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MasturB 12-28-2012 09:29 AM

Silent Ban Discussion
 
Is it real? Lots of conspiracy and speculation about this issue. Soderling, Nadal, etc.

It'd hit tennis harder than other sports because of the fact that tennis is an individual sport. A star player on a team gets suspended, the team still plays. A star tennis player gets suspended, it's like the entire brand/team gets suspended. Nadal is arguably the 2nd or 3rd most recognizable modern day tennis figure in the world male or female and if he did get a silent ban and it went public, the ramifications and negative effect for tennis would be huge. It wouldn't kill interest in the sport like it has for cycling, because Fed would still be considered pure, but man, Nadal getting caught would be major considering he holds every major clay record there is, and is in the upper tier of men's tennis records as well.

joeri888 12-28-2012 09:37 AM

Don't think it's real, but I don't blame people for starting to believe it.

decades 12-28-2012 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MasturB (Post 7083055)
Is it real? Lots of conspiracy and speculation about this issue. Soderling, Nadal, etc.

It'd hit tennis harder than other sports because of the fact that tennis is an individual sport. A star player on a team gets suspended, the team still plays. A star tennis player gets suspended, it's like the entire brand/team gets suspended. Nadal is arguably the 2nd or 3rd most recognizable modern day tennis figure in the world male or female and if he did get a silent ban and it went public, the ramifications and negative effect for tennis would be huge. It wouldn't kill interest in the sport like it has for cycling, because Fed would still be considered pure, but man, Nadal getting caught would be major considering he holds every major clay record there is, and is in the upper tier of men's tennis records as well.

doesn't make sense. public punishment is used as a deterrent. how would this send a message to other players if the ban was silent? tennis is a "confidence game" at the highest levels. there is so little difference, it's all about confidence. and when you lose it, you really lose it.

Flash O'Groove 12-28-2012 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by decades (Post 7083074)
doesn't make sense. public punishment is used as a deterrent. how would this send a message to other players if the ban was silent? tennis is a "confidence game" at the highest levels. there is so little difference, it's all about confidence. and when you lose it, you really lose it.

Better not to send a message than to acknowledge that the second biggest star is a doper, no? MasturB is right, it would be terrible for the tennis business, and I bet what is good or bad for the tennis business comes before any other consideration.

jjaded 12-28-2012 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by decades (Post 7083074)
doesn't make sense. public punishment is used as a deterrent. how would this send a message to other players if the ban was silent?

The "silent ban" is very real, that is the policy when an adverse urine or blood test comes back. The only question is whether certain high profile players who took lots of time off for injuries were actually barred playing during the investigation.

MichaelChang 12-28-2012 09:48 AM

They can cover for Agassi's drug usage, then they can cover again for anybody at that calibre. The whole drama of Nadal is getting more and more suspicious. But without solid proof, all is just speculations, not facts.

Flash O'Groove 12-28-2012 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelChang (Post 7083097)
They can cover for Agassi's drug usage, then they can cover again for anybody at that calibre. The whole drama of Nadal is getting more and more suspicious. But without solid proof, all is just speculations, not facts.

Yep. And we do hope those speculations are wrong, because I would be more than disappointed if they happened to be true...The same is true for Soderling, altough in his case, a public ban wouldn't be as a terrible blow to tennis than in Nadal's case.

jonnythan 12-28-2012 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by decades (Post 7083074)
doesn't make sense. public punishment is used as a deterrent. how would this send a message to other players if the ban was silent? tennis is a "confidence game" at the highest levels. there is so little difference, it's all about confidence. and when you lose it, you really lose it.

Revealing that top tennis players juice would be very, very, very bad for the sport as a whole. The ATP has a lot of incentive to cover up positive tests but punish players at the same time. Telling a top-4 player, who is very likely to make a semifinal and win a half million dollars, that he's barred from a tournament is pretty serious punishment. It's not as bad for the player as a public punishment, but a public punishment would hurt the ATP a great deal.

But is it done? No idea. None of us know, and this is all just speculation.

TMF 12-28-2012 09:58 AM

Every week that goes by, people are more and more in belief of the silent ban.

MasturB 12-28-2012 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by decades (Post 7083074)
doesn't make sense. public punishment is used as a deterrent. how would this send a message to other players if the ban was silent? tennis is a "confidence game" at the highest levels. there is so little difference, it's all about confidence. and when you lose it, you really lose it.

Makes plenty of sense. While tennis is a tour comprised of hundreds of independent contractors, they're all connected and intertwined.

You can make a public announcement that someone like Wayne Odesnik is doping, because he's not going to be selling many tickets and it shows the public that hey it's a journeyman guy trying to make it to the top which puts over how hard it is to be a top player. It also shows that the tour is trying to "enforce" something whatever that may be.

However if Nadal gets publicly suspended, it would send shockwaves out. Casual sports fans would automatically cast other top players as dopers. Oh how does Ferrer run so much at his age? How does Haas continue to play at a high level so old and injured? How can these guys serve 140mph for 5 sets? Questions started appearing even with baseless accusations. Not the type of negative pub tennis needs.

Again, thankfully if it did happen, the sport would still have Federer to lean on as a "pure" and "clean" player. But the sport's #2 honcho getting caught would be very bad for business (while upgrading Federer's brand even higher).

AtomicForehand 12-28-2012 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TMF (Post 7083119)
Every week that goes by, people are more and more in belief of the silent ban.

No they aren't.

qindarka 12-28-2012 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MasturB (Post 7083120)
Makes plenty of sense. While tennis is a tour comprised of hundreds of independent contractors, they're all connected and intertwined.

You can make a public announcement that someone like Wayne Odesnik is doping, because he's not going to be selling many tickets and it shows the public that hey it's a journeyman guy trying to make it to the top which puts over how hard it is to be a top player. It also shows that the tour is trying to "enforce" something whatever that may be.

However if Nadal gets publicly suspended, it would send shockwaves out. Casual sports fans would automatically cast other top players as dopers. Oh how does Ferrer run so much at his age? How does Haas continue to play at a high level so old and injured? How can these guys serve 140mph for 5 sets? Questions started appearing even with baseless accusations. Not the type of negative pub tennis needs.

Again, thankfully if it did happen, the sport would still have Federer to lean on as a "pure" and "clean" player. But the sport's #2 honcho getting caught would be very bad for business (while upgrading Federer's brand even higher).

If Nadal is indeed doping, I wouldn't be too sure that Federer is definitely clean as well.

jonnythan 12-28-2012 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by qindarka (Post 7083125)
If Nadal is indeed doping, I wouldn't be too sure that Federer is definitely clean as well.

The presumption is that Nadal is currently under a silent ban and Federer isn't.

wy2sl0 12-28-2012 10:03 AM

Let's be serious. As said before, Agassi got away with it (from the public before his book) why can't Nadal?

It may not even be that he got caught, rather he actually injured his knee and used PED's to heal it, and still can't pass the tests.

jjaded 12-28-2012 10:04 AM

The most suspicious part of Nadal's time off is that he had just been tested when he was defeated by Lukas Rosol, a match he thought he would win and if Nadal had won he, would not have been tested after.

Also, Nadal now claims that he was getting injections in his knee before the match. I presume cortisone (a steriod), which would explain a positive test for steroid use. If he was on a silent ban I think it absurd that his cover story for why he couldn't play is the same cover story for a false positive test.

Lets not also forget Nadal's connection to the infamous doping doctor who supplied many Spanish cyclists. I certainly think there is good reason to suspect Nadal was on a silent ban, but we may never know (or maybe in a decade he'll write a memoir about it.).

MasturB 12-28-2012 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by qindarka (Post 7083125)
If Nadal is indeed doping, I wouldn't be too sure that Federer is definitely clean as well.

Which brings back my point about the ATP not wanting to publicly suspend a top player like Nadal, because it would automatically cast a shadow of doubt amongst other top players as well regardless if there was no evidence or not.

It would definitely hurt the sport. Thats why they dont' hesitate to ban someone like Odesnik because he's just pennies on the dollar.

joeri888 12-28-2012 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by qindarka (Post 7083125)
If Nadal is indeed doping, I wouldn't be too sure that Federer is definitely clean as well.

Agreed. Federer always stated how he found out what was needed to be a top player in 2000 when he started working with his italian fitness coach. It is said that he found out he needed to work on fitness more etc. etc., but who knows. Maybe he isn't Godly either and takes stuff you shouldnt be using. However, I still don't think it's likely, and even if it is so, the strokes they produce are not caused by doping. That's talent and technique.

Flash O'Groove 12-28-2012 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by qindarka (Post 7083125)
If Nadal is indeed doping, I wouldn't be too sure that Federer is definitely clean as well.

Me too. If Nadal can evade anti-doping test for so many years, then Fed can too.

wy2sl0 12-28-2012 10:10 AM

Anyone can, I agree. The fact is that Nadal was massive at 18 years old and Fed developed like a normal person. Also, steroid use is linked with tendon issues, so just do the math.

qindarka 12-28-2012 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wy2sl0 (Post 7083142)
Anyone can, I agree. The fact is that Nadal was massive at 18 years old and Fed developed like a normal person. Also, steroid use is linked with tendon issues, so just do the math.

Can't be too sure when it comes to pro sports. The fear is that all the top players are doping, which I don't think is terribly far-fetched.


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