View Single Post
Old 03-09-2010, 09:13 PM   #241
abmk
G.O.A.T.
 
abmk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: India
Posts: 14,242
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pc1 View Post
That's my point you can argue he is the best returner of his era and even on this point there is doubt. Best of all time is major doubt and when people write or say Agassi is definitely the best returner ever, well it may be true but frankly in this case I don't think so. For example I think Connors is superior to him but I can't prove it. I think he returned more serves and was probably every bit as good in hitting return winners. He was better defensively also that probably would allow him to steal more games when his opponent serves. It's the thing that people take it as FACT that Agassi is the greatest serve returner and it's not fact but opinion that is disturbing. And there is not strong evidence to indicate Agassi is the GOAT of service returns.
I think he is/was the best returner of his era clearly.. I'll give the stats in the next post for this. As for greatest returner of all time, that is pretty much debatable

Quote:
Originally Posted by pc1 View Post
But I do wonder that if return games won % isn't the sole most important statistic here, what is? Isn't that the point of returns, ie to win the games that your opponent serves? What good is two great flashy returns that wins two points and you fail to return any other serves (which happens with Agassi at times because he's not as quick as some) when perhaps four dull returns at the feet wins the game. Isn't that the point...to win the game? The information we have now seems to indicate over a period of ten years, Chang probably was superior in winning games on his opponent's serve over Agassi. Peers often can be wrong.
the percentages are about the same . nadal isn't the greatest of returners, but breaks a fair no of times due to his ground game and because he plays quite a bit on clay and is quite dominant on it. Doesn't make him even close to the best returners of this era viz. hewitt, federer,murray,nalbandian ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by pc1 View Post
I would tend to agree with you but it still is an opinion and in order to be somewhat sure you have to examine other information and perhaps statistics that may be relevant. You want to impartially examine the information and reach the conclusion. Let's face it, Roddick fans would disagree with you on that assumption.
would they really ? well , maybe I'll get the stats in some time

Quote:
Originally Posted by pc1 View Post
I think you're almost certainly correct with the first sentence. As far as the second sentence is concerned, that's not important as far as what we are discussing. I'll give you the fact Federer at a young age handled Sampras' serve well.
it was an exo, wouldn't read much into it ..

Quote:
Originally Posted by pc1 View Post
As far as the discussion is concerned I would tend to think Sampras was every bit as dominant as Roddick is now in the serving categories but I just wonder why the slightly (and it is slight) lower percentages. It's enough for me to think it's not a coincidence.
well, I'll probably get the stats soon

Last edited by abmk : 03-09-2010 at 09:15 PM.
abmk is offline   Reply With Quote