WORLD NO. 1 (by year)

Discussion in 'Former Pro Player Talk' started by hoodjem, Oct 30, 2009.

  1. Phoenix1983

    Phoenix1983 Hall of Fame

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    I do admire Rosewall, I think he's a Tier 1 candidate and had unsurpassed longevity near the top of the game.
     
  2. treblings

    treblings Hall of Fame

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    i think my post is clear enough.
    i was talking about kroseros excellent research finding articles that contained clear rankings of 1964
     
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  3. Limpinhitter

    Limpinhitter G.O.A.T.

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    In my view, your recent posts on the subject have been attempts to obfuscate the issue. I think my posts have been much more clear. Apparently, you don't like the fact that Laver was the best player in 1964, had the best record in 1964, and deserves the #1 ranking for 1964. Further, you implied that you were aware of an "official" ranking for 1964. But, after several requests, you have failed to identify one.
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2016
  4. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    krosero, Again thanks for your serious and logical post. It's mostly a pleasure for me to read your posts. You possess an interesting personal style unlike to all other posters including my own style.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2016 at 5:01 PM
  5. Dan Lobb

    Dan Lobb Hall of Fame

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    You pat my back, I will pat yours....zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
     
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  6. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    krosero, I guess your convincing arguments could convince even some doubters!
     
  7. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    Dan, It's senseless.
     
  8. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    Dan, You again err: Hoad was one of the most prolific players at all in 1964!

    Laver did not doubt Buchholz's article and Rosewall's No.1 place until a few years ago when he publiced his new book. I trust the contemporary Buchholz and Laver more than the old Buchholz and old Laver who judge 50 years after the tour was played. Furthermore Butch answered to a wrong question ("130 day tour").
     
  9. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    treblings, I still hope that explaining the facts will convince some people, even in this curious forum...
     
  10. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    treblings, You said it: A few posters here don't want to be convinced at all and to learn from others.

    We all as human beings should be ready to learn from other people.
     
  11. NonP

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    Are you trying to set a record for the most irony displayed by an individual poster in an online forum?
     
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  12. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    Dan, You err again: The long championship tour did not include 4 man-tournaments at all as they were in November, with a possible exception of the big Wembley Golden Racquet tourney of the 4 star pros.

    Don't you think that Laver would have protested if Rosewall immediately had finished the tour prematurely where Rod was rather close to Muscles in points? Rosewall is not the man who decides high-handed without contacting his colleagues. Don't forget that Buchhholz wrote that "our No.1 player, Ken Rosewall, sets an example for all of us by not asking for special favors"?

    By the way, I just realize that Buchholz wrote 5 (five) times that Rosewall was the No.1 player in 1964, once even "unquestionably"! You ignored that totally...

    But maybe you even think that Butch is a liar who lied five times...
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2016 at 5:30 PM
  13. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    Limpinhitter, Your hate increases from post to post. You even refuse to understand krosero's hypothetical but reasonable quoting.

    We find your continuous referring to a 130 day tour very odd. I must confess that a longer time ago I also mentioned a 130 day tour before krosero figured out that it was a 185 day tour. I'm sorry for my mistake. I confused the tour with Buchholz's title in World Tennis "My 130 Days with Rosewall, Laver & Co.".

    But it's your big and nasty mistake to ignore the krosero findings and still fantasize about a 130 m. m. tour...

    Nobody has established that there was no world championship tour in 1964.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2016 at 9:21 AM
  14. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    Mrs. Limpinhitter (or are you male???), Where do you see a Rosewall campaign? I only see an anti-Rosewall campaign created by you...
     
  15. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    Dan, That's the reason why your absurd claim is nonsense: Rosewall would not have dared to snub Laver and the other players by making unfair decisions!!
     
  16. Limpinhitter

    Limpinhitter G.O.A.T.

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    He sets a new record with every post. Ditto the online hypocrisy record.
     
  17. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    Phoenix, I hope he also has good longevity regarding his life-time. Maybe he will become a second Mulloy...
     
  18. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    treblings, Thanks for your clear words and your endeavour to post serious statements. Some will never understand seriosity and truth...
     
  19. Dan Lobb

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    Bobby, read my response to Krosero.
     
  20. Dan Lobb

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    It is senseless to challenge a direct statement by Buchholz.
     
  21. Dan Lobb

    Dan Lobb Hall of Fame

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    Bobby, Buchholz' 1964 article makes it clear that Hoad was only a part-timer in 1964....the top 4 touring players were Rosewall, Laver, Gimeno, and Buchholz.
     
  22. Dan Lobb

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    Bobby, you should read my post above..of course, Laver would not make a public disagreement with Rosewall over the schedule in 1964, the pros could not afford that.
     
  23. Dan Lobb

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    Bobby, read Krosero's post...the pros could not afford a public dispute...they were financially below the amateurs at this point.
     
  24. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    Limpin, Read krosero's post with the newspaper quotings and rankings of 1964 and 1965. Read especially the rankings of August 25 where there is clearly written that the tour was a pro world championship. Read also the Buchholz article where Butch gives the 1964 final rankings and writes 5, five, FIVE, F I V E (fünf) times that Rosewall was the 1964 No.1 player, once even "unquestionably the No.1 player". Even an ignoramus like you should be able to read clear English written words. You surely don't want to be called an idiot! I can understand that. So get real!!!

    It's due time now to apologize for your several lies, especially that curious "40 majors" lie!!!
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2016 at 9:28 AM
  25. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    Obnoxious person!
     
  26. Dan Lobb

    Dan Lobb Hall of Fame

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    Bobby, another post by you, and another waste of space on this thread....zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
     
  27. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    NonP, I'm just trying to write intelligent and serious posts and to ignore non-serious posters like you...
     
  28. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    Limpinhitter, Alas, I at the most can gain a bronze medal (more probably only a 14th place). I must congratulate to your GOLD medals for intelligence, integrity, tennis knowledge, English reading capacity, fairness, noblesse, exact research, non-bias and so on. But over all you can be proud for getting the Talk Tennis DIAMANT medal for honesty: Phoenix1983, Dan Lobb and NonP have meticulously researched and never found any lie from yourself. I'm forced to say: such noble men with their famous integrity just cannot be wrong. So I salute to you. May you long continue to enlighten the TT readers!
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2016 at 9:30 AM
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  29. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    ...but he would have been his enemy after that. But he was not.

    You are so nasty that you even distort krosero's clear post. Disgusting.

    Please tell us exactly how the question and the answer were. Thanks.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 23, 2016 at 8:02 AM
  30. Limpinhitter

    Limpinhitter G.O.A.T.

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    Let's review, in 1964, Laver lead Rosewall in every material respect:

    - Laver lead Rosewall in total titles 11-10,
    - Laver lead Rosewall in pro major titles 2-1,
    - Laver lead Rosewall in total matches won 81 to 69,
    - Laver lead Rosewall in winning percentage 75% (81-27) to 70% (69-30),
    - Laver lead Rosewall in H2H matches by a dominating 15-4.

    There was no World Championship Tour in 1964.
    Buchholz confirmed to pc1 that the 130 day tour was not a World Championship Tour.
    Buchholz did not say that Rosewall was #1 for 1964.
    I have seen no newspaper clipping calling the 130 day tour a World Championship Tour. But, even if it was, so what? The above record is conclusive regarding the whole year of 1964.
     
  31. treblings

    treblings Hall of Fame

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    you even failed to read my post correctly:)

    two simple paragraphs
    in the first paragraph i talked about kroseros material, newspaper articles
    and World Tennis articles that confirmed Rosewall was considered no. 1 at the time.

    in the second paragraph i mentioned your stats

    how could my post be clearer?

    the issue is also quite clear. If, and everything points in this direction, Rosewall
    was ranked no. 1 in 1964 by his fellow pros, that threatens your opinion, that Laver
    was no.1 alone.

    how this can become so important for you, that you try to ridicule other opinions by
    talking about "magical mystery tour" and "paper clippings" is beyond me.

    but maybe you have a second issue?
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2016 at 1:13 AM
  32. NonP

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    I see my suggestion to you earlier about developing a self-deprecating sense of humor was well taken.

    And I see that you're still blabbering on about 1964, despite your previous assurances that you'd no longer do so, and also that you're now grouping me with the "non-serious" side after this apostasy on my part, again despite your earlier statement to the contrary when my post was more to your liking. FYI I've already written at least twice in no uncertain terms that I think the Laverites got it wrong on this matter (if not in their conclusion about the overall year), but apparently even that is not enough for you.

    This childish tendency of yours to see things in black and white isn't just limited to the issue of '64. When krosero gently chided you in his rare criticism of your behavior that most would agree could hardly be more friendly and constructive you went ballistic at him for not supporting you 100% and even went so far as to question your friendship after this supposed blasphemy. And you've gotta be the only one I know who takes such an obsessive interest in such a silly thing as giving likes in an Internet forum, again without any hint of understanding that one may not agree with something 100% to give his/her approval.

    I was going to say I hope you don't act like such a spoiled child in real life because otherwise you'd make life miserable for everyone and not only yourself, but I know that'd be just an empty expression of concern because I strongly suspect this is the real you who barely acts in a more mature manner in the real world only because of the social sanctions imposed on everyone without an online mask to hide behind. Well I've got a news flash for you: the type of "friendship" you like to imagine in your head doesn't exist in reality. The only people who deserve and (occasionally if not always, alas) receive such unconditional love and support are literally prepubescent children who cannot yet tell right from wrong and survive on their own in the outside world. Adults and even teenagers expect several things in return when they decide to befriend someone, not the least of which is that he/she acts in accordance with and recognizance of this basic social convention, but you don't seem to be even aware of such a simple fact of life. In fact your comically naive notion of friendship reminds me of Plato's quip in Phaedo about misanthropy, which he astutely observed "develops when without art one puts complete trust in somebody thinking the man absolutely true and sound and reliable and then a little later discovers him to be bad and unreliable ... and when it happens to someone often ... he ends up ... hating everyone" (this quote comes from Wiki, look it up).

    It's well past time you grow up and accept that "friends" don't turn into "enemies" all of a sudden when they don't mindlessly support you like a zombie 24/7 even though your behavior doesn't deserve it. And until you do you really should think about taking a break from all online forums and not just this one for everyone's sake. As several posters have lamented this thread used to be one of the best on TT but has turned into a puerile food fight and a Dr. Phil-style gabfest all rolled into one thanks to your inability to leave well enough alone. Either change your act or follow your own directive to leave. Your choice.

    P.S. You're as usual way off when you say Fidelio boasts the greatest ending of all operas. The correct answer is Don Giovanni, or The Marriage of Figaro in a more comic vein.
     
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  33. Dan Lobb

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    Not everyone becomes an "enemy" over a disagreement....some of us are more rational than that.
     
  34. Dan Lobb

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    Bobby, we have been over this a few million times...you already know the answer...another waste of space by you.
     
  35. NatF

    NatF Talk Tennis Guru

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    @krosero just wanted to say I have seen your newest post. Will try and get to it at some point in the next couple of days. Our discussions normally require a little more thought on my part :D
     
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  36. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    Dan Lobb, What was Buchholz's statement and what was the question?
     
  37. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    Dan, Hoad played all the important events in 1964. You as a Hoad expert should know that!!
     
  38. hoodjem

    hoodjem G.O.A.T.

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    Is the Buchholz article available on-line? (I would like to read it.)
     
  39. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    Curious Limpin, Of course Buchholz did confirm that the 130 day tour was not a world champioship tour. It really was not. Only in your fantasy there is a question if it was or not was. All the serious posters know that the 130 day tour was not the world championship. krosero has clearly shown that it was not. So what?

    Of course Butch did not say that Rosewall was No.1 for 1964, you funny woman or man: He was not asked at all about that!!!

    Learn to read clear English sentences!!!
     
  40. hoodjem

    hoodjem G.O.A.T.

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    Does anyone have a list of the tournaments/cities that composed this 185-day Pro tour?
     
  41. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    treblings, I admire your calm reaction to Limpinhitter's insulting posts. He or she has a nasty agenda: to belittle one of the greatest players of all time. I only can hope that Muscles does not read those obnoxious posts by Limpinhitter and Phoenix.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2016 at 5:13 PM
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  42. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    NonP, You err: I have not written that I will leave the 1964 issue. I did write that I speculate to make a pause or quit my career here.

    Note: It's my opponents who also don't stop writing about 1964, now also in the All Rosewall thread as I just saw...

    Have not read the whole post of yours because it's written again in an arrogant style.

    You know all better and you know even "the correct answer"...

    Figaro may be a comic opera and have a comic end. Fidelio has a human and moving end. That's much more.

    You again err: My emotions don't come because of disagreements. They come because of self-contradictions, arrogancy, LIES (you never critisized your friend's, Limpin's lies!) and distorting English language.

    Note: I react to friendly behaviour friendly (even when my partner disagrees with me, see my posts to NatF) and I react to nasty or obnoxious or arrogant posts in an unfriendly way.

    Note: posters who make bad lies about me (Limpin) or who insult a great player or insult serious posters, are my enemies as I am your's and Limpin's!

    Will not answer you anymore.
     
  43. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    Again wrong! I did not write about disagreement. I wrote about a possible nasty behaviour of Rosewall, as you have insinuated. Get real!
     
  44. BobbyOne

    BobbyOne G.O.A.T.

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    hoodjem, Thanks for your interest. I have already listed up all tournaments as they are written in McCauley's book.
     
  45. Limpinhitter

    Limpinhitter G.O.A.T.

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    Treblings, I read your post correctly. You continue to evade the issue. The issue is that you stated that you were "quite convinced" that Rosewall was the "official" #1 ranked player for 1964. On numerous occasions I have asked you to identify the official ranking you were referring to. If you were not evading the issue there are only two possible honest responses: (1) identification of the official ranking, or (2) an admission that you used the word "official" in error when you should have characterized the ranking(s) you were referring to as something other than official.
     
  46. Limpinhitter

    Limpinhitter G.O.A.T.

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    I think I've identified the problem. Short term memory deficit.

    On August 20th Bobby wrote:

    "Limpin, Read krosero's post with the newspaper quotings and rankings of 1964 and 1965. Read especially the rankings of August 25 where there is clearly written that the tour was a pro world championship. Read also the Buchholz article where Butch gives the 1964 final rankings and writes 5, five, FIVE, F I V E (fünf) [gesundheit] times that Rosewall was the 1964 No.1 player, once even "unquestionably the No.1 player". Even an ignoramus like you should be able to read clear English written words. You surely don't want to be called an idiot! I can understand that. So get real!!!

    "It's due time now to apologize for your several lies, especially that curious "40 majors" lie!!!"

    On August 21st Bobby Wrote:

    "Curious Limpin, Of course Buchholz did confirm that the 130 day tour was not a world champioship tour. It really was not. Only in your fantasy there is a question if it was or not was. All the serious posters know that the 130 day tour was not the world championship. krosero has clearly shown that it was not. So what?

    "Of course Butch did not say that Rosewall was No.1 for 1964, you funny woman or man: He was not asked at all about that!!!

    "Learn to read clear English sentences!!!"
     
  47. NonP

    NonP Hall of Fame

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    Again you quibble with minor details while ignoring the major issue(s) without any hint of self-criticism, and your infantile obsession with "keeping score" proves my point. Go back and try to find in this thread how many times other posters tried to defend themselves by pointing their fingers at others who supposedly didn't get the same harsh treatment. Phoenix and Limpin have engaged in unfair criticism of krosero, I'll give you that, but who else? And certainly nobody does this with the same stupefying fixation as you do.

    Sooner or later you'll have to acknowledge the fact that you have a serious problem that will keep alienating those around you until and unless you change for the better. Or you can continue to live within your own little paranoid fantasy and believe the whole unfair world is against you because it makes you feel better about your indefensible behavior. Again your choice.
     
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  48. treblings

    treblings Hall of Fame

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    Have you ever talked to Mr Rosewall whether or not he reads the forum? i would like to think he´s not affected by these discussions.
     
  49. Limpinhitter

    Limpinhitter G.O.A.T.

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    Well, NonP, I was going to "like" this post. But, I just can't get around your mean lie, belittling Laver, that "the Laverites got it wrong on this matter." Humph! ;)
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2016 at 12:33 PM
  50. Limpinhitter

    Limpinhitter G.O.A.T.

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    I sure hope not.
     
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