Talk Tennis

Talk Tennis (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php)
-   College Tennis Talk (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/forumdisplay.php?f=40)
-   -   Mitchell Frank had knee surgery (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=435361)

kme5150 08-08-2012 04:37 AM

Mitchell Frank had knee surgery
 
Mitchell Frank had knee surgery and will be out until January.

http://www2.cavalierinsider.com/spor...-s-ar-2109065/

SoCal10s 08-08-2012 06:34 AM

wow.. this will give the other teams a fighting chance.. Frank was a sure win much like Stevie J.

mikej 08-08-2012 06:46 AM

Other teams already had more than a fighting chance, don't think UVA was even my favorite for the ACC title - but I'm biased no doubt

And I don't put frank in the same league of lock status as Johnson, not even close, just ask @theotherkobe

With a game very dependent on his mobility and outlasting others, this may be a big big deal

SoCal10s 08-08-2012 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikej (Post 6791128)

And I don't put frank in the same league of lock status as Johnson, not even close, just ask @theotherkobe

With a game very dependent on his mobility and outlasting others, this may be a big big deal

OK .. you're going to tell me the Frank wasn't a sure win at #3 ?? he did not play the top spot last year ,and was ranked #1 for most of the year ..

mikej 08-08-2012 10:23 AM

yes, that's what i'm telling you brokowski

even though he played 3, he was not the lock that johnson was at 1 (72 matches dating back to january 2011...like i said, ask peter kobelt if he thinks johnson's streak is in danger of being matched by frank)

great player, no doubt, one of the most remarkable falls in history, especially for a freshman, but he's no unbeatable stevie j, surprising that a socal man would claim such

Jakes On A Plane 08-08-2012 11:32 AM

He was pretty much unbeatable at #3. If Ohio State didn't suck on the big stage and had played UVA in the final, Frank would've outlasted Kobelt.

This injury could've been a lot worse (ACL or MCL). A meniscal tear is not great, but with proper rehab, a full recovery is almost guaranteed, especially with someone as young as Mitchell. With a meniscal repair (normally a 4-ish month recovery) the torn piece of cartilage is removed and the edges and area around the tear are smoothed out. He'll be in a brace for the next 4-6 weeks unable to bear weight. He'll be doing physical therapy throughout the recovery process to help strengthen all areas of the knee.

In the end, this type of injury should have no long-lasting ramifications. Mitchell should return to full strength and be ready for the ITA Team Indoors in February. If anyone wants to discount a guy like Frank already, you will end up regretting it come next year.

mikej 08-08-2012 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jakes On A Plane (Post 6791767)
He was pretty much unbeatable at #3. If Ohio State didn't suck on the big stage and had played UVA in the final, Frank would've outlasted Kobelt.

agreed, obviously i'm not claiming kobelt is the better player, just saying frank isn't above the possibility of losing the way johnson was the past few years

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jakes On A Plane (Post 6791767)
A meniscal tear is not great, but with proper rehab, a full recovery is almost guaranteed, especially with someone as young as Mitchell.

In the end, this type of injury should have no long-lasting ramifications. Mitchell should return to full strength and be ready for the ITA Team Indoors in February. If anyone wants to discount a guy like Frank already, you will end up regretting it come next year.

not sure operative treatment and recovery of this injury is as simple as you say - a lot depends on how big the tear is and whether it's just at the periphery of the cartilage that heals much more easily

either way, no not a devastating injury and not discounting him, he'll be back playing high level tennis in a handful of months, but you never know how much of an impact even a little bit of nagging pain can have on a guy with his style of game...we shall see

BHSC 08-08-2012 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikej (Post 6791128)
Other teams already had more than a fighting chance, don't think UVA was even my favorite for the ACC title - but I'm biased no doubt


For a team that hasn't lost to an ACC opponent in 6 or 7 years and returns 5 of their top 6 from last year's NCAA finalist.

To say they are not even the favorite in their own conference,

That's almost Fedace level bias

mikej 08-08-2012 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BHSC (Post 6791840)
For a team that hasn't lost to an ACC opponent in 6 or 7 years and returns 5 of their top 6 from last year's NCAA finalist.

To say they are not even the favorite in their own conference,

That's almost Fedace level bias

or i just realize that duke wasn't far behind UVA last year (cunha losing to jenkins was the difference b/t a 4-3 win and a 4-3 loss in the regular season meeting), returns 5 of 6 as well, and gains much more in redlicki and semenzato than they lose in an often-injured wietoska

get over yourself - that trophy case is still empty - you're not the powerhouse usc is, duke isn't afraid (not that they're afraid of usc either, beating them twice in the last three years)

SoCal10s 08-08-2012 01:38 PM

Frank was/is that steady leader that any program needs .. he is the same type of person like Stevie was at USC,he sets examples for other to follow by doing,fighting and achieving.. USC is my #1 school but I'm surely a Mitchell Frank fan,and has been since the first time I saw him in the juniors ..Frank is a nice polite un-assuming young man who just keep winning with what ever talent he has .. Stevie could and will be somewhat of a jerk on the tennis court that's where they differ,but they both find a way to win..

ClarkC 08-08-2012 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jakes On A Plane (Post 6791767)
He was pretty much unbeatable at #3. If Ohio State didn't suck on the big stage and had played UVA in the final, Frank would've outlasted Kobelt.

I saw a good bit of that match in February. Not only did Kobelt play well, but Mitchell had a freshman-nerves match, which tends to happen to most freshmen at some point in that first year of playing for a team and not just playing junior tourneys for yourself. I was happy to see him get it out of his system in February so that it would not happen in May (and it did not happen in May, as he delivered a pressure straight set win over a very determined Daniel Nguyen, as well as winning or leading matches before the final).

A freshman-nerves match tells me nothing about what Mitchell will do in his second year. Recovery from injury is the big story now. Last year, when Alex Domijan missed the entire fall season with a shoulder injury, he was medically healthy but not match fit at the National Team Indoors. He did not hit his stride until the end of March. It will be interesting to compare Mitchell's recovery of match fitness to that scenario from last season.

Jakes On A Plane 08-08-2012 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikej (Post 6791839)
not sure operative treatment and recovery of this injury is as simple as you say - a lot depends on how big the tear is and whether it's just at the periphery of the cartilage that heals much more easily

either way, no not a devastating injury and not discounting him, he'll be back playing high level tennis in a handful of months, but you never know how much of an impact even a little bit of nagging pain can have on a guy with his style of game...we shall see

I wasn't trying to make it sound easy (well...easier than an ACL). 6 weeks of no weight bearing is pretty rough, but yeah, making sure no pain or discomfort sticks around is key.

BHSC 08-09-2012 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikej (Post 6791851)
or i just realize that duke wasn't far behind UVA last year (cunha losing to jenkins was the difference b/t a 4-3 win and a 4-3 loss in the regular season meeting), returns 5 of 6 as well, and gains much more in redlicki and semenzato than they lose in an often-injured wietoska

get over yourself - that trophy case is still empty - you're not the powerhouse usc is, duke isn't afraid (not that they're afraid of usc either, beating them twice in the last three years)

I made no mention that Duke is far behind UVA. Nor did I make any national reference or implication.

Duke and UVA certainly had some competitive matches this year and they should be closer next year. Ramsey Smith is doing a great job. It's very possible Duke may beat UVA next year. Plenty of teams can beat each other in the top 10, just as you reference between USC/Duke. It's been a long time since any team went undefeated and USC has experienced a number of losses in the past 4 years.

If there's one thing teams like UVA and Ohio St. need (and that USC has had in the Pac 12) it's tough conference competition. Playing difficult, high level matches in March/April can only help in May.

My point was simply about the ACC for next year. If one team has a very long conference winning streak and returns nearly everyone, it's pretty reasonable to say that they remain the Conference favorite going in to the season. At least, until someone else proves they can win the conference and especially before one of their top guys gets injured.

A similar example would be nationally last year. Coming into the 2012 spring, USC returned nearly everyone from a team that had won multiple titles. Certainly other teams could potentially beat the Trojans. However, SC had to be considered the favorite until someone proved differently. Only a very biased observer would have argued otherwise.

mikej 08-09-2012 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BHSC (Post 6794190)
I made no mention that Duke is far behind UVA...Duke and UVA certainly had some competitive matches this year and they should be closer next year...It's very possible Duke may beat UVA next year.

i'm confused by a few things in your post - starting with this [i've edited some of your comments together a bit for brevity, let me know if you think i took anything out of context]:

if Duke isn't far behind UVA, is it really fedace-like bias for someone to suggest that Duke might be the conference favorite? seems to me if two teams are quite close and either could possibly beat the other then different people might have differing rational opinions on which is more likely to pull off a conference title...no?

Quote:

Originally Posted by BHSC (Post 6794190)
My point was simply about the ACC for next year. If one team has a very long conference winning streak and returns nearly everyone, it's pretty reasonable to say that they remain the Conference favorite going in to the season. At least, until someone else proves they can win the conference

A similar example would be nationally last year. Coming into the 2012 spring, USC returned nearly everyone from a team that had won multiple titles. Certainly other teams could potentially beat the Trojans. However, SC had to be considered the favorite until someone proved differently. Only a very biased observer would have argued otherwise.

i disagree with your premise that a team that has success in a conference or nationally and returns most players automatically is the favorite until proven otherwise...i've seen plenty of years of college basketball where a great team gets surpassed from one year to the next despite retaining most players (whether by recruiting - I have a lot of faith in redlicki and semenzato making both big singles and big dubs impacts next year - or by players getting better - aka tahir looking awesome this summer compared to being an okay bottom of the lineup player last year)

and i can't tell you how many posts i've seen on thesabre.com in recent years predicting a national championship (sure, plenty telling these people to hold their horses on those predictions also) - were all these UVA posters exposing their fedace-level irrationality by not predicting the returning three-time champs to defend their title?

**edit - as a more concrete example - Clark predicted a lopsided victory for UVA over two-time defending champs USC before that title match in 2011 - is he just one of many fedace-like UVA fans? - not my opinion but it follows from your argument - i didn't know your opinion of him was that low...**

whatever, i indicated in my initial post that i had a bias in this game of choosing the ACC favorite for next year, but your argument that UVA is the only rational choice seems to fly in the face of your initial comments i quoted above and thousands of UVA tennis message board posts during the past few years

sorry for not bowing down to the almighty UVA ACC win streak and upsetting you...boland didn't bow down to Duke's streak of championships when he started building UVA into a top tier program - that's not a winner's attitude

matchplay 08-09-2012 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikej (Post 6794430)
i'm confused by a few things in your post - starting with this [i've edited some of your comments together a bit for brevity, let me know if you think i took anything out of context]:

if Duke isn't far behind UVA, is it really fedace-like bias for someone to suggest that Duke might be the conference favorite? seems to me if two teams are quite close and either could possibly beat the other then different people might have differing rational opinions on which is more likely to pull off a conference title...no?



i disagree with your premise that a team that has success in a conference or nationally and returns most players automatically is the favorite until proven otherwise...i've seen plenty of years of college basketball where a great team gets surpassed from one year to the next despite retaining most players (whether by recruiting - I have a lot of faith in redlicki and semenzato making both big singles and big dubs impacts next year - or by players getting better - aka tahir looking awesome this summer compared to being an okay bottom of the lineup player last year)

and i can't tell you how many posts i've seen on thesabre.com in recent years predicting a national championship (sure, plenty telling these people to hold their horses on those predictions also) - were all these UVA posters exposing their fedace-level irrationality by not predicting the returning three-time champs to defend their title?

**edit - as a more concrete example - Clark predicted a lopsided victory for UVA over two-time defending champs USC before that title match in 2011 - is he just one of many fedace-like UVA fans? - not my opinion but it follows from your argument - i didn't know your opinion of him was that low...**

whatever, i indicated in my initial post that i had a bias in this game of choosing the ACC favorite for next year, but your argument that UVA is the only rational choice seems to fly in the face of your initial comments i quoted above and thousands of UVA tennis message board posts during the past few years

sorry for not bowing down to the almighty UVA ACC win streak and upsetting you...boland didn't bow down to Duke's streak of championships when he started building UVA into a top tier program - that's not a winner's attitude

MJ-
this is the type of post that is well thought out, thank you. perhaps still harsh, but most of us understand it is hard for you.
i would guess most poster would like to hear you sound a bit mote like this (mature), rather then spouting off like FedAce or slashing back at folks you disagree with.
You are learning, slowly learning.

BTW, how is school going?

mikej 08-09-2012 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by matchplay (Post 6794490)
MJ-
this is the type of post that is well thought out, thank you. perhaps still harsh, but most of us understand it is hard for you.
i would guess most poster would like to hear you sound a bit mote like this (mature), rather then spouting off like FedAce or slashing back at folks you disagree with.
You are learning, slowly learning.

BTW, how is school going?

lol, dude, thanks for all the backhanded compliments in this forum and the junior one recently

so glad to be receiving them from someone i have zero respect for (is it okay that i didn't thinly veil my dislike for you with some pseudo-nice-words???)

and school is fine buddy, applying for residency spots right now, so we'll see if any programs out there get tricked into hiring this "quack" - thanks for your concern

matchplay 08-09-2012 01:38 PM

Ramsey mentioned he would like you to tone it down when he talking to some new recruits while at the zoo.....lol
keep embarrassing Duke, a fine University BTW, which most people respect, unless they read your garbage.
You make FedAce seem tame these days......thanks for entertaining us while he has been gone

mikej 08-09-2012 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by matchplay (Post 6794605)
thanks for entertaining us while he [fedace] has been gone

news to me that he has been gone - but you're welcome - if i ever get kicked off here i'll be sure to come back with a nice google image prof pic of some fine young lady as well - maybe KimJe a cute young asian lady who fittingly is a fan of duke

10isplayer 08-09-2012 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikej (Post 6794430)
i'm confused by a few things in your post - starting with this [i've edited some of your comments together a bit for brevity, let me know if you think i took anything out of context]:

if Duke isn't far behind UVA, is it really fedace-like bias for someone to suggest that Duke might be the conference favorite? seems to me if two teams are quite close and either could possibly beat the other then different people might have differing rational opinions on which is more likely to pull off a conference title...no?



i disagree with your premise that a team that has success in a conference or nationally and returns most players automatically is the favorite until proven otherwise...i've seen plenty of years of college basketball where a great team gets surpassed from one year to the next despite retaining most players (whether by recruiting - I have a lot of faith in redlicki and semenzato making both big singles and big dubs impacts next year - or by players getting better - aka tahir looking awesome this summer compared to being an okay bottom of the lineup player last year)

and i can't tell you how many posts i've seen on thesabre.com in recent years predicting a national championship (sure, plenty telling these people to hold their horses on those predictions also) - were all these UVA posters exposing their fedace-level irrationality by not predicting the returning three-time champs to defend their title?

**edit - as a more concrete example - Clark predicted a lopsided victory for UVA over two-time defending champs USC before that title match in 2011 - is he just one of many fedace-like UVA fans? - not my opinion but it follows from your argument - i didn't know your opinion of him was that low...**

whatever, i indicated in my initial post that i had a bias in this game of choosing the ACC favorite for next year, but your argument that UVA is the only rational choice seems to fly in the face of your initial comments i quoted above and thousands of UVA tennis message board posts during the past few years

sorry for not bowing down to the almighty UVA ACC win streak and upsetting you...boland didn't bow down to Duke's streak of championships when he started building UVA into a top tier program - that's not a winner's attitude

Tahir was a pretty good 5/6 player last year going 20-4 in dual matches. Has had an impressive summer beating players who played ahead of him on good teams. Normally, UVa fans complain of the ACC being too weak but UVa and Duke look to be two of the top 3 teams in the country next year (UCLA is my third). They could possibly meet twice during ACC play and I wouldn't be surprised if they played at indoors as well. Also, looks like Duke has added another coach. http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.db...DB_OEM_ID=4200

ClarkC 08-10-2012 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikej (Post 6794430)
**edit - as a more concrete example - Clark predicted a lopsided victory for UVA over two-time defending champs USC before that title match in 2011 - is he just one of many fedace-like UVA fans? - not my opinion but it follows from your argument - i didn't know your opinion of him was that low...**

Just to set the record straight, I made two posts during the 2011 NCAA final 16 that you misunderstand and continue to harp on:

1. After UVa pulled out a 4-3 win over Stanford (Singh had to win a 3rd set over Clayton at #3 with the dual match at 3-3), Fedace posted a very depressed sounding message. I responded by saying that he should not feel bad, that when the tournament was over, it might be that we would look back and say that Stanford played UVa as well as anyone. I was a few points away from being absolutely right on that statement, but in any case, the intent of the post was to express sympathies to Fedace. Given all the smack he had talked about Stanford knocking UVa out of the tournament, I could have been gloating over the victory and taunting him. Instead, I was trying to be conciliatory. You took the point of the whole post as me predicting a national title. While I certainly thought UVa could and would win the title that year (and was wrong that they would), that was not the focus or intent of the post.

I think I can pretty well imagine what you would have posted if Fedace had been talking smack about Duke, and Duke had knocked Stanford out of the NCAAs on their home courts in Palo Alto. I doubt that your post would have been one of consolation to Fedace.

2. On The Sabre (UVa message boards), there were lots of pessimistic posters who had it all worked out that USC would win the final and UVa was a big underdog. I get tired of that kind of pessimism from UVa's own fans, so I posted a match listing and argued that each of our players was at least even with the USC opponent, and any or all of our guys could win. That is not quite the same as saying: "The match will definitely end up 4-0 for UVa with the three unfinished matches all comfortably under control for UVa." USC won decisively at #5, so I was wrong big time at that position, but the other five matches were close and UVa took three of them. The intent of the post was to encourage UVa fans who seemed overly pessimistic to me. Because you read The Sabre tennis board, you came over here and made a big deal about it. If I had posted the same things on a USC board or at Talk Tennis, that would be different.

So, two posts that were designed to encourage others were blown up into "Clark is another trash-talking Fedace who predicts his team will cream everyone." Get a clue, and get over it.

I try to compliment other teams when discussing tennis with their fans. (I make exceptions for UNC and Georgia, but I will not digress to explain that here.) I root for other ACC teams to win in order for the conference to gain in reputation, while you obviously root for UVa to lose.

Perhaps we should count up all the posts in which you have encouraged the fans of other teams, rooted for other teams in the ACC to win, etc. How long would that list be? Did you ever encourage Fedace after a Stanford loss?


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 06:24 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
© 2006 - Tennis Warehouse