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-   -   Some explaination of the US college system? (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=404064)

MethodTennis 11-21-2011 12:12 PM

Some explaination of the US college system?
 
OK, im from the UK with no intention of playing college tennis but I read a lot of thread on here and have no idea what you guys are talking about sometimes. I had a bunch of questions and I compiled the best answers in this thread!

Can a D3 team get promoted to D2 though?

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClarkC (Post 6128494)
1) NCAA divisions are based on schools agreeing to be part of the division and abide by its scholarship limitations and other rules. Division I men's tennis gets 4.5 scholarships per team, I believe Division II is close to that or the same, and Division III does not offer scholarships for sports. The women's numbers are 8, 6, and 0 (based on memory) for these same three divisions. A school can decide it wants to change divisions, but that is an expensive multi-year process of getting approval, finding a conference to play in or starting out as an independent, etc. There is no promotion based on performance as you see in the English Football Leagues.

Are the best D2 schools better than some of the weaker D1s?
Quote:

2) Yes, there is overlap across divisions in terms of strength, especially because not all teams offer the full limit of scholarships for their division. A Division I school might offer no scholarships at all for tennis. They are in Division I because they offer scholarships in most of their other sports.
What age are students when they first begin at US college?
Quote:

3) About 18.
What would a 4 start recruit be interms of UK ranking or rating?
Quote:

All rating systems are flawed, however a 4 star recruit is likely to place somewhere between 5.2 and 4.2 on the LTA ratings sytem
How much do guys and girls train each week?
Quote:

5) 20 hours per week is the team training and match play limit, but elite teams circumvent this limit by having team captains organize unofficial physical fitness training sessions, and word gets back to the coach if you are skipping them.
Who do the different colleges play and how often do they play?
Quote:

6) Teams play 1-2 dual matches per week against other colleges, with about half their matches being within their conference and half being non-conference.
Is it college leagues or cup competitions?

Quote:

7) Colleges play for conference championships and qualify by computer rankings for the national championship tourney if they don't win their conference.
Is there much individual competition?
Quote:

8 ) The autumn has nothing but individual competition, with team vs. team in the spring. Then there is a national individual tourney in May right after the team tourney finishes.
What do these players do interms of tennis after college?
Quote:

9) After college, some try to play Futures and work their way up the ATP ladder. Most get on with their post-college lives and do not play professionally.
Is there a league system in the US for the top adult players which don't make the cut for ATP or futures level or is it all individual (or doubles) competition at that point beyond college?
Quote:

10) Post-college, league play is not very close to professional level and exists nationwide as a competitive recreational activity. They can enter Men's Open tournaments hosted by tennis clubs, even win some prize money there

ClarkC 11-21-2011 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gunnd5000 (Post 6128445)
OK, im from the UK with no intention of playig college tennis but I read a lot of thread on here and have no idea what you guys are talking about sometimes.

1) I get that there are 3 divisions. Can a D3 team get promoted to D2 though?
2) Are the best D2 schools better than some of the weaker D1s?
3) What age are students when they first begin at US college?
4) What would a 4 start recruit be interms of UK ranking or rating?
5) How much do guys and girls train each week?
6) Who do the different colleges play and how often do they play?
7) Is it college leagues or cup competitions?
8 ) Is there much individual competition?

9) What do these players do in terms of tennis after college?
10) Is their a league system in the US for the top players or is it all individual (or dubs)competition at that point?

Sorry for all the questions, just slightly confused by some of the stuff people talk about on here

1) NCAA divisions are based on schools agreeing to be part of the division and abide by its scholarship limitations and other rules. Division I men's tennis gets 4.5 scholarships per team, I believe Division II is close to that or the same, and Division III does not offer scholarships for sports. The women's numbers are 8, 6, and 0 (based on memory) for these same three divisions. A school can decide it wants to change divisions, but that is an expensive multi-year process of getting approval, finding a conference to play in or starting out as an independent, etc. There is no promotion based on performance as you see in the English Football Leagues.

2) Yes, there is overlap across divisions in terms of strength, especially because not all teams offer the full limit of scholarships for their division. A Division I school might offer no scholarships at all for tennis. They are in Division I because they offer scholarships in most of their other sports.

3) About 18.

4) No idea.

5) 20 hours per week is the team training and match play limit, but elite teams circumvent this limit by having team captains organize unofficial physical fitness training sessions, and word gets back to the coach if you are skipping them.

6) Teams play 1-2 dual matches per week against other colleges, with about half their matches being within their conference and half being non-conference.

7) Colleges play for conference championships and qualify by computer rankings for the national championship tourney if they don't win their conference.

8 ) The autumn has nothing but individual competition, with team vs. team in the spring. Then there is a national individual tourney in May right after the team tourney finishes.

9) After college, some try to play Futures and work their way up the ATP ladder. Most get on with their post-college lives and do not play professionally.

10) Post-college, league play is not very close to professional level and exists nationwide as a competitive recreational activity.

MethodTennis 11-21-2011 12:42 PM

thank you very much great post. So see post college do most guys just do individual comps if they have time and if they dont ditch the tennis competitions?

ClarkC 11-21-2011 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gunnd5000 (Post 6128521)
thank you very much great post. So see post college do most guys just do individual comps if they have time and if they dont ditch the tennis competitions?

Yes, they can enter Men's Open tournaments hosted by tennis clubs, even win some prize money there.

MethodTennis 11-21-2011 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClarkC (Post 6128659)
Yes, they can enter Men's Open tournaments hosted by tennis clubs, even win some prize money there.

are they pretty decent stanard wise?

treeman10 11-21-2011 01:59 PM

wow ClarkC, great response indeed.

corbind 11-21-2011 06:14 PM

ClarkC, that was a fantastic post. :)

andfor 11-22-2011 08:14 AM

Sticky thread nomination!

diredesire 11-22-2011 11:12 AM

stuck, enjoy.

Shalinidavid 02-06-2012 01:00 AM

Hi great very nice post Fantastic some explaination of the US collage sysrem
thanks to sharing............................:)
Bhangra dance

Lemmy 07-03-2014 11:21 AM

stupid question: what does ' 4.5 scholarships per team' means? I don't get the 0.5 as reading '4 scholarships per team' I would think the best 4 players get a scholarship from the university.

ClarkC 07-03-2014 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lemmy (Post 8528646)
stupid question: what does ' 4.5 scholarships per team' means? I don't get the 0.5 as reading '4 scholarships per team' I would think the best 4 players get a scholarship from the university.

Add up the cost of tuition, fees, textbooks, and room and board. That is the dollar value of one scholarship. If you split that money evenly between two players, each is counted as receiving 0.5 scholarships. That means their parents are forking over some money.

Men's tennis players rarely get full scholarships. They get partial scholarships, which might be accounted as 0.2 or 0.4 or 0.5 or 0.8 scholarships, depending on what they receive. The total across the roster can add up to no more than 4.5.

Women get full scholarships in NCAA Division I (up to a maximum of 8 per team), but not men.

Lemmy 07-03-2014 12:04 PM

Makes sense, thank!!

Lemmy 07-18-2014 01:43 PM

Here I am :)

Does U in players results page means the match was unfinished?



speaking of Thai-Son, this are his highlights in the Virginia Cavaliers page:
2013-14
ITA Atlantic Region Rookie of the Year
VaSID State Freshman of the Year
3rd Team All-ACC
Ranked as high as No. 112 nationally in singles
Posted a 20-1 singles record in dual match play
Missed fall season due to injury


Does 3rd Team All-ACC means his team (hence his university I guess) was the third best in the ACC conference?

I've noticed sometimes players are listed as recent graduante and graduate on tennisrecruiting, I guess recent graduate means they just recently enrolled in a university program that is about to being? I was looking in particular at Boltz profile. Also what does provisional means in this case?
More in general I don't get why players enrolled in undergraduate programs are listed as graduate.

Tnx

jaggy 07-18-2014 02:11 PM

1st team All-ACC would mean he was voted among the best, 2nd next and 3rd, 3rd best. Still a fair achievement.

A student-athlete has 4 years of playing eligibility and most do this while enrolled in undergraduate studies. However if they race through and finish early they can complete their 4 years of playing eligibility as graduate students. This is less common yet is happening more as many students arrive in college tested out of classes through AP credits etc and can graduate faster.

I hope this makes sense, feel free to ask more for clarification.

jaggy 07-18-2014 02:13 PM

On re-reading my response, All-ACC means only players in the ACC conference were eligible for this. If you played in say the SEC you would be considered for All-SEC voting.

TopDawg 07-18-2014 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lemmy (Post 8576405)

Does U in players results page means the match was unfinished?

Does 3rd Team All-ACC means his team (hence his university I guess) was the third best in the ACC conference?

I've noticed sometimes players are listed as recent graduante and graduate on tennisrecruiting, I guess recent graduate means they just recently enrolled in a university program that is about to being? I was looking in particular at Boltz profile. Also what does provisional means in this case?
More in general I don't get why players enrolled in undergraduate programs are listed as graduate.

Tnx

Yes, U means unfinished.

3rd team All-ACC is an individual award that he earned based on his results. There is a 1st team All Conference made up of the top players in the conference which is usually guys that play 1 or 2 in the lineup, then 2nd team would be the next best guys that probably play 2 or 3, then 3rd team is the best after that.

I think recent graduate means they just graduated in the current year. I'm not sure why it shows recent graduate on Boltz even though his graduation year was 2011 - probably since he's not American and didn't play college tennis it wasn't a high priority to update the profile. If your referring to it showing graduate on tennisrecruiting.net's page that means a graduate of high school.

Not sure on the use of "Provisional" for the graduating class. Maybe the assumption was made that he did finish up school but since it couldn't/wasn't confirmed they used that word.

Lemmy 07-18-2014 02:36 PM

Thanks, so actually KWIATKOWSKI at 19 is already graduate? Like he completed a full bachelor's degree of 3 or 4 years?
Then why is Boltz recent graduate if he's class of 2011? and what does mean?

Lemmy 07-18-2014 02:37 PM

edit: posted my last reply a few seconds after TopDawg post. tnx

Lemmy 07-18-2014 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TopDawg (Post 8576503)
Yes, U means unfinished.

3rd team All-ACC is an individual award that he earned based on his results. There is a 1st team All Conference made up of the top players in the conference which is usually guys that play 1 or 2 in the lineup, then 2nd team would be the next best guys that probably play 2 or 3, then 3rd team is the best after that.

Ok now I get it, it's a like a fantasy 1st team in that conference.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TopDawg (Post 8576503)
I think recent graduate means they just graduated in the current year. I'm not sure why it shows recent graduate on Boltz even though his graduation year was 2011 - probably since he's not American and didn't play college tennis it wasn't a high priority to update the profile. If your referring to it showing graduate on tennisrecruiting.net's page that means a graduate of high school.

Yes I was referring to the use of graduate on tennisrecruiting.net's pages, so KWIATKOWSKI graduated from high shool in 2013 and he'll begin his sophomore year in september at UVA. Now it makes sense.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TopDawg (Post 8576503)
Not sure on the use of "Provisional" for the graduating class. Maybe the assumption was made that he did finish up school but since it couldn't/wasn't confirmed they used that word

Well in Boltz case then he's earned his high school degree in 2011 which makes sense too, the only mystery now is the provisional thing.

Thanks that helped!


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