Worst band ever: REM or Chili Peppers?

Discussion in 'Odds & Ends' started by heycal, Oct 28, 2012.

?

Worst band ever?

  1. R.E.M.

    35.1%
  2. Red Hot Chili Peppers

    70.3%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. adamX012

    adamX012 Rookie

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    I will go over the Hudson river to celebrate the New Year!

    Yes, Red, chilli and pepper because I love spicy food

    Rock and Roll~
     
  2. SoBad

    SoBad Legend

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    Great, I pledge to eat all kimchi on w32st to celebrate thanksgiving. And then I can go into a sauna and into a coma with a good feeling and clear conscience.
     
  3. adamX012

    adamX012 Rookie

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    Nice teeth cleaning today! Doctor says no more spicy food while watching the gangnam style dance

    Maybe, I changed my mind, OP. R.E.M this time
     
  4. SoBad

    SoBad Legend

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    To call things their names, frankly, Queen was a spoiled bunch of silver-spoon-mouthed degenerates who barely succeeded with one song in a weak era.
     
  5. tricky

    tricky Hall of Fame

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    Among a lot of critics, it's an argument between OK Computer, Nevermind, and Loveless (which gets the "Pet Sounds.") This is one of the innate problems with decade debates. A record in 1991 will often be deemed "more important" than one in 1997, even though the 10 years markers are still pretty arbitrary. People heard Nevermind and thought, "hey I could do that." Bands heard OK Computer and considered calling it a day.

    Then you have a separate debate between Kid A and OK Computer. Kid A was selected as greatest album of the 00s in various publications. And it could be argued that The Bends was more influential than OK Computer and Kid A.
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2012
  6. Goosehead

    Goosehead Hall of Fame

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    meatloaf eats way too much loaf...hence the corpulence.
     
  7. Timbo's hopeless slice

    Timbo's hopeless slice Hall of Fame

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    yes, exactly..
     
  8. dParis

    dParis Hall of Fame

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    The Bends>OK Computer

    Both great albums.
     
  9. Power Player

    Power Player G.O.A.T.

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    How do you define best? Personal taste or actual record sales? Most people who do this stuff for a living lean on sales #s followed by albums of critical acclaim that influenced other albums.

    Using that category (which is the best possible way - far better than the layman's argument) Queen is top 10 of all time in record sales and Pet Sounds is the #2 greatest record of all time according to the rolling stone list (list was created by this laundry list of successful artists/ music executives at the following link:

    http://www.rollingstone.com/music/lists/500-greatest-albums-of-all-time-20120531#ixzz2CmOP3jdV


    Now ask yourself - how do you quantify an opinion better than anyone on that list? The answer is that you probably do not without a resume in the industry. A humbling fact - Brittney Spears is on that list and knows far more about music than any layman, who could never pick a producer, create a proper song list on an album or allocate marketing funds for promo. This is why musical debates are a total waste of time and the main person here who thinks his taste is superior ( clue - the OP ) needs to admit to trolling or simply sit down before shaming himself any further.

    excellent troll thread BTW. Well done. This is a heycal staple. At least for someone who peruses this battlefield, maybe they will at least see some good, real info on art instead of being bashed in the face by one person's unqualified opinion and ears.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2012
  10. heycal

    heycal Hall of Fame

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    I realize that hits aren't often the best songs a band has done. However, the good stuff usually makes itself known somehow, and the songs from Queen and Kansas have not done so. As is often the case with these lesser bands, their one or two hits ARE their best efforts.

    Really? 20-something critics with one or two contrarian older types thrown in?

    Believe me, son, in decades to come, absolutely no one will be talking about Radio Muse or Lemon Head or Ok Cupid or whoever. I understand you probably like them because you grew up with them -- hell, I like "The Night the Lights went out in Georgia" because I grew up with it -- but these bands are nowhere near in league with the Stones and Beatles.


    Not far off. Mercury could sing like hell, and they did manage to eek out a couple of slams here and there, but they aren't among the truly great.

    Are you speaking English?

    Sales?? God, no. That's a horrible way. If we used sales to define greatness, we'd be talking about horrifying bands like AC/DC. Sales aren't a reliable indicator at all.


    I really don't understand what the controversy is. Me stating that the Beatles and Stones are two best rock bands ever is pretty much stating the obvious. Reading some of the replies here, it's as if I said "Roger Federer and Rod Laver are two best players ever", and a bunch of guys started howling "What? What about Leyton Hewitt?? Or Jim Courier?? Hello! Haven't you ever heard of Yannick Noah???"
     
  11. Power Player

    Power Player G.O.A.T.

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    "Sales?? God, no. That's a horrible way. If we used sales to define greatness, we'd be talking about horrifying bands like AC/DC. Sales aren't a reliable indicator at all."

    Annnnnnd that's all folks. Hope it cements my point for anyone still reading this laugher.
     
  12. heycal

    heycal Hall of Fame

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    I hope you're not implying that you like AC/DC... Because that would pretty much eliminate you as a serious contributor to this thread.
     
  13. Timbo's hopeless slice

    Timbo's hopeless slice Hall of Fame

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    Heycal just continues to show how hopelessly out of his depth he is in this discussion..

    While I agree that sales is a terrible measure, I can't come at AC/DC being 'horrifying'. Sure, they are pretty 'samey', but they have still given the world some of the most instantly recognizable riffs and hooks in history. ('Back in Black', anyone?)

    For the record, I'm 46, a tennis coach (which has no relevance here) and a professional musician (which kind of does)

    There is just nothing interesting about the Beatles for me, sorry. I don't hate them, or even dislike them, but they are just so bland. By contrast, REM and RHCP do some really unusual and honest things in terms of song structure and lyrical content.
    As for Radiohead's OK Computer, that is a whole different level of sophistication to the point where any comparison to something like Rubber Soul or Revolver is just meaningless.

    But this will all go right over Heycal's head, he has made up his mind, much like a birther who is totally convinced the Prez was born in Kenya (or whatever the idiotic premise of that movement of morons is), no amount of hard physical evidence will have any effect.



    oh, PP, I bought one of the Taylor Fall Limiteds! A GAce FLTD 2012
    Happy days!
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2012
  14. ninman

    ninman Hall of Fame

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    Sales is not a horrible indicator at all. It shouldn't be the sole indicator, but to say it's bad is pretty stupid. Queen sold over 300 million records world wide, the Bee Gees have sold over 200 million, The Beach Boys about 50 million. All great bands.

    I personally think that if The Beach Boys had chosen different subject matter, i.e. not surfing, to write about, they probably would have done a lot better sales wise. Their biggest problem though, was alienating their entire fan base by releasing Smiley Smile, which sucked, after cancelling Smile.

    They never really recovered after that, despite recording some really decent albums, and songs, like the Sunflower album (which did horribly). However, people just weren't interested in The Beach Boys post 1967, which I think is very sad. Personally, I think they were one of these most under appreciated and under rated bands of the 70's.
     
  15. Power Player

    Power Player G.O.A.T.

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    Sales is a great indicator when you are having the best ever or worst ever type of arguments that people like to have. It is really a subjective argument so not only did i post that i also posted the top 500 list. If you look at the people who contributed to that list, it is very impressive. I know some of them personally and they made millions telling the world what a great band or hit was when the songs were just demos and the bands were just babies.

    Enjoy the taylor!
     
  16. Timbo's hopeless slice

    Timbo's hopeless slice Hall of Fame

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    Really, Rolling Stone? I had no idea anybody even read it anymore, let alone took it the least bit seriously!

    I have read the list of voters, an d I take your point, but don't you think it is a bit more than a coincidence that their top ten lists are always full of music from a 5 year period between 1967 and 1972?

    I mean, look at their guitarists list and tell me how Keith Richard is in the top 5 and Eric Johnson doesn't exist?
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2012
  17. heycal

    heycal Hall of Fame

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    Wait, let me get this straight: You're one trumpeting AC/DC and talking about how groups like Radiohead and the Chili Peppers are better than the Beatles and the Stones, and I'm the guy whose in over his head and out of his depth?

    Once again, there is really little debate about this in serious circles. Only contrarians or imbeciles would argue that the Beatles and Stones aren't the cream of the crop. Which group do you fall into?

    Perhaps because it's well-known that that era produced the best music? Doesn't seem surprising to me.
     
  18. Timbo's hopeless slice

    Timbo's hopeless slice Hall of Fame

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    oh my lord, you're thick, aren't you? I am not 'trumpeting' AC/DC at all, just pointing out they have given the world some memorable riffs and don't deserve 'horrific' status. I don't own a single AC/DC album, personally, not my taste at all.

    I just stated I am bored by the Beatles and find Radiohead more interesting.

    Your original premise is so ludicrous as to be almost forgotten, but I note how you are happy to bow to Rolling Stone on The Beatles while conveniently ignoring the presence of both RHCP and REM on their list of all time greatest albums..

    you can't have it both ways...

    in summary, my preference for Radiohead is a question of taste, but your premise of REM and RHCP as the worst bands of all time is a question of sheer stupidity.

    there is really little debate about this in serious circles, as you might say...
     
  19. BauerAlmeida

    BauerAlmeida Semi-Pro

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    AC/DC is an ok band. Nothing special, and there are a lot of bands who are better for sure. But they are not bad.

    And sales is not and indicator. There are loads of band who sell a lot and are pure crap. And some great artist are not popular at all.
     
  20. heycal

    heycal Hall of Fame

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    AC/DC hasn't "given the world" anything. Instead they feel inflicted misery and heartache to all who have been unwillingly unsubjected to their nighmarish reign of terror. They are a blight upon humanity.

    If you paid attention to the thread, you'd realize the REM and RHCP designations as "worst ever" are limited in scope.

    As for preferring Radioneck to the Beatles, that's fine. I personally listened to way more Doors and other bands than I did the Beatles or Stones. But I wouldn't be stupid enough not to acknowledge that they are clearly and obviously the two greatest bands ever.
     
  21. Timbo's hopeless slice

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    you left this part out, can't think why...
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2012
  22. tricky

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    AC/DC and the Ramones are the classic "we make only one song, but that's a great, great song" bands. If you know what you are, why be something else?

    Reading comprehension not up to par?
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2012
  23. chrischris

    chrischris Hall of Fame

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  24. tricky

    tricky Hall of Fame

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    That's true. A lot of bands develop a great sound and then spend the rest of the careers building and not turning it over. What a lot of critics view as "progression" is really the work of producers giving the product a new paintjob. And, sometimes, when somebody throws in a dubstep mix or hip hop cameo, they are not progressing, but diluting their sound. (Though I think what Muse did with Madness is just marvelous. It stands on its own as a love song.)
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2012
  25. Timbo's hopeless slice

    Timbo's hopeless slice Hall of Fame

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    Feeling Good, too..
     
  26. chrischris

    chrischris Hall of Fame

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    Yep , thats right.

    take a band like the Clash, they developed and used reggae and ska influences yet maintaineda core sound and crediblity in most peoples opinions.
     
  27. tricky

    tricky Hall of Fame

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    Clash is a really good example, and it also emphasizes that bands rarely lay out all of their cards on their debut album. People gave the Clash a lot of crap for Give Em Enough Rope when that came out, but looking back, it showed that they were more facets to the band than "White Riot. " Perhaps they overreached with Sandinista and went too far away from their strengths. In any case, the NME model of overhyping first albums can be destructive for the growth of bands. Most bands need at least 3 albums before they know what they are.
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2012
  28. slice bh compliment

    slice bh compliment G.O.A.T.

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    I sense a theme here. LOL....Federer agrees, but Rafa does not. Novak prefers Maroon 5. Murray, like most Scots, likes ac/dc.

    Is that the guy from Bon Jersey? Good call.

    heycal, you sparked a fun discussion. Thanks. But, man, the whole concept of saying something is overrated is...hahaa, overrated.

    Underrated? Well, plenty of great musicians and excellent bands on that list.
    The concept of 'overrated' takes into account the machine, the suits, the business of music and the feeble minded. Oh, and fake/manipulated download numbers.

    So if you believe they put a man on the moon...
    kidding. I really liked Chronic Town, Document, Murmur, Fables, Dead Letter Office, Green ... and that's about it. REM went on to breathe life into a lot of crap bands. For that, I agree with the OP in some ways.

    Oh, and remember when RHCP came out with that Stevie Wonder cover, Higher Ground, and Fight Like A Brave? I liked the tunes, and figured they'd be good live, but I think we all saw something remarkably cheesy about them. It was clear: this band would torment us for decades.

    Funky bass and hooky melodies aside, they are indeed overrated. I did like Raindance Maggie for whatever reason.

    This thread, to me, is a thumbs down for the music industry, and a call to explore real music that is not what the man is telling us to download.
     
  29. borg number one

    borg number one Legend

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    I like a lot of music from REM, like "Feeling Gravity's Pull", "Old Man Kensey" and "Perfect Circle". I'm not a big fan of the Red Hot Chili Peppers but they had some decent tunes in the 80's-90's in my opinion. For this thread, I'd like to nominate Milly Vanilli, Marilyn Manson and Insane Clown Posse!
     
  30. Power Player

    Power Player G.O.A.T.

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    Timbo, best guitar player to a listener is not the same as it is to a guitar player. Eric Johnson is awesome if you like guitar and not songs. I have played guitar for most of my life. Went through that phase where I just focused on technical ability. But I much more appreciate a player who thinks of tones and riffs that are unique and creative. Not that cliffs of Dover is not awesome. But I can think of far less technical players i much prefer due to their creativity and how they augmented a band.

    Like tricky said. Nirvana made everyone think they could do it. And many many bands have tried to copy that simple dynamic of quiet to loud since. But no one has ever really pulled it off as well.
     
  31. chrischris

    chrischris Hall of Fame

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    Ok, yes i think hte bands of today are beholden in a different way. Their lables and the bottomlines are less interested in allowing things and sounds to find their way over time. The revenue and results in shortterm gain is hampering the process of creativity.
    That said , in no way do i endorse the opposite , namely eternal fiddling around and no output / nothing to show for.

    The US in the 70s had a better level in its blend for music and artists in general many say.
     
  32. Power Player

    Power Player G.O.A.T.

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    There is not enough money anymore for bands to get signed and then develop over 3 albums. The closest thing to it is Indie labels like fueled by ramen. They get bought out by Warner and develop their bands until they write a major release and then the full power of Atlantic records is thrown behind the band for promo. Good example of this is Paramore.

    Also bands are much better now in terms of what is expected. Drummers have to be able to lock to a click live. Songs have to be developed a lot faster and the players have to be ultra tight. And this is expected at a very young age. Definitely a different time.
     
  33. chrischris

    chrischris Hall of Fame

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    Yes , reinforcing my point. The market demands are not in sync with the times and arent creating better music here, thats why we are stuck .
     
  34. chrischris

    chrischris Hall of Fame

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  35. Power Player

    Power Player G.O.A.T.

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    Development and preproduction are huge parts of music. I'd never disagree with this. New bands now can't live the life off advances and slowly develop. It is a new working class of musician that has to have a strong work ethic to succeed.
     
  36. Timbo's hopeless slice

    Timbo's hopeless slice Hall of Fame

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    ok, Mark Knopfler or Ry Cooder then.. Just not Keith Richards! Defnition of one trick pony right there..

    :)
     
  37. fps

    fps Legend

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    Laughable stuff. At a guess the OP is a frustrated amateur guitarist. Amazing this has continued for 12 pages.
     
  38. chrischris

    chrischris Hall of Fame

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    True... a little controversy to start a thread seems to do the job.
     
  39. heycal

    heycal Hall of Fame

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    Nope. The only instrument I can play is the skin flute. I'm looking at this strictly objectively and scientifically.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2012
  40. Dedans Penthouse

    Dedans Penthouse Hall of Fame

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    I see you don't like The Indigo Girls either.
     
  41. chrischris

    chrischris Hall of Fame

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    Is the OP a skinhead?
     
  42. heycal

    heycal Hall of Fame

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    Yes. Why do you ask?
     
  43. Timbo's hopeless slice

    Timbo's hopeless slice Hall of Fame

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    I love how he thinks he is being 'scientific' when all he does is express his opinion...
     
  44. heycal

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    No, it's been scientifically proved.
     
  45. Dedans Penthouse

    Dedans Penthouse Hall of Fame

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    Of course not. Fwiw, he's been knighted: Sir Kolmsighs

    [​IMG]
     
  46. Mike Bulgakov

    Mike Bulgakov Semi-Pro

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    What if no band is the worst band ever?
     
  47. chrischris

    chrischris Hall of Fame

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    Thats possible , there maybe way too many candidates already and its increasing. Exponentially.
     
  48. Timbo's hopeless slice

    Timbo's hopeless slice Hall of Fame

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    lol, one of those kids bands that nobody will remember are up for some more Grammys..
     
  49. r2473

    r2473 Legend

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  50. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    The OP's next poll is:

    "Worst band ever: The Beatles or The Rolling Stones".

    :???:
     

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