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-   -   Evert/Navratilova: THE BAGEL WAR. (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=260997)

BTURNER 05-13-2009 07:01 PM

Evert/Navratilova: THE BAGEL WAR.
 
Because I had nothing else to do with my pathetic day ( stomach cramps etc) I researched bagels. Here's the results

Evert got a one bagel in career H to H combat against 97 players ( 97 sets)
Martina got one bagel in career H to H combat against 96 players( 96 sets)

Evert got multiple bagels in career H to H combat (excluding double bagel matches) adding up to 124 sets (she got three vs Bassett, 5 vs King, 4 vs Walsh etc)
Martina got multiple bagels in career H to H combat (excluding double bagel matches) adding up to 115 sets ( she got 3 vs T. Austin, 5 vs Turnbull, 2 vs Goolagong etc)

Evert won 51 double bagel matches. This includes 3 three setters and five players who were beaten 6-0,6-0 TWICE in the H to H. multiplying this x 2 makes for 102 sets. Grand total = 325 total sets without loosing a game

Martina won 27 double bagel matches. This includes 3 three setters as well ( coincidence!) and the one person she beat this way in two matches. Poor girl named Redondo) .multiplying this x 2 makes for 54 sets. Grand total =265 total sets without loosing a game.

Someone, I don't remember who in a post claimed Evert was the bagel queen. In this rivalry he is right!

BTURNER 05-13-2009 07:06 PM

Here's the list of sad characters Evert beat 6-0, 6-0 more than once in career H to H. Kiyommura, Tuero, Tenny ( this same Laura Tenny double bageled Martina once!), Veermaak, and Hee Lee

Of course for those not in the know already. Evert took 5 6-0 sets from Martina and she took 5 6-0 sets from Evert. Neither ever took a match 6-0,6-0 from the other.

Lionheart392 05-13-2009 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BTURNER (Post 3416743)
Here's the list of sad characters Evert beat 6-0, 6-0 more than once in career H to H. Kiyommura, Tuero, Tenny ( this same Laura Tenny double bageled Martina once!), Veermaak, and Hee Lee

Of course for those not in the know already. Evert took 5 6-0 sets from Martina and she took 5 6-0 sets from Evert. Neither ever took a match 6-0,6-0 from the other.

Evert gave Navratilova a double bagel in the 1981 Amelia Island final I believe. :)
Great posts!

BTURNER 05-13-2009 07:36 PM

1981 AMELIA ISLAND CLAY (O) F C. EVERT 6-0 6-0

Of course you are right. I had forgotten to add that! LOL well add it to the final numbers!

CEvertFan 05-13-2009 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BTURNER (Post 3416822)
1981 AMELIA ISLAND CLAY (O) F C. EVERT 6-0 6-0

Of course you are right. I had forgotten to add that! LOL well add it to the final numbers!

I was going to mention the double bagel for Chris until I scrolled down some more and found that it was already mentioned. :lol: I find it a little strange that neither Navratilova or Evert ever managed a bagel set against even a very young Graf. But she never managed one against them either so it evens out in the end.

Evert probably won more love sets than any other woman in the Open era with Navratilova and Graf hot on her heels I'm sure.

grafrules 05-13-2009 08:33 PM

Chris and Martina didnt play Steffi for the first time until 1985 and Steffi was already pretty good that year. She ended 1985 ranked #6 in the world and as a U.S Open semifinalist.

CEvertFan 05-13-2009 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grafrules (Post 3416980)
Chris and Martina didnt play Steffi for the first time until 1985 and Steffi was already pretty good that year. She ended 1985 ranked #6 in the world and as a U.S Open semifinalist.

Point taken and I remember now, that was the year that Graf beat Shriver in the quarters in three sets, all of them tiebreaks.

thalivest 05-13-2009 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lionheart392 (Post 3416791)
Evert gave Navratilova a double bagel in the 1981 Amelia Island final I believe. :)
Great posts!

I read that match was a turning point for Martina. Her new partner/trainer/motivator Nancy Lieberman was already disgusted with Martina's rather casual approach to fitness and training upon getting together with her, even before that match. After that match she basically asked Martina how embarassing that was, whether she wanted to keep experiencing that when she played a player of Chris's caliber, and basically told her to get her butt in gear. Boy did she ever form that point on.

jerriy 05-09-2012 05:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BTURNER (Post 3416743)
Here's the list of sad characters Evert beat 6-0, 6-0 more than once in career H to H. Kiyommura, Tuero, Tenny ( this same Laura Tenny double bageled Martina once!), Veermaak, and Hee Lee

Of course for those not in the know already. Evert took 5 6-0 sets from Martina and she took 5 6-0 sets from Evert. Neither ever took a match 6-0,6-0 from the other.

Hey BTURNER, could you help me w/ more info on that Laurie Tenney match? (presumably it happened some time in the 70s since, as I understand the old stats, Martina's last received double bagel dates back to 1981 (versus Evert
.

Jack Romeo 05-09-2012 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BTURNER (Post 3416822)
1981 AMELIA ISLAND CLAY (O) F C. EVERT 6-0 6-0

Of course you are right. I had forgotten to add that! LOL well add it to the final numbers!

isn't it true that the following year, in the same tournament, martina gained revenge by drubbing chris 6-0,6-2?

anyway, graf is the only other player i can think about who won a lot of bagel sets - most famously at the 1988 french open final, which, i believe, is the only grand slam final won by a double bagel. overall, she didn't play (and by extension, win) as many matches and tournaments as evert and navratilova (though she did win a few more slams). so i'm not expecting her numbers to be as high in terms of number of bagel sets won. but percentage-wise, i think she could be just as impressive.

Xavier G 05-10-2012 02:51 AM

Chris is probably the greatest female clay courter ever and fed many people bagels in her career! Not always just on clay either. She gave Tracy Austin two in a 6-0 6-0 win in the TS Champs semis indoors (Year Ending Champs) in 1982 and won the 1974 US Clay Court title beating a Miss/Mrs Chanfreau 0 and 0 also. Martina didn't play Amelia Island in 1982 and Chris won it again that year beating Andrea Jaeger in the final. Chris had suffered one of her rare clay defeats not long before to Jaeger at Hilton Head and got revenge next time up.

Lionheart392 05-10-2012 03:57 AM

Bagels don't seem as common nowadays. I'm guessing because all the girls hit the ball so hard it's usually enough to bag them at least a couple of games. Or they're all so mentally fragile they can't hold onto a lead...

scootad. 05-10-2012 07:41 AM

Its because the girls hit so hard but with less control overall than player like Steffi Seles Martina and Evert had. The top bashers like Serena, Sharapova, etc are likely to spray a bunch of errors in a row to allow them to lose a few games.

BTURNER 05-10-2012 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Romeo (Post 6516712)
isn't it true that the following year, in the same tournament, martina gained revenge by drubbing chris 6-0,6-2?

anyway, graf is the only other player i can think about who won a lot of bagel sets - most famously at the 1988 french open final, which, i believe, is the only grand slam final won by a double bagel. overall, she didn't play (and by extension, win) as many matches and tournaments as evert and navratilova (though she did win a few more slams). so i'm not expecting her numbers to be as high in terms of number of bagel sets won. but percentage-wise, i think she could be just as impressive.


Just correcting the factoid. That drubbing happened in 1984 three years hence not the next year. Martina had three victories on clay vs Evert out of 11 meeting. In fact the greatest disparity percentage by surfacebetween the two, is not grass or carpet but clay. All three victories were very convincing and two were in '84.

jerriy 05-11-2012 02:50 AM

^ BT, what about the Laurie Tenney match? I'm curious about any info available on that (you can estimate my curiosity by the fact that I went to the trouble of necromancing a 3 y/o dead thread ;>)
.

chandler bing 05-11-2012 04:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thalivest (Post 3417007)
I read that match was a turning point for Martina. Her new partner/trainer/motivator Nancy Lieberman was already disgusted with Martina's rather casual approach to fitness and training upon getting together with her, even before that match. After that match she basically asked Martina how embarassing that was, whether she wanted to keep experiencing that when she played a player of Chris's caliber, and basically told her to get her butt in gear. Boy did she ever form that point on.

The night before that match, Martina and Nancy Lieberman were up til 6am...ah...getting to know each other better :wink:

BTURNER 05-11-2012 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerriy (Post 6516381)
Hey BTURNER, could you help me w/ more info on that Laurie Tenney match? (presumably it happened some time in the 70s since, as I understand the old stats, Martina's last received double bagel dates back to 1981 (versus Evert
.

Noticed your post just last night and I'm trying for you. My problem is finding the site I got the data from three years ago. Had all of Martina's H to H by player and scores. I just went through all the names and found the bagels. Her new 'official' site is useless as a research tool.

nothingfails 05-27-2012 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Romeo (Post 6516712)
isn't it true that the following year, in the same tournament, martina gained revenge by drubbing chris 6-0,6-2?

1984 actually.


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