Would you considered to be a **** if you called foot faults

Discussion in 'Adult League & Tournament Talk' started by Torres, Apr 30, 2013.

  1. leroy_sunset

    leroy_sunset Rookie

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    Thread revival. This Friday my USTA team is playing the other top team in our league - a win means we advance to sectionals (no playoffs this year). My singles opponent will probably be "Billy," a chronic footfaulter, shady linecaller, and apparently a general D-bag. We play each team twice - in our last meet his court was the last to finish. We were cheering on our teammate in the tiebreaker and Billy actually yelled at the audience "hey guys, I really don't appreciate you cheering my errors." We weren't. He lost.

    This guy's entire foot is inside the line on every serve, first and second. He serves and volleys about 50% of the time. It's silly, and apparently he's been warned over and over, even by USTA officials, and doesn't care. According to my teammate, he also makes terrible line calls. So I'm thinking I should print out The Code and keep the page turned that says I can call blatant foot faults. I'll let him know at the end of his first service game (win or lose) that he's foot faulting on every serve and to please watch out for it. Big smile on my face, as friendly as can be. He'll probably flip out, whatever.

    Then when he pulls a really bad line call, I'll just do like HRB suggests: tell him that was a terrible call, he can have the point, but I'm going to start calling foot faults as stated in The Code.

    I'm just not sure of what to do if he retaliates (poor calls turn into outright hooking, he starts calling footfaults on me even though I don't, etc.).
     
  2. sam_p

    sam_p Professional

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    Request a line judge, that will calm things down.
     
  3. leroy_sunset

    leroy_sunset Rookie

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    There are no unbiased 3rd party line judges. We'd have to get both captains out there, I guess?
     
  4. schmke

    schmke Professional

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    If there is no one available that is unbiased, I believe the rule is to get one person from each team to balance the bias out.
     
  5. EDI Ken

    EDI Ken New User

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    Not sure if anyone has said this...but I would appreciate it if my opponent called foot faults on me. I do not wish to cheat. I do not believe I step on the line while serving; but if I am that is something I need to correct and I would be grateful to be made aware of it.
     
  6. asimple

    asimple Semi-Pro

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    I have played both 4.0 and 4.5 this year and unfortunately played a lot of D-Bags which all were at the 4.0 level. At this point, I don't waste time on a line judge or getting bothered I just aim 2 feet in the lines and accept that I am going to get hooked on a lot of points. I don't even consider reciprocating because it seems to just excite some of these guys even when they are getting beat 0 and 0.

    I have to admit I am a bit more tolerant of the cheaters than the "rule-book" guys who take long bathroom breaks, intentionally drop balls during points and so much more. I have too many unpleasant stories. Frankly, based on accepted practice if you call foot faults you are kind of a D-Bag. If you do this to intentionally set off your opponent then you definitely are a D-Bag and if you have a printed copy of the rules in your bag than ...

    I think if you are getting beat by a guy who steps 2 feet into the court when serving you should spend some time improving your game rather than looking at the rules.
     
  7. Tennisguy3000

    Tennisguy3000 Semi-Pro

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    When its clear that someone with an effective serve is foot faulting I call it & watch the fireworks as their game falls apart afterwards. Try it, it works haha ;-)
     
  8. tennixpl

    tennixpl Rookie

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    by this argument they could cheat at everything and that okay just play even better next time. actually not calling FF promulgates the issue to the next match. plus since s seldom called a lot of people don't know they even foot fault. like people who cross the net to hit a volley and they sight the rule that they can cross the net after they hit the ball never even realizing that they are wrong and smack the ball on wrong side. i have even called my own teammate on it bc it isn't right. some ppl strategically hit a short call at the net for the purpose of making it hard to hit, you just cheated. lines are lines call em.

    or you can be a jerk like me and call FF on yourself and call your own serves out.
     
  9. asimple

    asimple Semi-Pro

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    Yes, I think you are right but at least they won't be playing with me. I play tennis for fun and am picky about who I play. In USTA matches where I am forced to finish I just do my best to keep calm and win as quickly and painlessly as possible with minimal conflict. I have no interest in helping others mend their ways. Getting a line judge might be a good solution as well, but I really hate to force my teammates to suffer with me in this experience.
     
  10. Loose Cannon

    Loose Cannon Rookie

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    I was waiting on my Tourney match.....and I guess wht would have been 3.5's......the guy literally lined up to serve every time with his toes lined up.....with the INSIDE of the Base line. He obviously didn't know the rules.....as he carefully toed the line before each serve......just the wrong line
     
  11. hray4clay

    hray4clay Rookie

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    "no right to call a foot fault"!?

    Does it state in the rules of tennis that the opponent of a foot faulter has no right to call a foot fault? Really? So does this mean that the rules of tennis are totally insignificant and need not be followed except at the tournament level? Are you serious?
    I despise foot faults because it is against the rules and cheating. I suppose the most diplomatic way to try to curb/stop it is to mention it before the match even begins and say that it is against the rules and if you do it I will tell you that you are doing it and give you a warning and if you persist, I will call it as a fault every time you do it; furthermore, I will tell you that I do NOT foot fault and that you should feel free to call a foot fault on me if you see me do it or you can have a third party watch the match and call all the foot faults on either or both of us. There is no "free pass" to abrogate the rules, period. Every one should attempt to play by the rules. That's what makes the game fair and fun for everyone.
     
  12. tennixpl

    tennixpl Rookie

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    i do that too but people do have a right to call it. Its much easier in doubles than singles. In doubles a barely touching FF is no big deal, but there are some guys who take a big lumbering step inside the line, and in tournies it matters, bc these are also the same people who will call anything close out, they have no respect for rules. In recreational I would never call it, bc its for fun.....but i will inform them so they know. a lot of people are oblivious to FF like when they come across net to hit a ball.
     
  13. hray4clay

    hray4clay Rookie

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    why should they stop foot faulting??!!

    They should stop because it is against the rules and therefore it is CHEATING.
     
  14. TennisCJC

    TennisCJC Legend

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    Played a young guy last weekend. Tall guy 6'3"-6'5" range and he served as hard as anyone I have played in years. He consistently foot faulted but it was only a couple of inches. He shifted into a pin point stance and his back foot nipped the line every time. It was mixed doubles and I didn't call it. I probably should have because it does give him a bit of an advantage. I kept thinking I should call it but hesitated because it was only a couple of inches.
     
  15. tennixpl

    tennixpl Rookie

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    ^^^^^^ tennisCJC that is the time when you do call it. for both of you. If that kid gets to a tournament and someone does call it it might get into his head he needs to know about it so he wont be surprised. especially when its slide over the line and not a real step that someone should feel on their own. helps you bc you will be the ones to benefit from his struggling to adjust and his worry that you'll call it :)
     
  16. josofo

    josofo Semi-Pro

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    i have more of a passive aggressive attitude. if someone foot faulting i tell them your foot faulting. but i never have called a foot fault on someone in my life.
     
  17. Roddick85

    Roddick85 Professional

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    From my experience, calling foot faults is rather tough to call. It's not all that obvious to call that out from the other side of the net as your usually concentrating on returning the serve or judging if it's IN or OUT. From my experience, lower skilled players with awkward serving movements usually foot fault a lot because they either miss they're toss or lack a proper stance.

    There's 2 guys I play who sometimes try to serve & volley, both have rather awful technique; one day they asked me to look at they're serve and give them tips (I'm known for my serves). Much to my surprise, they both make huge foot faults, by the time they hit the ball, they're half-way between the baseline and service line, which is unacceptable imo. I find it rather funny when they start bragging about beating other players I know because technically speaking, they never won a point on they're serve, but hey they don't care.
     
  18. hrstrat57

    hrstrat57 Hall of Fame

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    This shouldn't be a difficult topic.

    If I notice in warmup an opponent foot faulting I would politely and casually mention it.

    However I can't recall the last time I called out an opponent for a ff during or after a point. I have called it on myself tho, as recently as this weekend.

    Why do I suspect that some of the folks putting up such a fuss in this ( and the previous) thread are chronic foot fault artists on a guilt trip?

    :)
     
  19. The Isomotion31

    The Isomotion31 Semi-Pro

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    I'm guessing this is more of a doubles thing?

    Because when I am playing singles, if my opponent is not already foot faulting, as soon as he/she starts the motion of the toss my eyes start following the ball and I do not notice what they are doing with their feet.
     
  20. storypeddler

    storypeddler Semi-Pro

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    I'm curious---if your opponent hit a very short lob and you finished the overhead with a smash but clipped the net with your racquet on your follow-through, would all these posters consider him a low-life if he called it on you? I am constantly amazed by how many players on here seem to feel like they should be able to pick and choose which rules to follow and which ones don't really matter. If you break a rule of the game, and I politely call you on it, why should I be deemed the bad guy? If that's how it is, then why don't we all just see how much we can possibly get away in every match we play? Yeah, THAT would make for an fun match, wouldn't it? Foot faulting is against the rules of the game. More than that, it is a very simple thing to correct. The only people who continually foot fault are those who don't realize they are doing it or those who simply don't care. If you don't realize you are doing it, and I politely point it out to you, there is no reason for hard feelings. If you are doing it and simply don't care, then you are cheating me. And, yes, I will call it on you and feel absolutely no remorse.
     
  21. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

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    Ah, but have you ever called it during a competitive or social match?
     
  22. NLBwell

    NLBwell Legend

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    When guys clearly have both feet a step into the court before they hit the ball (and I've seen this on a couple of occasions) it is very apparent.
     
  23. brokenRPM

    brokenRPM Rookie

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    You should use it as a strategy and exaggerate your call. say things like "you are 2 feet inside the court when you footfault.." etc. it will mess up his head.
     
  24. brokenRPM

    brokenRPM Rookie

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    yes, did that in competitive matches. messed up the servers' head. he continued to footfault but couldn't get his first serves in no more.
     
  25. Fintft

    Fintft Hall of Fame

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    That should be called, expecially since some guys keep doing for years.
     
  26. struggle

    struggle Hall of Fame

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    I've never called it, but i'll mention it on occasion (rare). "Try not to FF, thx" or whatever.

    That is usually enough to make them try not to FF.

    heck I FF too at times but i try not to bby backing up, but the clay gives me away as i'm a toe dragger. Just try to adjust.
     
  27. Fintft

    Fintft Hall of Fame

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    ^^^^
    Ah, we are not talking about dragging a toe, but rather taking a couple of steps into the court.
     
  28. spot

    spot Hall of Fame

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    Maybe if you were watching the ball rather than your own feet while serving you wouldn't have footfaulted.
     
  29. hrstrat57

    hrstrat57 Hall of Fame

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    Nope was s/v and feet hit inside service line before contact made... No foot watcher here....
     
  30. bethany2

    bethany2 New User

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    Funny story from 3.5 nationals this past weekend...doubles match in a 3rd set tiebreaker (it was the deciding match between the teams). Player serves, opponent calls a ff. it was an odd call to try to make especially since the ref was standing on their court!! The ref told her she couldn't call that and that it wasn't even a ff anyway. she was dumbfounded. I think it got into her head too bc they ended up losing the next few points (and the match). No idea what she was thinking!!
     
  31. tennixpl

    tennixpl Rookie

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    I am really hoping you mean baseline and not service line bc if i saw that i would be laughing my butt off... I know you did but the image in my head of someone tossing it high enough and running to inside the service line to hit a serve made me think of some folks I've seen chase tosses all over the baseline:)
     
  32. spot

    spot Hall of Fame

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    If you called yourself for a footfault that you hit from inside the service line while serving and volleying then you have bigger issues than can really be discussed on a message board.
     
  33. hrstrat57

    hrstrat57 Hall of Fame

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    I meant baseline, ha ha ha !!!

    I make a funny!

    :oops:
     
  34. jersey34tennis

    jersey34tennis Rookie

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    in our more "advanced " league 3 of the 12 players are chonic foot-faulters. one's serve is so insignificant that it's pointless to call it. another one actually takes 3 steps with the last one being over the line to hit his serve (still weak flat serve). the last is a good former college player-coach who steps way over to hit wide on deauce courts. so i had the luxury to play him and didn't call him on any when we played. but i did the EXACT same motion as him as a joke repeatedly and he kept saying "watch your foot" . "i should call a foot fault" on me. i'm going to take a video and show him what he does and what i was doing and see what he says. i beat him, but it was fun as an experiment to see what he thinks vs. reality. he's one of those i'm still as good as i ever was - type players . i knocked his wilson hyper hammer 5.3 out of his hands on a couple of his volleys and i gleefully told him use a man's racquet as a joke .
     
  35. spot

    spot Hall of Fame

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    If you threw the ball that far inside the baseline why didn't you just catch the serve rather than calling yourself for a footfault?
     
  36. newpball

    newpball Legend

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    Who cares!

    If you see your opponent making a foot fault call it!
     
  37. hrstrat57

    hrstrat57 Hall of Fame

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    Spot, really ??

    My foot hit inside the baseline before I struck the serve...giving me an advantage in attacking the net....I felt the foot hit first before making contact. To continue the point knowing I had gained an unfair advantage would be unthinkable....Because my opponent would never see the mistake is no reason to continue to play the point....

    With no linesman there to make a call it is incumbent upon me to enforce the rules of tennis. There is no chance my opponent could have seen it but I knew it was a fault.

    How is it possible to hit a serve while watching your feet btw?

    Really, you are just looking to pick a fight.....
     
  38. spot

    spot Hall of Fame

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    I don't think it is. Which is why I haven't ever seen someone call themselves for a footfault and which is why I didn't htink anyone ever would. I simply am trying to figure out what possible combination of events could happen where someone would be footfaulting so flagrantly that they would be sure they did it and call themselves for it but also so close that they would choose to hit the serve rather than catch it and toss again.

    If you really called yourself for a footfault then you may be the only person in the history of tennis to do so.
     
  39. hrstrat57

    hrstrat57 Hall of Fame

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    Spot, I grew up playing a lot of S/V on grass courts in Newport. Calling foot faults was far from unusual maybe my experience is different from folks who grew up primarily hard courts or clay.

    The only time it is would come into play for me is on a hard first serve or more likely a hard wide kicker to the ad court where one tends to get a bit more twisted.

    I was hitting a first serve kicker wide to the ad court the last foot fault I called on myself. Might happen a couple times a season but one step quicker to the net on a kicker where I expect to see a weak mid court floater to knock off is a significant advantage...thus the self imposed fault call.

    I called it immediately - as the floater I was looking for from my opponent sailed long.....

    No big deal for me really, second serve.

    I am far from the first person in tennis history to call a foot fault on myself in singles but I doubt it is called by many baseliners...how would you know? We agree you can't watch your feet and the ball at the same time.
     
  40. spot

    spot Hall of Fame

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    Has anyone else ever seen someone call themselves for a footfault?
     
  41. tennis_ocd

    tennis_ocd Hall of Fame

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    Never. The only time I hear it ever mentioned (outside an outside observer/ump) is when someone is losing and either looking for an excuse or desires to simply lash out at the guy outplaying him.
     
  42. r2473

    r2473 Legend

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    I actually didn't know you had made this post before starting my thread.

    But all the same, with the number of people that are so strongly in favor of enforcing the rules ("rules are rules"), I'd expect these same people would be calling violations on themselves (foot faults, time violations, etc). It happens in golf.

    Now, I'm sure that these personalities do tend to be quite rules sensitive when it comes to themselves, but to think you NEVER break tennis rules ("I've NEVER foot faulted") is akin to claiming your poo doesn't stink IMO.
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2013
  43. SCRAP IRON

    SCRAP IRON Professional

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    You really shouldn't call it unless it is blatant. With that said, let the guy know so that he does not get accused by other opponents in the future.
     
  44. paul500w

    paul500w Rookie

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    It's funny how we are talking about "Would you call it" instead of talking about "People shouldn't do it" - It's like saying if you are servering and someone hits the ball before it bounces in the service box would you call it or not? YES, you call it. The RULE is they are supposed to let it bounce. The RULE is you are not supposed to touch the line when serving. The RULE is the ball can't hit you in the air on a serve.

    I'm getting very sick of Tennis rules! Some rules you can enforce, some rules you can't. You can enforce a rule where if someone touches the net during the point, they lose the point but it someone foot faults and you say something, it doesn't matter, nothing can be done.
     
  45. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

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    That last bit isn't true. If someone FFs and you warn them, you are perfectly entitled to take the point the next time it happens.

    Why be irritated about the Rules? The game couldn't be played without Rules.

    I think the Rules of tennis (along with the Code) work remarkably well. I mean, you have a competitive game being played with all kinds of opportunity for cheating. Yet most unofficiated tennis matches go quite smoothly. It's really quite remarkable.
     
  46. silentkman

    silentkman New User

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    You must be kidding, the big problem with tennis is that most matches are not officiated. The high ranking juniors are the worst. This is one of the huge problems in tennis.
     
  47. anubis

    anubis Hall of Fame

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    I honestly don't think that a foot fault would give even the slightest edge to a 2.5-3.5 player anyway. Especially if they are older and have bad knees, or are overweight.

    If I'm playing a tournament and my opponent is a healthy, young 4.0 with a kickin' S&V game, then I should hope that the USTA officials would call a foot fault for me. However, that is a very rare exception.
     
  48. paul500w

    paul500w Rookie

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    Cindy,
    Do you have a link that explains this rule to full detail? I read the USTA rule on footfaulting and it says what the player can't do but I did not see anything that says what can be done once the player is warned. I would like to have full explanation of this rule and what can be done about it.

    The reason I ask is because during our Sr Mixed Match the woman would toss the ball to serve and she was so unbalanced that she would step a good foot into the court before hitting the ball. I was down 0-3 so I didn't say anything in fear it would look like I was trying to be a ***** because we were losing. The 3rd time she served we were up 4-3 (I think) so I told her in-between switch over about the footfaulting and she said thank you for letting her know. I told them I wasn't sure about the rule and the male player said Oh, you can't do anything about it, you don't get the point. Since I was not 100% sure I didn't say anything about it again.
     
  49. paul500w

    paul500w Rookie

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    I happen to agree with both people on this. Cindy is correct that with hundreds, thousands of Tennis matches going on each week, ALTA, USTA, FLEX league I would say that most of them are played by people who love tennis and want to have fun. The part I agree with SilentKman with is that it has happen to me 3 weeks in a roll with people either footfaulting, calling really bad line calls all during the match and then captains that only want to enforce the rules when it benefits them, yet other rules that don't affect them, they can bend.
     
  50. paul500w

    paul500w Rookie

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    You are correct. The issue is however that you can't SOMETIMES enforce a rule and sometimes not. The RULES are the RULES, it doesn't matter if the other person gets an advantage or not. If I serve and it hits the player it's my point. You can't say that it would have been a fault. I've never seen anything hit a player on the serve and say, oh we won't take the point because it's not really an advantage. The same can be said for a person who catches the ball WAY out of bounce. "Oh well it was going to go out anyway" no MATTER, you must let the ball in the ground out of bounce.
     

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