictions to tennis racquets and strings? If there were, there wouldn't be so many different racquets of all shapes, sizes, and weights on the market and hundreds of different strings on the market, all of which can be legally used in tennis.
     
  31. Readers

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    There are, STFU.

    Also, by your dumbass logic, they need to ban carbon fiber, aluminum, and titanium bicycles frame too.

    Maybe steel is unfair too? So why is no one riding a wood one now? LOL
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2012
  32. Readers

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    You are really so stupid, why don't you learn the difference between power of a tennis frame and externally powered gear before wasting more of other people's time?
     
  33. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    You just said that Federer would play "better" with a bigger racquet so that he's not using the racquet that lets him play his best. Are you saying Federer is a "bad player" and is not "intelligent"?

    Would Nadal play as well with Federer's racquet as with his APD? No? Then Nadal is not the better player himself, is he? It's his racquet that makes him the better player, not himself.
     
  34. Readers

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    You are not just stupid, but also a deceptive ass trying to put word in other people's mouth.

    Federer plays better with a 90 than 85, that's why he switched to a bigger frame to go on and win 17 slams, that's why he is smart, not retarded like you.

    Federer plays better with a 90 and Nadal with a 100, got a probelm you brainless ape?
     
  35. Hi I'm Ray

    Hi I'm Ray Hall of Fame

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    Lol. Gotta love BP for the hilarious stuff. What if BP doesn't even use woodies or a PS 85 and he just trolls ppl here for kicks because its so easy to :)
     
  36. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Today's Pure Drive is a bazooka compared to a Maxply Fort wood racquet. It is essentially the difference between a revolver and an AK-47 automatic machine gun. Would they allow an AK-47 in a duel?
     
  37. Readers

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    Given this guy's behavior and time on forum, he probably doesn't have anyone want to hang out with him IRL, so this is all he left to do, kind of pathetic.

    The key is not to take him serious, toy with him when you got the time, and ignore him when you get bored or have better things to do.
     
  38. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Readers just keeps digging a bigger hole for himself. All the name calling in every post will just get him banned quicker, yet he keeps doing it. And he's the one calling others "stupid". :lol: LOL
     
  39. Chotobaka

    Chotobaka Hall of Fame

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    Insightful.
     
  40. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    Thanks for that!

    I took out the most interesting parts.....this racquet sounds revolutionary for recreational players:

    And what happens with the 16x15 pattern is that, compared to a 16x18, not only do the strings move a lot further, but they also snap back really violently. It makes sense. With less friction, the strings deflect further, and because they move further out of place, they snap back past their original position. Which increases the amount of rotation that the strings are able to impart on the ball.

    Putting fewer and fewer cross strings does increase the amount that the mains are moving. But the big jump is between a regular pattern and just one less cross string, the 16/15. And as you go more and more open on the pattern, according to playtesters, it gets harder and harder to control the ball. So we think 16 by 15 is the right combination, even if you do get a little more string movement with even fewer crosses. With the 16/15, we think you benefit with the increase in spin without the negative of decreased control.

     We’ve found that a 16x15 string pattern has a more dramatic effect on players of average ability, actually. There’s still an effect for better players, but our research shows that it’s not quite as pronounced for them, as they’re already swinging so fast and causing the strings to snap back.

    The snap-back effect, yes, it’s definitely maximized by a monofilament, a Luxilon-type string. You don’t see the effect with nylon or gut strings. They just move…but don’t snap back. That’s why players who play nylon or gut, they’re always straightening their strings between points. Which is why we’re hypothesizing that it’s the snap-back—the recoil of the string at a faster speed—that has more to do with the additional spin than how far the string moves out of place. At this point, however, we can’t say for sure.

    Further to the point, people typically use examples of airplanes or cars when thinking about aerodynamics. But the problem is, airplanes and cars move in one direction; on the other hand, tennis racquets are moving in all different directions during the swing. Sometimes a racquet is moving vertically, sometimes horizontally. It’s just not moving in one direction. From our perspective, we haven’t found much evidence suggesting that a racquet’s aerodynamics can significantly influence players’ swing and spin production.
     
  41. themitchmann

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    Not a god comparison. Duels are won with 1 quick shot. The AK would be too slow, and automatic fire wouldn't make a difference.
     
  42. themitchmann

    themitchmann Hall of Fame

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    There regulations on the dimensions of a legal racquet and string patterns. Almost everything on the market abides by these rules.
     
  43. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    You will get banned if you continue to post such insults
     
  44. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    I think Nadal would be able to play with Feds racquet.

    It's the strings that really make the difference.

    Everyone pays so much attention to the racquets but strings are so much more important .

    The strings are the soul of a racquet.

    As with the new steam .....it's not the racquet but the strings that make all the difference .
     
  45. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    It is not the same issue. Here the role of strings is different from comparing different strings on the same racket. Here the role is tied to the drilling pattern and the benefits (if true) should accrue to all strings.
     
  46. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    I'm not sure I understand what your saying? I think I understand though?

    when I say " strings" im also referring to the pattern of the strings.

    Racquet to me means weight , balance , size, materials.....the actual racquet itself.

    For example spaghetti strings was a pattern as well.

    There's soooooo much more to strings than the graphite.

    You can make Feds racquet play similar to a babolat of you wanted to.

    It's all depends on the strings.....tension , pattern , thickness, materials , hybrid etc etc etc.

    There's only so much you can do with a piece of graphite.

    Take a look at Borg and Mcenroe. They played with the same racquet virtually.....both wood , both the same size and pattern......

    Except that Mcenroe played with extremely loose strings while Borg played with extremely tight strings. Their styles am the way they hot the ball were completely different . The racquets were almost identical but the sticks played completely differently becaise of the strings.

    The same principles apply today.
     
  47. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    OK you are including string pattern also.
     
  48. The Dark Knight

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    Yes .

    .
     
  49. The Dark Knight

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    I think the steam is going to make tennis easier to play for the average player but it won't make it on the pro tour.

    This "sling shot" effect I think will work on topspin very well.

    As you slice the ball it will sort of "shoot" the ball out.

    Basically you won't have to swing all that hard for any stroke and just let the strings do the work for you.

    It's not a serious players stick. In the right hands however like a santoro it could be deadly.
     
  50. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Legend

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    I just saw some new specs on the Wilson.....it's going to be 11.3 ounces strung which is just what I like.

    I had written the stick off because it was weighted at 10.2.....I've never been so excited about the release of any stick.

    I really think this is going to be revolutionary and all sticks will carry similar patterns in the future.

    I've know this for a while playing with the Vortex.....the open string pattern is really just a better set up.
     

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