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-   -   Coaching/advice rules during match (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=427513)

TroutSc 06-10-2012 12:10 PM

Coaching/advice rules during match
 
Watched my wife's flex league match yesterday and was curious about what's normal/acceptable regarding talk in between games or sets. Am I allowed to talk to her? I didn't want to take a chance of being a d/bag so I just watched from a distance. I noticed a few things from my perspective and wanted to tell her. What is acceptable?

(she won her match! Yay!)

Taxvictim 06-10-2012 12:26 PM

Usually the rule is no coaching allowed. There is an exception in some leagues that the team captain can talk to team during the match.

Cindysphinx 06-10-2012 02:13 PM

No, you can't coach your wife during the match. You can say whatever you want about her tennis after the match.

You, uh, sure you want to go there?

NLBwell 06-10-2012 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cindysphinx (Post 6619149)
You, uh, sure you want to go there?

Cindy knows these things!

Big_Dangerous 06-10-2012 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cindysphinx (Post 6619149)
No, you can't coach your wife during the match. You can say whatever you want about her tennis after the match.

You, uh, sure you want to go there?

Footwork!

Omg, why did you choose to play that shot? You should have gone back cross court....

:lol:

TroutSc 06-10-2012 06:32 PM

Thanks! No, she played great but I could see some things that her opponent struggled hard with. She honed in on them but it took a little longer. The girl was a beast at the net but slow and flat footed. If she could draw her in and then lob then it was a sure point. As long as she didn't hit within this girls reach it would work, otherwise this beast would nail it back. First set was a 6/1 loss than a 6/3 win, then a tiebreak win. It just took awhile to figure out but I could see it early from my view. I'll keep my mouth shut. I was even txting her "make her run!" just incase she checked her phone in a switch. It all worked out in the end, just checking on the rules.

This is her first season doing singles, exciting stuff. So far 2 for 2.

LeeD 06-10-2012 06:35 PM

Use signals, she can ignore you if she so desires.
Footwork, play your index and middle fingers like you're moving on a court.
Watch the ball, double point to your eyes.
Slow down, calm down, signal safe.
Hype up, get excited, double thumbs up.
Work out your own signals.

Taxvictim 06-10-2012 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TroutSc (Post 6619741)
I was even txting her "make her run!" just incase she checked her phone in a switch. It all worked out in the end, just checking on the rules.

Oh no you didn't! Now my team has to start telling other players not to check their phones at the changeovers.

TENNIS4FUN2 06-10-2012 07:48 PM

I have several women on my team whose husbands watch our matches. I have never seen one of them give advice without it resulting in a sarcastic comment coming from their wife/girlfriend!! :))

That being said, women play so differently than men that what you may suggest may not work for her. Also, if she happens to get one of those "*****y" opponents, and you are giving signals, she can complain about coaching. I know you mean well but personally I would wait and see if your wife asks you for advice. Hope I haven't offended you :)

Mauvaise 06-12-2012 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cindysphinx (Post 6619149)
You, uh, sure you want to go there?


Why wouldn't he want to "go there?" Some people (even women*) appreciate a good post-match analysis, especially if the observer is picking up on something that will improve their game in the future.




*I'm one of them.

blakesq 06-12-2012 10:04 AM

Obviously said by a non-married fellow!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mauvaise (Post 6625592)
Why wouldn't he want to "go there?" Some people (even women*) appreciate a good post-match analysis, especially if the observer is picking up on something that will improve their game in the future.




*I'm one of them.


Cindysphinx 06-12-2012 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mauvaise (Post 6625592)
Why wouldn't he want to "go there?" Some people (even women*) appreciate a good post-match analysis, especially if the observer is picking up on something that will improve their game in the future.




*I'm one of them.

What makes you think it would be a "good post-match analysis"?

There is another kind of post-match analysis. Hint: A lot of people don't know what they're talking about.

Mauvaise 06-13-2012 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blakesq (Post 6625925)
Obviously said by a non-married fellow!

Obviously said by someone that failed to see my footnote: I am a woman. ;)



Quote:

Originally Posted by Cindysphinx (Post 6626121)
What makes you think it would be a "good post-match analysis"?

There is another kind of post-match analysis. Hint: A lot of people don't know what they're talking about.


Why would you automatically assume it wouldn't be? Of course a lot of people don't know what they're talking about - but a lot of people *do*. I don't see why, without any evidence to the contrary, you'd automatically jump to the negative conclusion.

It's a bad stereotype to automatically assume that a man is only going to be overly critical of their partner or give bad advice. From what the OP said, it seems as he had a good insight and an appreciation for his wife's game.

tennis tom 06-13-2012 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TroutSc (Post 6618829)
Watched my wife's flex league match yesterday and was curious about what's normal/acceptable regarding talk in between games or sets. Am I allowed to talk to her? I didn't want to take a chance of being a d/bag so I just watched from a distance. I noticed a few things from my perspective and wanted to tell her. What is acceptable?

(she won her match! Yay!)

That used to be an easy answer, NO COACHING ALLOWED! Tennis, along with the rest of the world, has evolved to a higher form of complexity and now coaching is allowed in various formats, high-school, WTA, college. It's illegal to do so from the stands but coaches and parents do so regularly and when caught obviously coaching are penalized for attempting to covertly do it. Consult the Flex League rules or seek out a flex league attorney specialist for the current rules on coaching in your instance.

Cindysphinx 06-13-2012 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mauvaise (Post 6628630)
Why would you automatically assume it wouldn't be? Of course a lot of people don't know what they're talking about - but a lot of people *do*. I don't see why, without any evidence to the contrary, you'd automatically jump to the negative conclusion.

The reason I assume most advice by recreational players is of minimal value is my own experience. Most rec players (4.5 and below) have a poor understanding of stroke mechanics, and many are pretty lame with strategy too.

Believe me, I do not have to go back to ancient history to find examples of rec players giving advice when they have no clue what they are talking about it. Let's take this week as an example. A doubles player cheerfully showed me her new grip for serving: EF. She had been using Continental, but she was abandoning it because the pros all use Eastern FH for serving, she said. Oy.

So yeah. There is a lot of bad advice to be had, and I would say most advice rec players give is either wrong or just not the right diagnosis or prescription to fix the problem. Most people would do better to leave the coaching to the professionals.

TroutSc 06-13-2012 06:25 PM

We worked it out...went with a Bluetooth solution. Constant connectivity throughout the match.

rkelley 06-13-2012 09:55 PM

No, coaching is not allowed except in the cases of a team competition. If you coach your wife you're cheating, whether it's talking, hand signals, or using a Bluetooth.

That aspect of a player figuring out an opponent and the match by themselves, without help, is part of tennis. When one player has outside help and the other doesn't it can be a huge tactical, emotional, and psychological edge. It can also backfire as Cindy mentions.

In team competition both players have access to coaching and the support of the team so there's no unfair advantage.

From our friends at the USTA (tired to post the link but the website isn't allowing it).
**********************************
During the playing of a match in a team competition, a player may receive coaching from a captain who is sitting on the court only when he changes ends at the end of a game, but not when he changes ends during a tie-break game.

A player may not receive coaching during the playing of any other match.

After due warning an offending player may be disqualified. When an approved point penalty system is in operation, the Umpire shall impose penalties according to that system.

Case 1. Should a warning be given, or the player be disqualified, if the coaching is given by signals in an unobtrusive manner?

Decision. The Umpire must take action as soon as he becomes aware that coaching is being given verbally or by signals. If the Umpire is unaware that coaching is being given, a player may draw his attention to the fact that advice is being given.

Case 2. Can a player receive coaching during an authorized rest period under Rule 30(e), or when play is interrupted and he leaves the court?

Decision. Yes. In these circumstances, when the player is not on the court, there is no restriction on coaching.

ITF Note: The word "coaching" includes any advice or instruction.

[USTA Comment: Coaching is not permitted in the USTA Adult and Senior League Program except during authorized rest periods.]

********************************

TroutSc 06-14-2012 03:39 AM

The Bluetooth was a joke. Thanks for the rules.

rkelley 06-14-2012 07:40 AM

Sorry. I'm dense.

A bit of sore subject for me because I once had to suffer through a match where my opponent was being coached all through the match. The coach and player insisted it was legal and at the time I didn't know the official rule, but it felt like two against one.

goran_ace 06-14-2012 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taxvictim (Post 6619820)
Oh no you didn't! Now my team has to start telling other players not to check their phones at the changeovers.

Our district has set rules against cell phones on the court, partly because it's annoying and partly because of outside coaching. You are not allowed to check your phone at all during a match and you can even be penalized for audible tones (ringing, texts, alerts). There was a note sent to team captains saying that this will be strictly enforced.


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