Talk Tennis

Talk Tennis (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php)
-   Adult League & Tournament Talk (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/forumdisplay.php?f=35)
-   -   Winning is an addiction, Dr. Nadal diagnosis confirms (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=447609)

Gonzalito17 12-08-2012 05:14 AM

Winning is an addiction, Dr. Nadal diagnosis confirms
 
Winning in tennis, on any level, be it ATP pro, or 2.0, or public park playing is an addiction, even the distinguished Doctor Rafael Nadal specialist in courtology has officially confirmed the diagnosis...

"I don't think there is anything in any area of life that gives you the same rush as winning in sport, whatever the sport and whatever the level. There is no feeling as intense or as joyous. And the more you crave winning, the greater the rush when you succeed," stated Dr. Nadal during a break from his practice in Mallorca.

ABtennis 12-08-2012 10:56 AM

and you posted this is in the League section why?

Larrysümmers 12-08-2012 12:30 PM

could give an insite on why people sandbag.

sureshs 12-08-2012 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gonzalito17 (Post 7052686)
Winning in tennis, on any level, be it ATP pro, or 2.0, or public park playing is an addiction, even the distinguished Doctor Rafael Nadal specialist in proctology has officially confirmed the diagnosis...

"I don't think there is anything in any area of life that gives you the same rush as winning in sport, whatever the sport and whatever the level. There is no feeling as intense or as joyous. And the more you crave winning, the greater the rush when you succeed," stated Dr. Nadal during a break from his practice in Mallorca.

Corrected ......

Gonzalito17 12-08-2012 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ABtennis (Post 7053088)
and you posted this is in the League section why?

There was a thread here earlier titled "Addicted to winning"

TomT 12-18-2012 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gonzalito17 (Post 7052686)
Winning in tennis, on any level, be it ATP pro, or 2.0, or public park playing is an addiction, even the distinguished Doctor Rafael Nadal specialist in courtology has officially confirmed the diagnosis...

"I don't think there is anything in any area of life that gives you the same rush as winning in sport, whatever the sport and whatever the level. There is no feeling as intense or as joyous. And the more you crave winning, the greater the rush when you succeed," stated Dr. Nadal during a break from his practice in Mallorca.

It seems to me to be somewhat erroneous to think that winning is an addiction. Winning, or losing, is, in the general scheme of things, an inconsequential result of many variables (And insofar as many of those variables can't be controlled, then winning and losing are both accidents. This is what Kipling was referring to in calling both winning and losing imposters, to be treated intellectually, and, most importantly, emotionally the same, by a MAN.).

Any addiction associated with winning or losing is manifested in the form of trying one's best, or not.

We know when we've tried our best. And we know when we haven't. THAT is what is acceptable or difficult to live with. NOT winning or losing.

Kalin 12-18-2012 09:33 PM

TomT,

I respectfully disagree that the majority of people accept losing as easily as winning as long as they have tried their best (please correct me if I have misunderstood your point). I for sure don't and the majority of people I have played sports with are exactly the same. I have never been a pro but have played college level volleyball as well as semi-pro level soccer for many years so I have a pretty large database for reference... Same goes for pretty much every tennis match or tournament I have played in (again, non-pro level)

The vast majority of people who play organized sports would take winning with a sub-par effort over losing after they have given it all. Guaranteed.

If you want to argue that philosophically it shouldn't matter then you may have a point. But sportspeople are seldom philosophical about the outcome of the games... polite and scripted interviews by the stars notwithstanding.

goran_ace 12-18-2012 09:42 PM

In the early rounds of a tournament I'd be satisfied only putting in 75% effort as long as I advance. Sometimes the other guy will just hand you the match, other times you can just let the match sort itself out. If the guy puts up a fight and it takes a tough three sets to get the win, that doesn't make that win any more or less significant. I just want to keep competing. Now if I play against the top seed in the first round and play the match of my life and still lose, it feels good to elevate your game but I wouldn't exactly be ecstatic because I'm out of the tournament.

I don't interpret those lines from Kipling's 'If' to mean that win or lose the result is inconsequential, I take it to mean that no matter the result you should show good sportsmanship, be humble when victorious, take pride in a your effort in a loss.

dizzlmcwizzl 12-19-2012 05:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kalin (Post 7070131)
TomT,

I respectfully disagree that the majority of people accept losing as easily as winning as long as they have tried their best (please correct me if I have misunderstood your point). I for sure don't and the majority of people I have played sports with are exactly the same. I have never been a pro but have played college level volleyball as well as semi-pro level soccer for many years so I have a pretty large database for reference... Same goes for pretty much every tennis match or tournament I have played in (again, non-pro level)

The vast majority of people who play organized sports would take winning with a sub-par effort over losing after they have given it all. Guaranteed.

If you want to argue that philosophically it shouldn't matter then you may have a point. But sportspeople are seldom philosophical about the outcome of the games... polite and scripted interviews by the stars notwithstanding.

To a degree you are certainly correct. In the heat of the moment I always want to win. And immediately after the match, when I have ground out a victory on a day when my strokes were awful I have a sense of pride for having persevered.

However, if given a choice several days after or before a match between playing hard, hitting well and losing versus hitting poorly yet still earning a win... with perspective I would always chose to play my best and get beaten than to play poorly and manage to eek out a victory.

goran_ace 12-19-2012 05:39 AM

In the context of an isolated match I understand what you mean, but in tournament play I'd rather win ugly than lose pretty because you get to play another match. In league play I'd still rather win ugly than lose pretty because that is still a point for your team.

TomT 12-19-2012 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rafael Nadal
I don't think there is anything in any area of life that gives you the same rush as winning in sport, whatever the sport and whatever the level. There is no feeling as intense or as joyous. And the more you crave winning, the greater the rush when you succeed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kalin (Post 7070131)
TomT,
I respectfully disagree that the majority of people accept losing as easily as winning as long as they have tried their best (please correct me if I have misunderstood your point).

The vast majority of people who play organized sports would take winning with a sub-par effort over losing after they have given it all. Guaranteed.

If you want to argue that philosophically it shouldn't matter then you may have a point. But sportspeople are seldom philosophical about the outcome of the games... polite and scripted interviews by the stars notwithstanding.

Kalin, I agree with your points. Most of us, including myself, are probably much more fond of the feeling that winning imparts than the feeling that losing does. No matter how we played. So, I guess we can get addicted, in a sense, to that feeling no matter how it's gotten.

I'm not sure I agree with Nadal's quote. Unless everything in life can be reduced to some sort of sports competition metaphor.

AtomicForehand 12-19-2012 11:05 AM

I honestly don't mind losing as long as I know I've played my best. There are lots of people out there who are better than I am. Always will be.

However, I *don't* like to lose because I wasn't able to play well.

(I find that the only times I don't play well are when I am tired. If I can keep my alertness/focus/energy high throughout the match, I nearly always win.)

OrangePower 12-19-2012 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kalin (Post 7070131)
The vast majority of people who play organized sports would take winning with a sub-par effort over losing after they have given it all. Guaranteed.

I would agree with this observation.
Unfortunately, I also think a significant number of players would take beating a sub-par opponent over losing to a superior opponent, which is sad, and is what leads to sandbagging etc.

Mongolmike 12-19-2012 11:41 AM

I think most would agree that any addiction is probably not a good thing. And I see this in people who are unknowingly addicted to losing. They are the people (not just in tennis) that the closer the game/match the tighter they get or the more mistake prone they become.

I play a lot of team sports too, including wallyball here in the colder months... and there are guys that you just know are gonna blow points as that particular game nears a result. We all make mistakes, sure, but some people seemed wired to fail.

storypeddler 12-19-2012 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TomT (Post 7069915)
It seems to me to be somewhat erroneous to think that winning is an addiction. Winning, or losing, is, in the general scheme of things, an inconsequential result of many variables (And insofar as many of those variables can't be controlled, then winning and losing are both accidents. This is what Kipling was referring to in calling both winning and losing imposters, to be treated intellectually, and, most importantly, emotionally the same, by a MAN.).

Any addiction associated with winning or losing is manifested in the form of trying one's best, or not.

We know when we've tried our best. And we know when we haven't. THAT is what is acceptable or difficult to live with. NOT winning or losing.

SIGH. I doubt if Kipling ever played tennis. I agree that if you give all you've got, leave it all on the court, then the result is pretty much academic. Wasn't anything more you could have done to impact it anyway. However, to say winning and losing feel the same is to lack understanding of the competitive spirit of a MAN. A MAN exults in winning and deals with some degree of disappointment in losing. The only ones who don't are those who those who have committed nothing to the battle. IMO those MEN have bigger issues to deal with than winning and losing.

storypeddler 12-19-2012 05:46 PM

I don't know if I would call it an addiction---but I know it feels pretty darn good to win and it is a feeling you can grow very eager to experience again. If that's addiction, so be it.

TomT 12-19-2012 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by storypeddler (Post 7071400)
SIGH. I doubt if Kipling ever played tennis. I agree that if you give all you've got, leave it all on the court, then the result is pretty much academic. Wasn't anything more you could have done to impact it anyway. However, to say winning and losing feel the same is to lack understanding of the competitive spirit of a MAN. A MAN exults in winning and deals with some degree of disappointment in losing. The only ones who don't are those who those who have committed nothing to the battle. IMO those MEN have bigger issues to deal with than winning and losing.

I sort of retracted my premise in the post that you're replying to in my reply to Kalin.

Winning and losing feel different to, I would suppose, all of us. Winning feels good, losing feels bad. It's how we handle those feelings, how we treat them, that matters. That's what Kipling was talking about. To not whine about losing or boast about winning, either to oneself or to others.

It's an interesting topic. I currently don't think that the term addiction is applicable to the fact of winning or losing. However, I think that one can get sort of addicted to practicing in the right way and getting the most out of what one has to work with, and that that generally leads to winning more matches.

It also seems true that one can get sort of addicted to just taking it easy and not expending the energy, not doing what's necessary, to improve. Confidence is the key to doing well on crucial points, and confidence comes from productive practice. Repetition of correct movement, technique, and thinking.

t135 12-19-2012 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sureshs (Post 7053200)
Corrected ......

It had to be said.

heninfan99 12-20-2012 03:33 AM

I believe Jimmy Connors and football coach Marv Levy both said, to paraphrase, that

the pain of losing is greater than the joy of winning.

AtomicForehand 12-20-2012 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heninfan99 (Post 7071830)
I believe Jimmy Connors and football coach Marv Levy both said, to paraphrase, that

the pain of losing is greater than the joy of winning.

I don't agree. This must be a man thing.

To me it truly is all about how well I've played. If I've played my heart out and still don't win, what else could I have done? Nothing. Some people are just at a higher level of tennis than I am. There's always somebody who can beat you.

For me it's about maximizing my own performance, getting in the zone, trying to stay there, to keep improving, to learn something new each time I step on the court, to hone the skills I already mostly have down, maybe use them in new ways to stretch them a little. Each opponent and each day brings something new.

I suppose you could say that I am playing against MYSELF in tennis. The opponent is simply the thing I am reacting to. All the performance comes from within me. So this is why I can't agree with the quote above.

Tennis is a freaking AWESOME sport that perfectly captures the blend of the physical and the mental in its challenges, and I can't imagine ever not playing. I will have to be crippled by extreme old age or great misfortune before they can drag me off the court. Even then I might have to check out wheelchair tennis if applicable. ;)


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 05:47 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
© 2006 - Tennis Warehouse