Talk Tennis

Talk Tennis (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php)
-   Pro Match Results and Discussion (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/forumdisplay.php?f=29)
-   -   Should Federer tank his match vs Fish? (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=404276)

OrangePower 11-23-2011 12:39 PM

Should Federer tank his match vs Fish?
 
I personally don't think Fed would intentionally tank, but, would this be a good strategic move?

Fed has already qualified for the semis. If he beats Fish, or loses but wins a set, he finishes first in his group. That means he gets Djokovic or Berdych in the semi (since Ferrer has already won the other group). On the other hand, if Fed tanks badly to Fish, he can finish second in his group, and get to play Ferrer in the semis.

I think Ferrer is a better match up for Fed than either Djokovic or Berdych (even though Ferrer is played fantastic tennis). So... would it be good strategy for Fed to tank in order to get that matchup?

Discuss...

Mike Sams 11-23-2011 12:42 PM

Ferrer has no game to bother Federer really. I think Federer is comfortable enough with his form to tangle with anybody no matter who it is. But I'm sure he'd consider Ferrer the easiest of the group.

Z3kk 11-23-2011 12:46 PM

Yeah, there's always that sort of flaw in the tournament format, but I think Fed will want the 200 points. I can't say though :S

RF_fan 11-23-2011 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Sams (Post 6135081)
Ferrer has no game to bother Federer really. I think Federer is comfortable enough with his form to tangle with anybody no matter who it is. But I'm sure he'd consider Ferrer the easiest of the group.

In general Ferrer would be easier for Fed, but at this time Djokovic is not playing well and Berdych didn't play that good either. Besides I don't think he should lose 200 points if he wants to be #1 again.
I think Fed wants to play Djokovic and settle some scores.

niff 11-23-2011 12:52 PM

There's a spreadsheet being kept up on MTF, they have Federer down as the winner of group B already.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...hl=en_US#gid=0

tennis_pro 11-23-2011 12:56 PM

Federer has already won the group. The only reason Fed would tank was to conserve energy but even here it's pointless since there's a day off between his last RR match and the semis.

iriraz 11-23-2011 01:02 PM

Even playing less then 100% Federer should beat Fish easily who is really struggling out there.

NadalAgassi 11-23-2011 01:04 PM

Tanking vs an injured Fish would just create a longer more draining win. Better to just play well and win the match in 35 minutes and save energy for the semis.

SLD76 11-23-2011 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NadalAgassi (Post 6135174)
Tanking vs an injured Fish would just create a longer more draining win. Better to just play well and win the match in 35 minutes and save energy for the semis.

at first I lol'd.


then I thought about some more and I LOL'D!

OrangePower 11-23-2011 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by niff (Post 6135133)
There's a spreadsheet being kept up on MTF, they have Federer down as the winner of group B already.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...hl=en_US#gid=0

Quote:

Originally Posted by tennis_pro (Post 6135148)
Federer has already won the group. The only reason Fed would tank was to conserve energy but even here it's pointless since there's a day off between his last RR match and the semis.

Not true.

Fed is 2-0 in matches, 4-1 in sets. Tsonga for example is 1-1, 3-2.

Let's say Fish beats Fed in straights, and Tsonga beats Nadal in straights. Then Fed ends up 2-1, 4-3, and Tsonga 2-1, 5-2.

In that case, Tsonga wins the group and Fed finishes second.

tennis_pro 11-23-2011 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OrangePower (Post 6135206)
Not true.

Fed is 2-0 in matches, 4-1 in sets. Tsonga for example is 1-1, 3-2.

Let's say Fish beats Fed in straights, and Tsonga beats Nadal in straights. Then Fed ends up 2-1, 4-3, and Tsonga 2-1, 5-2.

In that case, Tsonga wins the group and Fed finishes second.

nope, h2h (of the tournament, Fed won against both Tsonga and Nadal) is more important than % of sets/games won so Fed even if he gets double bageled by Fish still wins the group

Maybe this will help (from wiki):

Standings are determined by: 1) Number of wins; 2) Number of matches; 3) In two-players-ties, head-to-head records; 4) In three-players-ties, percentage of sets won, or of games won; 5) Steering Committee decision.

sportsfan1 11-23-2011 01:15 PM

Its a risky ploy. Better to maintain momentum.

OrangePower 11-23-2011 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tennis_pro (Post 6135217)
nope, h2h (of the tournament, Fed won against both Tsonga and Nadal) is more important than % of sets/games won so Fed even if he gets double bageled by Fish still wins the group

Maybe this will help (from wiki):

Standings are determined by: 1) Number of wins; 2) Number of matches; 3) In two-players-ties, head-to-head records; 4) In three-players-ties, percentage of sets won, or of games won; 5) Steering Committee decision.

Oops, I stand corrected - thanks for the clarification.

In this case, Fed and Ferrer will not meet in the semis no matter what happens in the remaining matches. So the only benefit for Fed to tank is to conserve energy.

10is 11-23-2011 01:27 PM

That would be supremely stupid... and doubly stupid are the individuals suggesting that Federer would shy away from a potential match with Djokovic, implying that Federer "fears" (LOL!!!!!) him.

tennis_pro 11-23-2011 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OrangePower (Post 6135249)
Oops, I stand corrected - thanks for the clarification.

In this case, Fed and Ferrer will not meet in the semis no matter what happens in the remaining matches. So the only benefit for Fed to tank is to conserve energy.

And even there it's pointless cause there's 1 day off between his last RR match and the semis.

Not sure about Ferrer winning the group, though. If Berdych wins tomorrow and Djokovic loses again (against Tipsarevic) Berdych wins the group and Ferrer is second. What's certain at this point is that Ferrer has qualified for the semis no matter what, we still don't know if he finishes 1st or 2nd in the group.

AM95 11-23-2011 01:31 PM

200 points, plus keeping his 14 match winning streak alive. dont see him tanking.

cc0509 11-23-2011 01:33 PM

He does not have to play that well to defeat Fish. You won't see him go all out that is for sure.

powerangle 11-23-2011 01:34 PM

Gotta love TW and the tanking theorists. Some of the most recent thread titles here:

"Did Djokovic tank today?"

"Should Federer tank his match vs Fish?"

"Could Djokovic tank a match against Tipsarevic?"

Li Ching Yuen 11-23-2011 01:44 PM

Both Federer and Ferrer and sure winners of their group.

The next round will just choose their opponents.

OrangePower 11-23-2011 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tennis_pro (Post 6135260)
And even there it's pointless cause there's 1 day off between his last RR match and the semis.

Hey, when you are an old man, every extra day of rest helps :-)

I know this from personal experience!


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:36 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
© 2006 - Tennis Warehouse