Talk Tennis

Talk Tennis (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php)
-   Tennis Tips/Instruction (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/forumdisplay.php?f=17)
-   -   Improving my toss (http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=456330)

dpick 03-01-2013 08:45 PM

Improving my toss
 
Hey Guys,

Lately I have been having a lot of trouble with my toss. It kinda shoots back behind me a bit, which works out really well for my kicker but kinda sucks for my slice. The slice ends up kicking up a bit but not enough to give people trouble and they tee off on it.

Anyone have some good tips for ways to make it more consistent between different types of serves? I've watched a few videos like this one fastest way to fix tennis serve toss but they haven't really helped much.

boramiNYC 03-01-2013 09:29 PM

try to lead with the head and eye focus where you want to toss but not by too much. good toss depends on good balance and that depends on good head balance. jerky motion or tenseness of the neck has negative effect on balance and toss.

morandi 03-02-2013 07:54 AM

A pro once told me that the toss is a myth. Meaning no one has a perfect toss. He said having a "good toss" is really about being balanced throughout the service motion. The thing that really helped my balance on serve is the "squash the bug" technique. Meaning starting with the weight on the back foot, when my tossing arm goes up I twist and "squash a bug" with my front foot, weighting the ball of the front foot. Added so much consistency, and mphs to my serve.
Look at Ryan Harrisons feet in this video hitting serves:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8Eku4hatqg

dpick 03-02-2013 08:44 AM

Thanks, I've never heard of the squash the bug technique. I'll have to give it a try.

LeeD 03-02-2013 08:56 AM

Try visualization and lots of practice.\
Visualize WHERE you want the ball to be, since you already know exactly where you want to serve and it and what kind of serve you're doing.

Tight Lines 03-03-2013 05:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by morandi (Post 7246192)
A pro once told me that the toss is a myth.

Totally disagree. To have an accurate server, you have to toss the ball to the correct spot every time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by morandi (Post 7246192)
A pro once told me that the toss is a myth. Meaning no one has a perfect toss. He said having a "good toss" is really about being balanced throughout the service motion.

Agree that you need to be balanced during a serve. But, that is a different issue from the topic of having a good toss.

JMHO.

Harry

morandi 03-03-2013 06:55 AM

I think the point is that if you get preoccupied with the toss, the entire biomechanical flow of the serve breaks down. It becomes separate movements. The toss is accurate and good when the body is balanced. The weight needs to transfer to the front foot, and the hips need to rotate as the tossing arm goes up.

fuzz nation 03-05-2013 04:24 AM

My toss is more accurate and consistent for me when I straighten my elbow as I lift the ball (I start with my elbow bent). That lets me elevate the ball through more of a straight line instead of through an arc, which happens if my elbow is straight throughout the toss. If you don't do this right now, it might be a good experiment to help with a more predictable toss - gotta have it for our best serves.

Also try holing the ball different ways. I hold it resting on the base of my index and middle fingers so that I get less "flip" from my wrist as I lift the ball into the air. Some of our pals also do well with a "snow cone" grip on the ball - that's where the palm is vertical (like when holding a glass of water, etc.). Hold the ball mostly in the index finger and thumb, then think "cheers!" as you lift it for your toss.

One more idea - make sure your motion is good and loaded up so that you're ready to swing with absolutely no rush to the ball before you put your toss up in the air. This is important for enabling a full, smooth motion and tapping our best racquet speed over the top. If your motion fells at all rushed, just think about delaying your toss.

charliefedererer 03-05-2013 09:51 AM

Almost all the pros toss roughly "parallel to the baseline" so they can begin to coil back with their upper body as their arm is going up:
Federer Murray Haas & more ball toss common threads http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lIF-U...B1814186A2E18C


But there is an important point that almost all the pros do to get the ball to go out into the court for the first serve or a slice serve - and Christophe explains this starting at 2:45 in this video:
Secrets of the Toss http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...R_NaTvPo4&NR=1



Basically, almost everyone starts their serve motion like this:



But as they rock back, they bring the ball all the way back to a point near their BACK LEG !!!
... so that as the arm goes up it moves forward into the court just slightly.

Below, Pete Sampras shows how to toss for a first or slice serve to get the ball to go out into the court:



In pic 1, he has already "rocked back", bringing the ball to near his BACK leg (note the ball overlying the side of his left foot).

By pic 2, with his arm halfway up, the ball is now at a position midway between both legs.

By the time of pic 4, he is releasing the ball at a point over his FRONT leg/foot.




What you DON'T want to do is what the player below is doing - radically changing the path of his arm, and not starting to coil at all during his tossing motion [even though the position of the ball is where you will want to toss it to for contact]:




Instead, do what I recommend to get the ball out into the court for a flat,
topspin-slice and pure slice serve.

The only difference is that for a flat serve get the ball all the way back near your back leg, and for a pure slice start with the ball more between your legs so that your arm will not sweep forward into the court.





As LeeD has written above, once you have the basic idea and motion down of what you need to do, it is not that complicated.

Almost by magic, if you visualize where you want the ball to go, you will start to toss it there.

But of course if takes a lot of practice to do it precisely time after time - at the same time you are rotating back away from the ball as you coil AND toss at the same time.

Raul_SJ 03-05-2013 01:32 PM

You can also experiment with this alternative to the circular toss motion... A bent elbow "straight-line tossing motion".

http://tennis.about.com/od/serve/a/tacklingtoss.htm

To get a circular tossing motion to result in a straight toss, you have to release the ball early, but not a moment too early. Many players manage to do this well most of the time, but when they get into tense situations, their timing goes off, and their tosses fly unpredictably, with disastrous consequences for their serves.

The solution is to use a tossing motion that may seem somewhat awkward at first, where you start the ball just in front of the leading edge of your right leg (for a right-hander). Instead of swinging the ball out, then up, in a circular path, slant the ball upward and forward on a straight line toward your intended point of contact for the serve. It sometimes helps to imagine that you're guiding the ball up through a pipe that goes to your point of contact. Your arm will look and feel mostly straight during your toss, but you'll naturally bend your elbow slightly in the early part of the tossing motion in order to move the ball in a straight line.

With this straight-line tossing motion, you can release the ball with your tossing arm extended as far upward as you wish, and the ball will not drift behind you. You don't have to worry about exact timing, because with the ball moving on a straight line, it will always be moving in the same direction no matter when you release it.

tennis_balla 03-05-2013 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dpick (Post 7245614)
Hey Guys,

Lately I have been having a lot of trouble with my toss. It kinda shoots back behind me a bit, which works out really well for my kicker but kinda sucks for my slice. The slice ends up kicking up a bit but not enough to give people trouble and they tee off on it.

Anyone have some good tips for ways to make it more consistent between different types of serves? I've watched a few videos like this one fastest way to fix tennis serve toss but they haven't really helped much.

If the ball is ending up too far behind you then that could mean you're releasing it too late. Its difficult to know without a video. You could also be flicking your wrist a bit without even knowing it.

However try this, next time you work on your serve hold the ball in your finger tips, including thumb, only with your digits spread evenly around the ball and hold it as lightly as you can. To release the ball open up your palm. See what happens when you do that.

dpick 03-05-2013 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tennis_balla (Post 7252826)
However try this, next time you work on your serve hold the ball in your finger tips, including thumb, only with your digits spread evenly around the ball and hold it as lightly as you can. To release the ball open up your palm. See what happens when you do that.

I was practicing tossing again today and noticed that I was flicking my fingers to push the ball up rather than really using my arm. This meant that if my timing wasn't perfect the ball went in crazy directions.

Changing to this technique made a huge difference for me and gave me a lot more control over where my toss would end up. Thanks for the help guys!

Fintft 03-06-2013 09:13 AM

What makes a difference for me is going slow and keep my arm going up after the release, as of trying to catch the ball (per Bolettierri)

tennis_balla 03-06-2013 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dpick (Post 7253464)
I was practicing tossing again today and noticed that I was flicking my fingers to push the ball up rather than really using my arm. This meant that if my timing wasn't perfect the ball went in crazy directions.

Changing to this technique made a huge difference for me and gave me a lot more control over where my toss would end up. Thanks for the help guys!

Glad it worked out for you.

WildVolley 03-06-2013 10:04 AM

A good toss is a learned skill like anything else. The best professionals can repeatedly toss to an exact location (within the area of the sweet spot of the racket).

It is usually best to cradle the ball in your fingers, limit hand motion, throw with the arm relatively straight and release the ball by separating your fingers.

From my observation, players with a wild toss tend to try to flick the ball into place while better servers tend to lift the ball up with the arm and gently release it.

Towerofpower205 03-07-2013 08:01 PM

The way I teach people to remember it is to tap the ball against your hip pocket and release it at eye level. This will give you something psychologically to remember as well as fixing your toss because the ball will stay in front if you

Relinquis 03-07-2013 08:16 PM

wow!

didn't realise adrian grenier had such a great toss (in the photo sequence above).


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 04:28 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
© 2006 - Tennis Warehouse