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-   -   Half volley: is it a stroke or.. (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=449998)

5263 01-05-2013 03:57 PM

Half volley: is it a stroke or..
 
Isn't the "half volley", a stroke technique? Or is it situation based?
Thats how I learned it and this technique was normally used for balls when the
player needed to make the shot quickly after the bounce and sometimes on the
rise further from the deck.

This writer below seems to think the half volley is situation and that the name
is not very descriptive of the shot.
Subtle issue, but curious what some of you thought.

http://www.humankinetics.com/excerpt...he-half-volley

I disagree with most of this article, and especially since I think the name is very
properly descriptive of this "stoke".
Imo the Half volley is mostly a volley that has been lengthened just a bit to
provide some power and control, much like you would do on a volley when the
ball comes slowly to be volleyed and you want to add power to the volley
since the ball was coming so slow.

psv255 01-05-2013 04:31 PM

I've always considered (and consistently heard of) a half-volley to be a pickup directly off the bounce, with a shortened swing than one would normally employ on a groundstroke.

I have never heard of it used with respect to a specific volley technique/stroke.
Plus, wouldn't what you describe as a "lengthened" volley be too similar to a regular volley, save the firmness of the shot?

EDIT: Some first videos that come up when searching for "half volley"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...zQCZmzI#t=116s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZ3nrVfNTOU

Say Chi Sin Lo 01-05-2013 04:34 PM

I look at it as an improvisation of the intended stroke.

bhupaes 01-05-2013 04:44 PM

Half volleys in the baseline to no man's land area would require a full stroke, albeit with a shortened back swing. At least, that's how I hit it. A half volley near the net would be more like a touch shot, involving gentler pickup and placement, right? Not my forte...

5263 01-05-2013 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by psv255 (Post 7100255)
Plus, wouldn't what you describe as a "lengthened" volley be too similar to a regular volley, save the firmness of the shot?

Yes, but isn't that exactly my point and almost exactly what I said?
Isn't it correct?
thanks

5263 01-05-2013 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by psv255 (Post 7100255)
I've always considered (and consistently heard of) a half-volley to be a pickup directly off the bounce, with a shortened swing than one would normally employ on a groundstroke.

Right; and it seems many folks do, but

see how you are combining 2 things.
1. situation
2. technique

I'm thinking it is really just the technique, because you can use any type stroke
to hit it right off the bounce, like a full swing; but that does not make that full
swing a half volley does it, if the half volley was not used as the technique to
play the ball.
The situation is a short hop and short hop is not a technique.
Seems many are automaticly linking the short hop situation with the technique of
half volley. Mostly they are, but not always.
subtle

tennis_balla 01-05-2013 05:02 PM

Half volley http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GI0Gpt-6SAw

5263 01-05-2013 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tennis_balla (Post 7100300)

Not sure which side of this you are contributing to, but I see the vid as
support for what I've been saying. Several of those Delpo baseline strokes were
short hopped right off the deck with relatively full ground strokes, but imo,
should not be called half volleys.
Thanks for the excellent link.

Fed made a nice half volley stroke though!

psv255 01-05-2013 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5263 (Post 7100297)
Right; and it seems many folks do, but

see how you are combining 2 things.
1. situation
2. technique

I'm thinking it is really just the technique, because you can use any type stroke
to hit it right off the bounce, like a full swing; but that does not make that full
swing a half volley does it, if the half volley was not used as the technique to
play the ball.
The situation is a short hop and short hop is not a technique.
Seems many are automaticly linking the short hop situation with the technique of
half volley. Mostly they are, but not always.
subtle

Valid point, but wouldn't an overhead also be combining situation and technique (i.e. only when the ball is a certain height or in a certain position)?

Nonetheless, the definition you bring forth just seems so starkly different from anything I've heard; at first it seemed like you were simply stating the def'n of a putaway volley! I guess semantics are irrelevant as long as we all understand each other...

5263 01-05-2013 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by psv255 (Post 7100389)
Valid point, but wouldn't an overhead also be combining situation and technique (i.e. only when the ball is a certain height or in a certain position)?

Nonetheless, the definition you bring forth just seems so starkly different from anything I've heard; at first it seemed like you were simply stating the def'n of a putaway volley! I guess semantics are irrelevant as long as we all understand each other...

I guess there isn't a right or wrong here, but thought it interesting and wondered
what others thought.
thanks

As to the overhead, I think it also is more of a technique and I often use it on
certain type of shoulder high balls and even go to a knee in some odd cases,
where I've gotten a weird bounce.
I do think it can be of some importance to separate a situation from a stroke,
to keep things straight for discussion and even in shot selection.

Avles 01-05-2013 07:46 PM

Well here's what Merriam Webster has to say: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/half-volley

Your definition of "half volley" is reasonable, but if most people who hear the term immediately think "short hop" it's going to require some additional explanation when used your way. So it might be better to stick to common usage.

Maybe worth noting that the two terms are used the same way in soccer-- volley means kicking the ball before ground contact, half-volley means kicking it on the short hop. In both cases they fundamentally refer to situations, not techniques (though the situations may call for particular techniques).

I guess soccer got its terminology from tennis?

tennis_balla 01-06-2013 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5263 (Post 7100381)
Not sure which side of this you are contributing to, but I see the vid as
support for what I've been saying. Several of those Delpo baseline strokes were
short hopped right off the deck with relatively full ground strokes, but imo,
should not be called half volleys.
Thanks for the excellent link.

Fed made a nice half volley stroke though!

Fed's last shot was a half volley, that's what everyone calls it. Even commentators.

Mick3391 01-06-2013 03:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5263 (Post 7100210)
Isn't the "half volley", a stroke technique?
Thats how I learned it and this technique was normally used for balls when the
player needed to make the shot quickly after the bounce and sometimes on the
rise further from the deck.

This writer below seems to think the half volley is situation and that the name
is not very descriptive of the shot.
Subtle issue, but curious what some of you thought.

http://www.humankinetics.com/excerpt...he-half-volley

I disagree with most of this article, and especially since I think the name is very
properly descriptive of this "stoke".
Imo the Half volley is mostly a volley that has been lengthened just a bit to
provide some power and control, much like you would do on a volley when the
ball comes slowly to be volleyed and you want to add power to the volley
since the ball was coming so slow.

Lets take your vocabulary and mincing words against my natural talent and HARD WORK AND FUN and see who comes out on top, are you joking? "Well a half drop blah side spin", are you joking?

If you have to think about it that hard you can't play, and if you think you can come play me, even in horrible shape I've DESTROYED 5.5 players, would have Justin Bower, just PLAY ALL, DON'T LISTEN TO THIS NONSENSE.

USS Tang 01-06-2013 04:39 AM

For me, the half-volley is a very easy shot to make. It should come naturally to those who fielded short-hops in the infield in Little League, Pony League, etc. at a young age. The keys to a successful half-volley are:
(1) Get the racket back as early as possible;
(2) Keep the racket parallel to the court surface during the entire swing;
(3) Hit the ball flat;
(4) If the ball is coming fast, you may want to start your swing even before it has crossed the net;
(5) Do not block the ball; continue with a full follow-through but one that remains parallel to the plane of the court surface;
(6) Drive the ball deep; do not dink it; and
(7) Remember timing is everything; the mechanics of the stroke are simple.

Relinquis 01-06-2013 05:15 AM

why are you guys are trying to reinvent, or rename, the half-volley? surely tennis better served by teaching why it's important and how to do it.

5263 01-06-2013 06:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tennis_balla (Post 7100981)
Fed's last shot was a half volley, that's what everyone calls it. Even commentators.

I don't know what our disconnect is here. Didn't I clearly agree that Fed's shot
off that short hop was clearly half volley technique?
I don't think anyone disagrees with that.

The question I posed is more about Delpo's full strokes off the short hops at the BL.
Those are not half volley technique and I wouldn't call them that; would you?
But they do fit the definition we find when we google it with many sources.

I'm also just raising the question, "Is it worth while to recognize and separate the
difference between the half volley technique and the short hop situation"?

Cindysphinx 01-06-2013 06:53 AM

Just had a lesson on this. Spent some time on half-volleys from the mid-court -- which is a situation in which a lot of half-volleys have to be hit.

Since I am already inside the court, I should be in my volley grip. When the ball would need to be half-volleyed, the pro had me make only one adjustment. I used my wrist to close the racket face (maintaining my Continental volley grip). Then, with no backswing, I could kind of guide the ball with a follow-through.

I have to say, this really worked nicely. No need to change my grip. No balls that popped way up because of the Continental grip. It was easy to change the wrist a touch. I had excellent directional control.

Now I just have to practice it and own it.

5263 01-06-2013 07:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mick3391 (Post 7101073)
Lets take your vocabulary and mincing words against my natural talent and HARD WORK AND FUN and see who comes out on top, are you joking? "Well a half drop blah side spin", are you joking?

If you have to think about it that hard you can't play, and if you think you can come play me, even in horrible shape I've DESTROYED 5.5 players, would have Justin Bower, just PLAY ALL, DON'T LISTEN TO THIS NONSENSE.

This is the kind of stuff you often confuse, lol. Why do you relate this to your
supposed tennis talent? Maybe you can "Destroy" at 5.5 while you're out of shape,
but in what sport? :)

We are talking about a coaching and communication point here; not a talent or
who would win point. Using the correct word or words can be key working with
students. So,
I'm also just raising the question, "Is it worth while to recognize and separate the
difference between the half volley technique and the short hop situation"?

Have a link to vid of your amazing 5.5+ talent?
I did love to ck it out, thanks.

5263 01-06-2013 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Relinquis (Post 7101140)
why are you guys are trying to reinvent, or rename, the half-volley?
surely tennis better served by teaching why it's important and how to do it.

Simply, No.

I'm just raising the question, "Is it worth while to recognize and separate the difference
between the half volley technique and the short hop situation in tennis terminology"?

5263 01-06-2013 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avles (Post 7100548)
Well here's what Merriam Webster has to say: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/half-volley

Your definition of "half volley" is reasonable, but if most people who hear the term immediately think "short hop" it's going to require some additional explanation when used your way. So it might be better to stick to common usage.

Maybe worth noting that the two terms are used the same way in soccer-- volley means kicking the ball before ground contact, half-volley means kicking it on the short hop. In both cases they fundamentally refer to situations, not techniques (though the situations may call for particular techniques).

I guess soccer got its terminology from tennis?

Excellent on topic post, but guess you and I had the advantage of our earlier
discussion :)

I don't think my OP was worded well enough for the speed readers coming thru.
Anyway, I agree that I found several references that agree with your point.
That is the main reason I started this thread. Personally I think it is worth
separating the technique from the situation
in this case, although there are
other places like the volley where the name of the technique is also mostly
about the situation of taking the ball out of the air.
But even in the case of a normal volley, there are exceptions that require explaining,
like an overhead smash, which can be taken out of the air as well;
which can get confusing since you can have an overhead volley out of the
air as well that is not a smash. :???:


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