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-   -   Criticizing Your Vanquished Opponent's Strokes (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=428146)

Cindysphinx 06-14-2012 10:40 AM

Criticizing Your Vanquished Opponent's Strokes
 
I played a 4.0 dubs match with a new partner today. A nice lady who was playing up. We stood no chance from the get-go. No need to go into why. We took an unbelievable beatdown with grace and dignity. The only two games we won were my service games, when I served slice serves and kick serves to the deuce player, who missed just enough to allow us to win those sad little games.

When we approached the net, we had something like the following conversation:

********************

Cindy: Nice playing, ladies.

Cindy's Partner: You guys are good. Nice match.

Ad Opponent (to Cindy): Wow, you have a lot of topspin on your serve. That's awesome.

Cindy: Thanks. You have some serious topspin your own self!

Deuce Opponent (to Cindy): You know, there's something you could do better on your topspin serve. You're tossing the ball too far back. I know all the teaching pros say you should toss so the ball would fall down onto your head, but that's just wrong. You want to toss into the court, not over your head. That's why your topspin serves were landing so short, you know. 'Cause you toss the ball too far back.

Cindy: Um, thanks. It's a new serve for me. I guess I will have to keep working on it.

Deuce Opponent: Yeah, you should. It's landing way too short. Toss it into the court and it will be much better.

*******************

Afterward, my partner almost burst a blood vessel, she was so annoyed. "Who does she think she is? If your serve is so short, how come she kept missing it? Your serve is a whole lot better than her serve."

I have to say, I was a bit taken aback. When I win a match, I never offer up unsolicited advice to my opponents. I certainly never criticize one of their strokes, especially if my stroke is no better. If my opponents asked me, I might offer up a tip or two, but I cannot think of a time when my vanquished opponents asked for a mini-lesson. So I keep my pie hole shut about their strokes unless I have something to praise.

And if I did offer up unsolicited advice to someone I just beat from my vantage point at the opposite baseline, I would take special care to make sure my advice was actually correct.

Larrysümmers 06-14-2012 10:54 AM

sounds like all she wanted to do was help...some people are just like that

OrangePower 06-14-2012 11:01 AM

I don't comment on my opponents' game. Regardless of whether I win or lose, I don't offer praise or advice.

I usually just say something like 'well played' - as long as my opponent did not play so badly that he would view this as sarcasm, in which case I just say 'thanks for the match'.

When an opponent makes comments about my game, I just nod my head slightly in an non-committal fashion and move on.

Nostradamus 06-14-2012 11:03 AM

When you beat them next time, just say "Thanks honey for the tip, it really worked out for me"

Cindysphinx 06-14-2012 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larrysümmers (Post 6631859)
sounds like all she wanted to do was help...some people are just like that

Yeah, I guess so.

Maybe I should have "helped" her also. I could have replied, "Hey, thanks. Say, I kind of noticed that you're struggling with your weight. At least, I hope you're struggling and haven't given up entirely. Two words, dear: Fruits and vegetables. Although some push-ups and sit-ups wouldn't go amiss either."

dizzlmcwizzl 06-14-2012 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cindysphinx (Post 6632071)
Two words, dear: Fruits and vegetables. Although some push-ups and sit-ups wouldn't go amiss either."

I want to see the thread that would have accompanied this conversation.

cknobman 06-14-2012 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OrangePower (Post 6631891)
I don't comment on my opponents' game. Regardless of whether I win or lose, I don't offer praise or advice.

I usually just say something like 'well played' - as long as my opponent did not play so badly that he would view this as sarcasm, in which case I just say 'thanks for the match'.

When an opponent makes comments about my game, I just nod my head slightly in an non-committal fashion and move on.

This is the approach I take.

Only exception is when I am playing a good friend in a match that is not part of a tournament or a league. Since its not competitive and we are good friends we often give praise or constructive criticism to each other.

Loose Cannon 06-14-2012 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OrangePower (Post 6631891)
I don't comment on my opponents' game. Regardless of whether I win or lose, I don't offer praise or advice.

I usually just say something like 'well played' - as long as my opponent did not play so badly that he would view this as sarcasm, in which case I just say 'thanks for the match'.

When an opponent makes comments about my game, I just nod my head slightly in an non-committal fashion and move on.


I completely agree. I am not humble enough to do the whole 'you played great.....or I had a lucky day'.......that some do.....when they win.
'

This is the first time I have agreed with OP......

That is annoying......although I have heard much worse. It did seem as if she was offering advice......just probably not worded as smoothly as it could have been, if at all.


Whn I do lose....Im already feeling down and making excuses as to why I lost......why would I need your help????

dcdoorknob 06-14-2012 12:23 PM

I wouldn't be insulted if someone decided to offer advice. I'd listen, and either agree they have a point or just throw it out (in my own head) as bad advice. In this case it would definitely be the latter, sounds like awful advice for a kick serve.

Don't get why you're even going there with the weight thing. Seems like you're making it out to be much more than it should be in your own mind.

I wouldn't hardly ever offer any unsolicited advice myself, but will occasionally pay a brief compliment on a particular shot, and if someone compliments one of my shots (hey you've really got a nice backhand there), I'll usually pick a shot of theirs and return the favor (thanks. I wish I had your volleys though), or maybe just say thanks if they played fairly poorly all around nothing comes to mind. :shock:

floridatennisdude 06-14-2012 12:41 PM

I always listen to advice people offer up, especially if they just beat me. If they are willing to offer up points as to how they defeated my game, I'm all ears. If I just thrashed them, there is little chance I will pay much attention to their advice.

I find some people helpful, and others downright idiots. Not hard to figure out who is which.

Maui19 06-14-2012 12:47 PM

I can tell you in the golf world, it is considered incredibly bad form to offer unsolicited advice. I guess people hate it because it is presumptuous and intrusive (and often this type of advice is just plain wrong).

Personally, if some stranger killed me in a match then offered me advice, I would take a very dim few.

I'm still laughing about "overweight" comeback thing.

AR15 06-14-2012 12:53 PM

I don't agree with what they said.

However, if everyone acted "normally", we wouldn't have anything to discuss here.

mikeler 06-14-2012 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by floridatennisdude (Post 6632197)
I always listen to advice people offer up, especially if they just beat me. If they are willing to offer up points as to how they defeated my game, I'm all ears. If I just thrashed them, there is little chance I will pay much attention to their advice.

I find some people helpful, and others downright idiots. Not hard to figure out who is which.


Agreed. Perhaps Cindy's opponents should have asked and said "Do you mind if I offer you advice on your serve?".

jonnyjack 06-14-2012 01:13 PM

http://www.dilbert.com/2012-06-14/

decades 06-14-2012 01:20 PM

what's worse is when you get lessons from people you beat 6-0.

ChipNCharge 06-14-2012 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cindysphinx (Post 6632071)
Maybe I should have "helped" her also. I could have replied, "Hey, thanks. Say, I kind of noticed that you're struggling with your weight. At least, I hope you're struggling and haven't given up entirely. Two words, dear: Fruits and vegetables. Although some push-ups and sit-ups wouldn't go amiss either."

Or, "are you pregnant, or just gaining weight?"

Cindysphinx 06-14-2012 02:38 PM

By the way . . .

I just want to go on record that my kick serves were not landing short because of my toss. They were landing short because (1) I was serving into the wind, and (2) these short serves seemed to be working.

There are a lot of players who do not move forward into their returns and who instead wait for the ball to come to them. If I hit a kick serves that dives close to the net, these players will often misjudge it just enough. Add in the players who struggle with mid-court balls in general and even a short kicker isn't the kiss of death.

Not that I'm feeling defensive or anything . . . . :)

Cindy -- who thinks she needs to let the ball drop more and use more legs to get the ball higher over the net for additional depth

LeeD 06-14-2012 02:41 PM

I WISH I could consistently hit short twist serves. Then I"d go for MORE ANGLE, run the player into the sidefence, and my ball will have already hit there...:shock:
Unfortunately, the majority seem to clear the net by 4', and land close to the service line with a high bounce....:(:(

Cindysphinx 06-14-2012 02:46 PM

Lee, I can't even place my kick serve. Or, more accurately, I should say I cannot get it to land anywhere except the place the last one landed.

On those rare occasions when one goes short and angled . . . automatic ace.

It last happened in November, I think. :(

OK, now I have to go play another match (yes, a second match -- Gawd, I am so sore!). I predict I will be thinking about my toss and will double-fault my head off.

LuckyR 06-14-2012 02:53 PM

Why is it that the very players who offer unsolicited and controversial advice are the very same who have the least tolerance for receiving such advice?


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