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-   -   nat gut 16g vs 17g (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=442489)

jk175d 10-09-2012 06:33 AM

nat gut 16g vs 17g
 
I had long played 17g strings before I switched to natural gut in the mains. So naturally I've been using 17g for the gut too.

I've settled into using wilson on one frame and Klip on the other. I get anywhere from 15-30 hrs out of the Wilson before it snaps but the Klip is always only 15-17.

So my question is, how much more durable is 16g likely to be? And how much am I likely to notice the difference in the playing characteristics of the 16 vs the 17?

Please only reply if you're talking about nat gut.

McLovin 10-09-2012 07:41 AM

Have you though about 16L? I know Pacific makes a 16L gut, not sure about Klip.

I too use 17g gut mains, and on occasion have moved to 16L when playing on clay. It lasts a bit longer and I don't notice much difference in playability.

One thing you may notice between 17 & 16 is a difference in weight. I'm certain 16 weighs more than 17, but I don't have the numbers to tell you if it is enough to make a significant difference.

TimothyO 10-09-2012 08:00 AM

In the EXO3 16x19 you might find more control and lower power with a stiffer 16g gut main such as some Pacific products or BT7-based VS Touch.

As for durability, 16 might be marginally more durable but in a gut/poly hybrid the difference won't be so decisive that you should base your choice on durability over playability. I'd focus more on the feel than durability.

What gauge Outlast are you using? I've been curious about that as a cross for gut mains.

UCSF2012 10-09-2012 08:03 AM

Racket is noticeably heavier. Plays steadier, more powerful. A bit less spin.

jk175d 10-09-2012 08:25 AM

hmm.. one guy says less power another says more power :)

jk175d 10-09-2012 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimothyO (Post 6943976)
In the EXO3 16x19 you might find more control and lower power with a stiffer 16g gut main such as some Pacific products or BT7-based VS Touch.

As for durability, 16 might be marginally more durable but in a gut/poly hybrid the difference won't be so decisive that you should base your choice on durability over playability. I'd focus more on the feel than durability.

What gauge Outlast are you using? I've been curious about that as a cross for gut mains.

I'm not crazy about the BT VS which is why I switched to wilson. Which I'll always keep on one frame. But I like to have a subtle alternative as well as a cheaper alternative on the other frame. Pacific hasn't lasted any longer than Klip for me and it's more $ so I've ruled it out. That's why I was wondering if I might get more hours out of Klip 16 vs 17.

Outlast is the perfect cross for me because it's a smooth poly which is what you want to cross gut, and it is control oriented so it helps reign in the power of the gut. I also think it distinguishes itself from all other poly crosses I've used in that it feels the same at 20 hours as it does on day one. So for the life of the gut mains the stringbed feels the same.

parasailing 10-09-2012 11:29 PM

Just remember to stock up on the Wilson as who knows when they will switch to BT7. I can't imagine Babolat keeping two process for gut going just for Wilson and Prince.

I find 17 gauge VS to be more comfortable, a tad more spin and power than 16 gauge. As far as durability, you get about 10% more from using 16 gauge and probably 20% more using 15g but I wouldn't bother with that. Unless you break strings like crazy, I would stick with 17gauge.

If I had to use 15gauge VS, I might as well just use X1 17g instead.

Orion3 10-09-2012 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by parasailing (Post 6945328)
Just remember to stock up on the Wilson as who knows when they will switch to BT7. I can't imagine Babolat keeping two process for gut going just for Wilson and Prince.

I find 17 gauge VS to be more comfortable, a tad more spin and power than 16 gauge. As far as durability, you get about 10% more from using 16 gauge and probably 20% more using 15g but I wouldn't bother with that. Unless you break strings like crazy, I would stick with 17gauge.

If I had to use 15gauge VS, I might as well just use X1 17g instead.

When I was playing with open string pattern hybrids I gradually migrated from 17g to 15g mains. You do lose a little power, I can't honestly say I experienced a noticable change in control or spin, but durability was significantly better. Comfort was great too.

I've been playing 18x20's for a while now and because of the dense pattern, strings seem to last much longer - not dropped below 16g gun mains.

jk175d 10-10-2012 05:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by parasailing (Post 6945328)
Just remember to stock up on the Wilson as who knows when they will switch to BT7. I can't imagine Babolat keeping two process for gut going just for Wilson and Prince.

I find 17 gauge VS to be more comfortable, a tad more spin and power than 16 gauge. As far as durability, you get about 10% more from using 16 gauge and probably 20% more using 15g but I wouldn't bother with that. Unless you break strings like crazy, I would stick with 17gauge.

If I had to use 15gauge VS, I might as well just use X1 17g instead.

I won't be going to 15 that's for sure. So a couple of you are saying the durability increase between 17 and 16 isn't significant. I think unless I felt assured of getting at least about 10 more hours out of the 16 I wouldn't want to make the switch.

McLovin 10-10-2012 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jk175d (Post 6945531)
So a couple of you are saying the durability increase between 17 and 16 isn't significant. I think unless I felt assured of getting at least about 10 more hours out of the 16 I wouldn't want to make the switch.

Call me 'Master of the Obvious', but you need to give 16 (or 16L) a try for yourself. Longevity can depend on your frame, tension, string pattern, playing style, surface, conditions, and in some cases, your opponents.

jk175d 10-10-2012 07:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McLovin (Post 6945686)
Call me 'Master of the Obvious', but you need to give 16 (or 16L) a try for yourself. Longevity can depend on your frame, tension, string pattern, playing style, surface, conditions, and in some cases, your opponents.

yeah, that's true. I was just looking to see if there was a clear consenus that might rule it out or put the wind in my sails before putting the time and $$ into it.

Seeing how TW is out of 17g Klip again I may have no choice but to try it.

McLovin 10-10-2012 08:27 AM

Sadly, Klip Gut seems to be out all around. There's a place somewhere in the mid west that I tried to order from when I noticed TW was out.

It's arrival date has been pushed back 3 times now, and is not expected to be in until Oct 22nd. Maybe it's time to go back to Pacific...

Chotobaka 10-10-2012 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jk175d (Post 6944021)
I'm not crazy about the BT VS which is why I switched to wilson. Which I'll always keep on one frame. But I like to have a subtle alternative as well as a cheaper alternative on the other frame. Pacific hasn't lasted any longer than Klip for me and it's more $ so I've ruled it out. That's why I was wondering if I might get more hours out of Klip 16 vs 17.

Outlast is the perfect cross for me because it's a smooth poly which is what you want to cross gut, and it is control oriented so it helps reign in the power of the gut. I also think it distinguishes itself from all other poly crosses I've used in that it feels the same at 20 hours as it does on day one. So for the life of the gut mains the stringbed feels the same.

As a side note, don't forget to check prices on Volkl/Boris Becker natural gut. It is OEM'd by Klip (it is first quality) and goes on sale more frequently than both Klip and Pacific branded products. From time to time really good deals pop up.

parasailing 10-10-2012 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orion3 (Post 6945347)
When I was playing with open string pattern hybrids I gradually migrated from 17g to 15g mains. You do lose a little power, I can't honestly say I experienced a noticable change in control or spin, but durability was significantly better. Comfort was great too.

I've been playing 18x20's for a while now and because of the dense pattern, strings seem to last much longer - not dropped below 16g gun mains.

For me, 15g was a significant drop compared to 16 and 17g and durability was only about 20% better. Given I don't break strings that often, it was an easy choice to stick with 17g.

julian 10-11-2012 02:15 PM

How many hours?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by parasailing (Post 6946154)
For me, 15g was a significant drop compared to 16 and 17g and durability was only about 20% better. Given I don't break strings that often, it was an easy choice to stick with 17g.

How many hours of play could you get from one set of Wilson Natural Gut 17 gauge?
(17 is the important part of the question)

parasailing 10-11-2012 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by julian (Post 6948804)
How many hours of play could you get from one set of Wilson Natural Gut 17 gauge?
(17 is the important part of the question)

I usually get about 12 hours to 15 hours with a smooth copoly before the strings breakl. With 16 gauge, I probably get about 15 to 18 hours but for me, it's doesn't feel as nice as 17g and I since I don't play that much, a set usually lasts me about a month so it's not that big of a difference.

If you are like my friend who breaks it every 3 to 5 hours and plays more often, that could hurt your wallet :).

julian 10-11-2012 02:51 PM

I use full bed gut
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by parasailing (Post 6948825)
I usually get about 12 hours to 15 hours with a smooth copoly before the strings breakl. With 16 gauge, I probably get about 15 to 18 hours but for me, it's doesn't feel as nice as 17g and I since I don't play that much, a set usually lasts me about a month so it's not that big of a difference.

If you are like my friend who breaks it every 3 to 5 hours and plays more often, that could hurt your wallet :).

I use full bed gut

jk175d 10-11-2012 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by parasailing (Post 6948825)
I usually get about 12 hours to 15 hours with a smooth copoly before the strings breakl. With 16 gauge, I probably get about 15 to 18 hours but for me, it's doesn't feel as nice as 17g and I since I don't play that much, a set usually lasts me about a month so it's not that big of a difference.

If you are like my friend who breaks it every 3 to 5 hours and plays more often, that could hurt your wallet :).

That's the most useful reply yet. So really the durability for the same player on the same racquet going from 17g to 16g is fairly minimal.

However, I've noticed that if I don't play with a racquet much that the actual playing time of those gut mains gets diminished greatly because they dry out and get more fragile.

parasailing 10-11-2012 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by julian (Post 6948877)
I use full bed gut

Full gut lasts a lot shorter mainly due friction between the strings. A smooth co-poly reduces this friction between the strings. A full bed of gut usually lasts about 10 hours.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jk175d (Post 6949474)
That's the most useful reply yet. So really the durability for the same player on the same racquet going from 17g to 16g is fairly minimal.

However, I've noticed that if I don't play with a racquet much that the actual playing time of those gut mains gets diminished greatly because they dry out and get more fragile.

Not sure about others but for me, 17g is only about 10 to 15% less durable than 16g and given I don't break strings, it's an easy decision for me.


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