WTA player hits linesman and is excluded from match

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by matchmaker, Mar 1, 2009.

  1. matchmaker

    matchmaker Hall of Fame

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    WTA player Yanina Wickmayer was in the final of the 50 000 usd ITF tournament in Clearwater, up 6-1 and 1-1 against Julie Coin when she apparently hit a serve from her opponent that went out backwards a little too hard and it hit a linesman on the shoulder. She was immediately excluded from the match and all her points won that week taken away from her, plus the fact that she could not appear for the doubles final for which she had also qualified with her team mate Maria-Elena Camerin.

    Has anyone seen this incident? It seems like an extremely harsh penalty in a world where people like ATP player Daniel "Crazy Dan" Koellerer are hardly stopped in their violent ways.

    I haven't seen the incident, so I cannot really judge about it, but it would seem strange that someone who reached the final and is winning it would knowingly and consciously hit a linesmen. She claims that during the whole week, there were no linesmen where she hit the ball, that it hit the ground before it touched the linesman's shoulder.

    Any comments?
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2009
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  2. tintin

    tintin Professional

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    did she have a go at the linesman on purpose or was it an accident?
    it it was on purpose I agree but if it's proven to be by accident that beyond harsh of a punishment
     
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  3. Aldi Patron

    Aldi Patron Rookie

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    Hmm...that's a tough call. I remember Agassi "missing" a serve against Rafter(?) at Wimbledon that nearly took a lineswoman's head off.

    Why did she have to hit the ball backwards? Couldn't she have just let the out serve go? Either way, that does seem sort of harsh.
     
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  4. boredone3456

    boredone3456 Legend

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    Based on that description I would say it was an accident. Seems like she hit her serve and it hit and reacted weird off the court and happened to hit a linesman. She should not have been punished like that for that. Also, if there was never a linesman there all week where she hit it why would there suddenly be one there now. I don't see why she would do it on purpose when she is winning the event that handily.
     
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  5. mzzmuaa

    mzzmuaa Semi-Pro

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    We know that this would never happen if the officials considered it an accident. So, the officials, who were actually at the match, don't consider it an accident.
     
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  6. nickynu

    nickynu Semi-Pro

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    Yeah I remember tiger Tim Henmen getting defaulted from wimbledon for hitting a ball girl.

    He was such a bad M********** lol - seriously tho he looked crestfallen as he realised he was the first guy ever to be defaulted for this. Even Mac couldnt manage that feat.
     
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  7. oneguy21

    oneguy21 Banned

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    It was probably an accident.

    Btw, if you intentionally try to hit your opponent with your serve and you do, it's your point right?
     
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  8. moonbat

    moonbat Semi-Pro

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    The original post is rather confusing, but I took it to mean that Wickmayer was returning serve, the serve was long, and she hit it to get it off the court and it hit a linesperson. So since she wasn't trying to return the serve, she was just hitting it off the court, the umpire might have decided she did it with too much force.
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2009
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  9. RoddickAce

    RoddickAce Hall of Fame

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    My interpretation is similar, except, she was doing some "show biz", and tried to hit the return backwards, but missed badly and hit a linesperson.
     
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  10. JeMar

    JeMar Legend

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    Tim Henman? Tim "Tiny Tim" Henman??? What year was this?
     
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  11. matchmaker

    matchmaker Hall of Fame

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    Stefan Edberg even killed a linesman early on in his carreer. I believe it wasn't on purpose, but the ball hit him on the head, he fell over and died.
     
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  12. viktorkwan

    viktorkwan Rookie

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    yes if your serve touches your opponent before landing, it's your point.

    Pretty difficult to do that in a singles match though...
     
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  13. viktorkwan

    viktorkwan Rookie

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    It was in a doubles match more than a few years ago...way before he became a top player if I'm not wrong.

    If I remember correctly, he was immediately defaulted and also thrown out of the singles tournament.

    What happened was he took a ball after a point was over and wanted to hit it at the net...think he was near the baseline at that time....he took a whack at the ball without looking to see if the court was clear and a ballgirl was running across at that moment...the ball clocked her in the head.
     
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  14. eeytennis

    eeytennis Semi-Pro

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    I don't think it's too harsh. Come on, you know there are people standing behind you...and what was the point in smacking it back? It's like hitting the ball over to your opponent to serve, you wait until they make eye contact or warn them that the ball is coming so you don't hit them...common sense.
     
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  15. egn

    egn Hall of Fame

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    Way too harsh you fine her money but she had the title practically another ******** move by the WTA. Have to love that organization.
     
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  16. Topaz

    Topaz Legend

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    Do you have a link on this?

    Also, it is Yanina Wickmayer.

    Personally, I doubt she did it on purpose...pros are very often hitting out balls away or back over to the serving side. Seems very, very harsh.
     
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  17. oneguy21

    oneguy21 Banned

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    I'm surprised this tactic is not used more often in doubles.
     
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  18. NickC

    NickC Professional

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    Seriously?
     
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  19. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Guest

    He did not hit him in the head. He hit him right in the sweetspot. The line umpire fell over and hit his head on the court. He was on blood thinning medication and died of internal brain bleeding.
     
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  20. autumn_leaf

    autumn_leaf Hall of Fame

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    i want a link or something to this story. this is such a drastic punishment.
     
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  21. matchmaker

    matchmaker Hall of Fame

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    Thanks for adding a little more precision to the story.

    It must be horrible to go through something like that for a tennis player.
     
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  22. Leublu tennis

    Leublu tennis Legend

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    This might be the right explanation. The original post made no sense at all.
     
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  23. edmondsm

    edmondsm Legend

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    It was in the USO juniors final I think. Like 1980 maybe.

    I think the OP was say that she hit her opponent's out serve at a lineman that was behind her. Obviously the ump determined she did it solely to hit the lines person.
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2009
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  24. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Guest

    The WTA had nothing to do with the decision. It was an ITF Challenger. The ITF/USTA Supervisor on site made the decision to default her.
     
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  25. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Guest

    The players are responsible for their actions whether intentional or not. If she hit the ball that was not in play, and it was hit hard and it injured or hurt the line umpire, then it's a pretty clear default.
     
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  26. Bud

    Bud Bionic Poster

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    Read Edberg's Wikipedia page... it's in there.
     
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  27. Bud

    Bud Bionic Poster

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    I can't find any stories on this incident written in English. All the news reports are French/Belgian.
     
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  28. Rorsach

    Rorsach Hall of Fame

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    From Yanina's diary:

    Translation:

    A little bit of an explanation for what happened today because you'll probably be a bit shocked. I had won the first set with 6-3 and it was 1-1 in the second set. Julie served the ball out and i hit the ball backwards. Perhaps a bit harder that i had planned, but there hadn't been any linesmen back there the whole week, until today. I accidentally hit him on the shoulder and i was banned from playing. I was even standing with my face towards the net when i hit the ball backwards and the ball even bounced before it hit the linesman. I had a great week and had played a couple of very good matches so this is a real shame for me.

    I'm gonna take a week of rest and i'll keep you uptodate.
     
    #28
  29. maverick66

    maverick66 Hall of Fame

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    if thats what happened i fail to see what the problem was. if she intentionally hit a ball at him i can see it as an issue. i saw moya do it once live where he hit at the lines on the baseline for foot fault and he only got warned so im not sure why she got defaulted. problem is even if she wins a protest on it she still loses that match and with that points and prizemoney are not as high as she might have gotten.
     
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  30. Rorsach

    Rorsach Hall of Fame

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    Looks like she's just not used to other people on the court. She did the same thing most of us do when the opponent hits a serve out, we give it an axtra bump to make sure the ball is gone so we don't trip over it.
     
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  31. tahiti

    tahiti Professional

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    Probably a thoughtless mistake but can they prove deliberate negligence? I doubt it.
     
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  32. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Guest

    Once again, if it was hit hard enough to injure or hurt the line umpire, it doesn't matter if it is intentional or not. She even says she was looking the opposite direction when she hit the ball. They are responsible for what they do.

    The other inconsistency in her version of the story is that it is a $50K tournament which means that there indeed line umpire all throughout the week from the start of main draw, unless it was a clay court tournament, then maybe not.
     
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  33. jms007

    jms007 Professional

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    They probably had linesmen this time, because it was a final, no?
     
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  34. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Guest

    at a 50K tournament, it's required to have line umpires the whole tournament. The difference, is there may have been 6 or 7 line umpires instead of 3-5
     
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  35. Cosmic Charlie

    Cosmic Charlie New User

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    Some tournaments, even Masters Series, have only two line umpires behind the receiver-one along the service centreline and the other along the side line. Immediately after the serve, the centreline line umpire scurries across to line up with the other side line.
    What I imagine is that in this final, they positioned 3 behind her, so while she was used to swinging at the dead ball, this time she struck an umpire who wasn't htere in previous rounds.

    What I remember is that malicious intent with minor fallout = no intent (accidental) resulting in an injury=default.
     
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  36. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Guest

    There would not have been 3 behind her. During most of the week, there would have been 1, and then for semis and finals, either 1 or 2.
     
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  37. jmverdugo

    jmverdugo Hall of Fame

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    So most linesman can duck a 140MPH from A Roddick but this one couldnt handle a sitter that even bounced beore hitting him in the shouder! Tough luck, of all the linesman you get the slower one! I saw something like happening in the Dubai tournament, I think Djokovic hit back a long serve by Simon and hit the lineman on the opposite side of the court, it even did not bounced it was a really fast shot. Nole apologize but the umpire did not say anything.
     
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  38. tacou

    tacou Legend

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    this is ridic. if you get hit in the FACE with a tennis ball it doesn't even leave a mark. I think a linesman can handle one to the shoulder?
     
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  39. Dave M

    Dave M Hall of Fame

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    1994,1995 something like that i think he was playing doubles with Broad.
     
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  40. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Guest

    1995. He was playing with Bates.
     
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  41. scs96ajr

    scs96ajr New User

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    Is this the same WTA that fined Dubai with 300K for not allowing an Israeli player to take part?

    Wow....
     
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  42. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Guest

    The WTA, once again, had nothing to do with this decision to default Wickmayer. It was an ITF Challenger. The decision was made solely by the USTA/ITF Supervisor on site.
     
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  43. Kaptain Karl

    Kaptain Karl Hall Of Fame

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    People, pay attention to woodrow's input. He's got the credentials to back up what he's posting.

    - KK
     
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  44. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Guest

    Thanks Karl.

    I just talked to the chair umpire that umpired Wickmayer's semifinal match. She had actually done something similar in the semis, except it was a baseline umpire that she almost hit head high. She received a code violation for this incident.

    In the finals, she hit the sideline umpire that was behind her in the FACE. Not the shoulder. The line umpire's face was red and swollen. The chair umpire that umpired the final is very very experienced and would not call the supervisor to the court unless it was pretty clearly a default situation. The supervisor agreed and that was why she was defaulted.
     
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  45. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Guest

    Oh, by the way, it hit the lineswoman on the fly, not after a bounce.
     
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  46. Topaz

    Topaz Legend

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    Thanks for the skinny, Woodrow. Sounds like, if she was warned in the semi, that she should have known better in the final.

    I'm sure she knows now!!!
     
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  47. split-step

    split-step Professional

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    It's amazing the clarity, proper information brings.

    Thank you for the info Woodrow!
     
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  48. jmverdugo

    jmverdugo Hall of Fame

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    Ok, now that we have the other side of the story it is obvious that the she kind of deserved it, however, I still think the linesman was slow, I mean have you seen those guys moving at the speed of light to avoid get hit by a man service.
     
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  49. Oui c'est moi.

    Oui c'est moi. Hall of Fame

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    Wickmayer is a tad annoying so i'm not suprised.
    It seems she's fond of gamesmanship (i'm not calling THIS gamesmanship btw).
     
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  50. woodrow1029

    woodrow1029 Guest

    Yes, when the serve is coming from 90 feet away. This was about 10 feet away.
     
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