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ZhuangCorp 05-03-2004 08:35 PM

0 Grasscourt Masters??
Why are there no Masters on grass court? This seems very unfair to the grass court players like Henman and Phillipousis.

I noticed most of the masters are on hard court or clay, there should be more on grass.

Also, what is greenset?

Deuce 05-03-2004 09:16 PM

Interesting - if obvious - observation.

Having a Masters tournament on grass would be good in that it would help to revive grasscourt tennis. And it would be nice if they held it in an unexpected location, like somewhere in Asia, for instance.

Another problem would be the timing. The grasscourt season - such as it is - is very short. Holding a Masters on grass after Wimbledon would be anti-climactic. And there's not really any time before Wimbledon. Roland Garros and Wimbledon would have to be separated further in order for a Masters on grass to be a possibility.

Fat Boy 05-04-2004 12:24 AM

Every now and then there's speculation that Masters status will be given to the Stella Artois (London) or Gerry Weber (Halle).

At least the Stella Artois is sold out each and every day. Unlike the fiasco in Rome, where (again) the stands are empty. Ivanisevic would still have 'em queuing in London. It was 2 men and a dog watching him in Rome.

If Italians don't like watching tennis, why not put this tournament on somewhere they do.

Greenset is a rubber mat used mainly for indoors. Often (incorrectly) referred to as "carpet". It can be slow or fast depending on how much grit is used in the manufacturing.

ucd_ace 05-04-2004 12:44 AM

I think it would be great if there were a Tennis Masters Series event on grass. The way it is now makes it hit or miss for those players who do best on grass... either they win Wimby or their hopes for a top finish are shattered. There's talk every once and awhile of creating a bigger space between the French and Wimby which I think would be awesome if they turned that period into a grass court season. Maybe a week or two of minor grass court tournaments with a TMS and then concluded with Wimby. Imagine what a grass court season could mean to a guy like Taylor Dent who is currently sitting around in the 30's playing nearly every tournament off of his most benificial surface or a guy like Henman who I could see taking a win in a TMS on grass and riding it into the Tennis Masters Cup final 8. It would also bring more players to develop a more well rounded game, which is always nice to see...

jings 05-04-2004 01:35 AM

The grim reality, sadly, is that grass is increasingly less relevant. That said I would love to see more tournaments on the surface and a TMS would change the green stuff's standing in a thrice. The Aussie used to be grass of course and I guess if there is a place in the season for it then Down Under would be a good bet. Good weather, experience of the stuff and some local support - Leyton won the big one after all.

Hard to know if constructing a mini grass court season would be more relevant (ie Stella TMS and Wimbledon) than grass split between TMS in Aussie early season or indeed in the US later, with Wimbledon and related warm ups in the middle. What you would know quickly is weather baseline clay courter aversions to Wimbledon rankings were as such or merely an excuse for their allergic reaction to the green stuff.

Rabbit 05-04-2004 04:56 AM

Jings is right, grass court tennis is losing all relevancy. I think it's a shame. Wimbledon is already losing its prestige with a growing number of claycourters and will continue to slide IMO. The best solution to this is for the U.S. Open to change its surface back to grass. That would mean the grass court season starts after the French and runs through the end of the season. After the U.S. Open final in September, the players could take some time off.

I've talked to a couple of guys who've been lucky enough to play grass court events. They tell me that the difference in the abuse your body takes is incredible. Grass is much cooler and much easier on the legs.

Sounds like the Australian Open would be a great candidate to go back to grass as well. The Rebound Ace surface, while being a very equal surface, seems to be very hard on the players, especially their ankles.

John Lloyd of England has said that Wimbledon should think of moving to hard courts and getting away from grass. I sure hope that doesn't happen.

The empty seats at Rome aren't an anomaly. I don't think tennis is in that great a shape with the fans.

Feņa14 05-04-2004 08:33 AM

I love Wimbledon and watching the Stella and all tournaments on grass.

I think a TMS would be amazing on grass and promote it which could give more meaning to Wimbledon.

The problem is what has already been said, where can you put it in?

Also as Deuce wanted them to change the TMS Clay to the purple colour then it would be interesting to see the purple grass :lol:

I also heard that most clay courters prefer to smoke grass than play on it with the only exception being Ferrero, afterall he had a grass court put in to his home club in Valencia to prepare for Wimbledon.


AndyC 05-04-2004 09:56 AM

Grass becoming irrelevent? Hmm.. I'd disagree. It has a place in history and the game. The only sad thing is the pros who are short-sighted enough to believe that it's irrelevent and ignore a grand slam event. Those that are aiming for a place in the history books will no doubt put in the time and effort enough to ensure their competitiveness.

Ballmachine 05-04-2004 10:50 AM

If you look at the schedule, it makes no sense at all. You have a whole clay court season that leads up to the French Open. Then, two weeks after the French you have Wimbledon. Why on Earth haven't they changed this ridiculous schedule years ago? Players should have a break after Roland Garros, and then there should be at least a month, or 6 week period of grass court tournaments leading up to Wimbledon. That is why it is so rare for a player to win the French Open and then two weeks later take Wimbledon. There just isn't enough prep time.

What seems puzzling to me is that years ago, 3 out of the 4 grandslam tournaments played were on grass. Why did grass lose its favor as a tournament surface? I think bringing grass back would be beneficial to the sport because it would reduce the horrible amount of injuries that currently plagues the men's and women's tour. Why not bring back a surface that is easier on the knees and back. Such a move might even prove to lengthen the careers of many players. Grass may be more difficult to maintain than a clay or hardcourt surface, but these tournaments make a huge amount of profit, and the upkeep would be small in comparison to the financial rewards. This is especially true if more of the top players can enter these tournaments because of fewer injuries.

I still can't imagine how this ridiculous tennis schedule has lasted this long. Each grandslam tournament should have the same amount of time before the start to have warm-up events on the surface that the slam will be played on. It would create a shorter season, more excitement, fewer injuries, and more anticipated match-ups. It seems stupid not to do it.

The tennis guy 05-04-2004 11:19 AM

First of all, I had played on grass quite often, it is the best feeling surface in the world.

The reason grass court has been out of favor is simple, economics. It is expensive to maintain grass court. I would love to see more grass court tournaments.

Wimbledon is partially to blame for short time between Roland Garros and Wimbledon. Wimbledon wants to keep tradition so much, it even refuses to consider moving Wimbledon back for a couple of weeks.

I don't think US Open is ever going to change surface to grass. The best chance for a switch to grass is Australia Open. I think they should switch to grass since they have great grass court tradition, US Open slows down the speed of its hardcourt surface a little bit to neutralize overall speed of grand slams if Australia switches to grass.

borisboris 05-04-2004 01:31 PM

I played in Sorrento, IT last yr w/ the #1 jr and a local dr who was in their Federation for years. They both said tennis is very expensive in Italy - almost elitest sport especially compared to soccer. It's understandable why only a mother and her dog are watching FEDEX. Stella Artois is a great event to visit but can't be a Masters because there's no grass tourney's leading up to it. I think Nottingham is a week prior but that's not enough for top tier players to prep after Roland Garros.

Anonymous 05-04-2004 03:54 PM


Ronaldo 05-04-2004 05:05 PM

Grass is for cows and those that own one, no Masters Green please.

baseliner 05-05-2004 08:09 AM

1. Above suggestions to seperate French Open and Wimby to create a grass court "season" sounds good to me.
2. Shances of getting either Aussie Open or US Open to go back to grass are minimal. As John Lloyd said grass court tennis is almost irrelevant. Sad but true.
3. For a grass court masters series tournament what about Newport. Istn't that still played on grass. Prestigious location with the USTA hall of fame I think. May be after Wimby but US TV money would dominate.
4. For long term success on the tour, the tennis governing bodies need to consider the wear and tear on the player's bodies. Grass is the easiest surface on the body. Clay while soft takes longer to set up the points so grass is less wearing. Establishing a grass court season of 2-3 months should be popular with the players (non-Euro clay courters of course).

root 05-05-2004 09:58 AM

Is it just me, or is grass tennis _booring_? Points are are incredibly short, often end in an unforced error, 90% of game is determined by serve. Yes, you might see a some nice net attacks and passing shots, but these are rare. Even players complain, that that grass has the most f****d bounce and it is very difficult to anticipate how the ball comes up from surface. Extending grasscourt season is IMHO very bad idea and will no way do good for popularity of tennis.

Sure, hardcourt is hard on body, but we have clay. I would much more like, if wimbledon would convert to clay.

Btw, greenset is not rubber mat, it's ordinary hardcourt, although a bit softer.

Verbal_Kint 05-05-2004 10:05 AM

Grass is good for the legs, but bad for the arm because of the bad bounces. Artificial grass is not a bad surface IMO.


Max G. 05-05-2004 01:36 PM

I'll take anything that favors serve and volleyers... if a longer grasscourt season means we see more of them, I'm all for it.

jings 05-05-2004 05:59 PM

About time these prima donnas earned their cash and showed us that they've got enough talent to deal with an ever so slightly un-predictable bounce. If I can handle the bounce on some makeshift grass courts thrown together in two days here, then they can surely deal with the almost perfect bounce of dedicated "carpet-like" courts at Wimby, Queens Club and Newport etc.

I don't think grass is boring, but all with have many opinions on that. What grass does provide is variety to the game which is surely a good thing. We rate Agassi as great champion for many reasons but one of the major ones has been his ability to lift all 4 GS titles, but a question mark we raise over Sampras. Grass is as legitimate a test of tennis skill as any other surface, and arguably the best because the game is after all "Lawn Tennis".

Deuce 05-05-2004 09:24 PM

To avoid 87 aces in a match, let's have a grass court Masters where everyone must play with a standard size wood frame.

Would that really be so bad? Seriously - it would generate more revenue than if the same tournament were held using today's racquets - because of the novelty effect. So, for both 'purists' as well as those who look at only the financial element of tournaments, this would be a good thing...

Max G. 05-06-2004 02:07 PM

Hehe, that would be interesting, Deuce. I don't think it's realistic - but I wouldn't mind at all.

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