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comeback 11-14-2013 07:19 PM

Stalling
 
I was reading the thread on grunting, which bothers me somewhat. But stalling i cannot stand. It totally throws me off me game. Bouncing the ball excessively, sitting between points for a long time, toweling off, talking, all annoy me.
But the one that gets me the most is what i call the "ball trick". It can be done a number of ways. One way is hitting a faulted 1st serve into the net then holding your hand up and slowly go to the net and clear the ball back to the back fence.
Another "ball trick" is after you hit a dead ball back to the server; he then hits that ball back to the fence, then goes back to the fence to retireve it.
These 2 stalling tactics really get to me. Many players probably don't even realize these 2 subtle stalling tactics when they are being done to them.

Bdarb 11-14-2013 07:25 PM

bounce the ball a couple of times then bounce it off of your shoe "whoops lemme go grab that.."

guess I know how I could beat you haha

newpball 11-14-2013 07:31 PM

I suggest meditation and yoga.

comeback 11-14-2013 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bdarb (Post 7901319)
bounce the ball a couple of times then bounce it off of your shoe "whoops lemme go grab that.."

guess I know how I could beat you haha

Yeah that's another good one, But the server might screw himself. Both of mine are reciever based,, Yes it's a good way to get to me..i do try to not show my annoyance.

comeback 11-14-2013 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newpball (Post 7901328)
I suggest meditation and yoga.

I'm still looking into meditation. I tried yoga once and it was hot yoga. I liked the sweat but holding those positions for longer than 10 seconds was a killer. Never went back

newpball 11-14-2013 09:13 PM

By the way I have a solution to your situation.

I will get back to you soon for more details.... ;)

bethany2 11-14-2013 10:13 PM

At 3.5 nationals there was a woman doing this. After her opponent would fault and the ball was resting against the fence she would motion "hold up" and slooowly walk back, move the ball another inch back, then slooowly return to her position. The other player called her out on it and eventually an official was called over and lectured her on this "gamesmanship" and it stopped. Good to see the officials actually taking action on this!

jhick 11-15-2013 05:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by comeback (Post 7901309)
But the one that gets me the most is what i call the "ball trick". It can be done a number of ways. One way is hitting a faulted 1st serve into the net then holding your hand up and slowly go to the net and clear the ball back to the back fence.
Another "ball trick" is after you hit a dead ball back to the server; he then hits that ball back to the fence, then goes back to the fence to retireve it.
These 2 stalling tactics really get to me. Many players probably don't even realize these 2 subtle stalling tactics when they are being done to them.

I can understand excessive stalling, but to me it seems you are a bit overly sensitive about this subject.

For the first example above, what is the alternative? Hire a ball boy/ball girl for your matches? Leave the ball on the court risking injury?

The second tactic I don't see that often, but it wouldn't bother me as long as the time isn't excessive. Think of it this way; it also gives you a chance to recover from the previous point and focus on the next one.

And if many players don't realize that these tactics are being done to them, then more power to them, as it likely isn't affecting their game at all.

comeback 11-18-2013 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jhick (Post 7902099)
I can understand excessive stalling, but to me it seems you are a bit overly sensitive about this subject.

For the first example above, what is the alternative? Hire a ball boy/ball girl for your matches? Leave the ball on the court risking injury?

The second tactic I don't see that often, but it wouldn't bother me as long as the time isn't excessive. Think of it this way; it also gives you a chance to recover from the previous point and focus on the next one.

And if many players don't realize that these tactics are being done to them, then more power to them, as it likely isn't affecting their game at all.

I am probably over sensitive because i try to be in shape for all matches and i'm thinking they are cheating by abusing the USTA rules.

Between points: 20 seconds maximum, play at serverís pace.
On changeovers: 90 seconds, ready to serve/receive.
During tiebreaks: no break if switching after 6 points.
Between sets: 2 minutes, may announce & leave court for water.
Bathroom breaks: 3 minutes, unless the distance is extreme.
Injury time-outs: 3 minutes (only one).

Brian11785 11-18-2013 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bethany2 (Post 7901685)
At 3.5 nationals there was a woman doing this. After her opponent would fault and the ball was resting against the fence she would motion "hold up" and slooowly walk back, move the ball another inch back, then slooowly return to her position. The other player called her out on it and eventually an official was called over and lectured her on this "gamesmanship" and it stopped. Good to see the officials actually taking action on this!

This exact thing happened at (again, 3.5) sectionals this year in a singles line my teammate was playing (and I was watching.) There were also some pretty bad calls. It all seemed very rehearsed/coached to me.

Sakkijarvi 11-18-2013 12:18 PM

I am with the OP on this, and am down on gamesmanship across the board. Stalling is treated in Gilbert's "Winning Ugly", IIRC he speaks to what he called the 'turtle' play by Ivan Lendl. While I understand there are times to 'slow things down' ... same should be conducted within the rules and code of the sport. Anything way beyond that puts you into a gamesmanship type, aka 'weenie' and sadly for you, outside the realm of 'sportsman'.

I have seen stalling conducted, and the handful of 'worst of' types I have every encountered, were users of this charlatan's tool. One example is a guy that runs after all balls like a deer, a true golden retriever. But has to sit forever at changeovers, and will never, ever rise until you have already walked back on the court and are standing there waiting. You can't help but get sucked into this charade, a if you address him on it ... boom, distraction. Call an umpire (which I did in one USTA match -- in which the guy erupted in anger and started yelling that the owner of the club) -- and risk disrupting the match. Even think of how annoying it is ... and again, distraction. So the weenie that embraces this approach puts winning above everything and does not care if the sporting experience is ruined. So you beat the weenie ... still less than a good time.

Another one is 'the long walk'. I have seen this one a few times. One guy I called on it, it was ridiculous. I hit a first serve ... he heads off to fetch the ball 40 yards away on an adjacent court. I said, "whatcha doin'....' Same guy didn't hit the ball back to me during warmups ... my brain goes 'yawn' when I come across these people ... usually ensconced in USTA (perhaps because they can't create a tennis network of buddies due to their 'issues'...) Then there is the stall where the guy doesn't hit the ball to you when he needs to send you a ball .. wanders in to pick up balls literally touching the net, 'I once saw a guy break an ankle...' And so on.

We also have the bathroom-break guys. Zen-like trance during changeover guys. All subsets of stalling.

Look, the rules limit the time for changeovers and such. A little extra factored in for age, fitness and club tennis atmosphere is fine. But if you are a staller, you know it, and thus look in the mirror and mouth the word 'weeeeenie'. Mustard, a bun and a hungry, half-starved Grizzly Bear is all you deserve :0

comeback 11-18-2013 02:50 PM

Being the OP of this thread, these kinds of stalling tactics are so subtle that many players don't even realize it is being done to them. Another is the towel at the back of the fence on every point. As i said i am used to playing pretty fast so stalling absolutely kills my rhythm. I start to force shots. Distractions like grunting don't bother me as much.

comeback 11-18-2013 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newpball (Post 7901543)
By the way I have a solution to your situation.

I will get back to you soon for more details.... ;)

haha, you now know how to get to me

jhick 11-19-2013 05:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by comeback (Post 7908058)
I am probably over sensitive because i try to be in shape for all matches and i'm thinking they are cheating by abusing the USTA rules.

Between points: 20 seconds maximum, play at serverís pace.
On changeovers: 90 seconds, ready to serve/receive.
During tiebreaks: no break if switching after 6 points.
Between sets: 2 minutes, may announce & leave court for water.
Bathroom breaks: 3 minutes, unless the distance is extreme.
Injury time-outs: 3 minutes (only one).

If the stalling is excessive, then sure, it would certainly be okay for you to bring it up with your opponent. perhaps they are not aware they are doing it. If it continues, then bring it up with the captain of the team, and then the league coordinator.

Obviously it affects you more than most players. If most players don't realize it's being done to them, then it obviously isn't bothering them like it bothers you, so I really don't see the problem there.

Also, since you didn't answer my first question, can I assume you don't pick up balls served into the net and just leave them on the court, hoping that you don't step on one and risk spraining your ankle during the point? Otherwise, if you do go and pick up your own net serves, then you are being hypocritical of your opponent when they do the same.

comeback 11-19-2013 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jhick (Post 7909422)
If the stalling is excessive, then sure, it would certainly be okay for you to bring it up with your opponent. perhaps they are not aware they are doing it. If it continues, then bring it up with the captain of the team, and then the league coordinator.

Obviously it affects you more than most players. If most players don't realize it's being done to them, then it obviously isn't bothering them like it bothers you, so I really don't see the problem there.

Also, since you didn't answer my first question, can I assume you don't pick up balls served into the net and just leave them on the court, hoping that you don't step on one and risk spraining your ankle during the point? Otherwise, if you do go and pick up your own net serves, then you are being hypocritical of your opponent when they do the same.

I will pick up balls on my side of the net if they are in my path. But I'm was talking about when i miss the first serve long and my opponent hits it back up to their side of the net. Then they stop my 2nd serve to go back up to the net to retrieve it even it it wasn't in their way.

jhick 11-19-2013 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by comeback (Post 7909981)
I will pick up balls on my side of the net if they are in my path. But I'm was talking about when i miss the first serve long and my opponent hits it back up to their side of the net. Then they stop my 2nd serve to go back up to the net to retrieve it even it it wasn't in their way.

If you are serving bombs at me and your serve is long I typically am not going to have the time to stop my swing and I might just happen to hit the out serve into the net. If the ball is sitting on my side of the court and in my way, I will jog up and either pick up the ball and put it in my pocket or roll it off the court in a timely manner. No one I've played has had a problem with this that I know of. I've never heard it discussed in my tennis circles as a general issue.

Now, I suppose your opponent could be really deliberate about it. That might irk me a little, but it's probably not going to bother me all that much when all is said and done. Maybe you need some work on your mental game if it's really that big of issue for you.

Cindysphinx 11-19-2013 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by comeback (Post 7909981)
I will pick up balls on my side of the net if they are in my path. But I'm was talking about when i miss the first serve long and my opponent hits it back up to their side of the net. Then they stop my 2nd serve to go back up to the net to retrieve it even it it wasn't in their way.

I'm not going to leave a ball on the court unless it is very snug against the net, and hardly ever outdoors.

I don't need a gust of wind moving the ball, and even indoors I do not want to be aware of that ball during a point.

If clearing those balls bothers my opponent, that's a shame.

I would say the issue here may not be one of "stalling." It may be one of "rushing."

sureshs 11-19-2013 11:15 AM

Agree with Cindy. Safety comes first for older players.

hrstrat57 11-19-2013 11:18 AM

The well placed shoe tie is one of the biggest weapons in tennis.

Baxter 11-20-2013 04:32 AM

If my opponent starts to retrieve my missed first serve that isn't going to end up in a location that could cause harm, I remind them that I already have a second ball. You really can't fault someone for clearing a ball that is a legitimate safety risk, unless they're moving at glacial speeds of course.


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