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Old 07-02-2012, 07:47 PM   #57
NadalAgassi
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Originally Posted by DMan View Post
I'd like to have a "major slump" for 5 years, the majority of which Steffi spent ranked #1.
Monica was the real #1 of 1990, 1991, 1992, and 1993, and Sanchez in 1994. Graf wasnt even the best player any of those years really. Computer rankings are often controversial (eg- Caroline Wozniacki). She did deserve the computer #1 in 1993 since Seles was unable to play after being nearly murdered by a crazed Graf fan in April, but the early part of the year when both Graf and Seles played showed who the best player that year was.


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Which of course begs the question, if Seles were Graf's only competition, just who was Seles' competition?!
Who cares, this isnt a thread about Seles. She is just one of many reasons (her being stabbed, Martina and Chris being old when Steffi arrived on the scene, lack of greats or consistent threats) Steffi's competition was weak and she still couldnt dominate or even be a true #1 for more than 2 years in a row ever.


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As far as Graf "only" winning 1 major in 1990, 1991, 1992, and 1994.....shows you how high she set the bar.....a year in which she "only" wins 1 major and maintains the #1 ranking is a ......."slump."
Not as high as Martina though who in years she won 2 slams like 1985 and 1987 was said to be in a "slump" by people.



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Graf lost to Sanchez 2 in the first 5 months of the year (balanced by 3 wins. The first win was in the Miami final - a surprise win, but then again ASV was defending champ. The other ASV win was in Hamburg, 2 days after the stabbing. Graf was overcome with emotion at what happened. And of course she was the only player to take the time to visit Mons in hospital.
Graf emotional about the Seles stabbing, LOL! Please. Emotional with joy as she would have a free ride on tour for awhile. Sanchez as well, in fact even worse than Graf. Just look at how Sanchez celebrated with glee winning the Hamburg event days after the Seles stabbing, knowing her career would pick up steam with the women she was a useless 1-10 against gone (atleast Graf could compete with pre stabbing Seles, Sanchez was as useless as a dead mammel on the side of the road vs Seles), sickening.


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"Spanked by Seles in the Australian Open?
"Spanked by Martinez in Philadelphia (so you're criticizing Graf's first and only career loss to world #4 Martinez at the end of a Graf 46 match win streak? I guess that is another demonstration of Graf not being "in form"
Martinez is a completely useless player on carpet. Just look at her WTA Championships record, no appearances in the semis despite being ranked top 3 for 4 years in a row during the epic low of the womens game after the Seles stabbing. Graf to lose 6-3, 6-3 to her pigeon on what is by FAR her worst surface (and one of Graf's best) is telling to her true form at the time.

As for the other part do you dispute Seles spanked Graf in the Australian Open final. The last 2 sets Seles won by 2 service breaks each, it wasnt even close.


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Yeah, BAd Steffi lost the opening set 6-4, and came back to win 6-1,6-0. How horrible of her! And Maleeva was in the top 10. Does make you wonder how come Seles had to struggle to beat #143 Kijimuta in the 4R of the French in 1992?
The difference is the 93 U.S Open was a semifinal. A top player should be in form by that point if they are really playing well.


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That was a Fed Cup loss. Not counted towards rankings. And played the week after Wimbeldon.
So you really think Graf didnt care about losing to Nicole Provis since it was only Fed Cup? Why was she even playing it then.



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This is a sickening comment. Because it upholds Seles as the standard bearer, when she was nothing of the kind.
From 1990-1993, until being stabbed, she was. Graf was looking like a short Hewitt like transition champion between Evert/Navratilova and Seles, even if more successful than Hewitt as the 2 year transition #1.


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Court (Australian), Navratilova (Wimbledon), and Evert (French) had more more opportunities than Graf did to earn the most # of titles at those 3 majors.
and whose fault was that? Graf didnt have to retire at barely 30. It isnt the others fault they felt they could take on the best well into their 30s, and Graf was scared of the power of the next generation so fled when she was still fully able to play and potentially contend alot longer.


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Their US Open matchups were:
1985 SF (28 yo Martina vs 16 yo Steffi in her first ever major semi)
1986 SF (29 yo #1 Martina vs 17 yo Steffi.....thanks God Martina held on by a whisker to take that match)
1987 F 30 yo Martina upends recently new #1 Steffi
1989 Graf beats Navratilova comprehensively, winning 11 of the last 14 games.
1991 SF, 34 yo Martina stuns #1 Steffi 76,67,64 (in the worst match of Graf's career).
Graf at 27/28 was already a shadow of her old self, getting crushed by Amanda Coetzer of all people. You really think Graf at 17/18, the same ages Seles completely dominated womens tennis and Graf, was further from her prime than 29/30 year old Martina? Even more incredibly you think a 32 year old Martina was in her absolute prime, LOL! OK lets go along with that nonsense just for the sake of argument though. You seem to atleast concede Graf was prime in 1987, 1989, 1991. So even if Martina was prime 1985, 1986, 1987, 1991, that means with 3 of their 5 matches being in Graf's prime she still went a lowly 1-4 vs Navratilova at the U.S Open, and as a 22 year old #1 ranked player who had dominated most of the last 4 years lost to a well past her prime 34 year old Martina. Her one win Martina had to choke a 6-3, 4-2 lead to boot or it would be a perfect 5-0 for a 28-34 year old Martina over 16-22 year old Graf at the U.S Open, their most neutral meeting ground. How embarassing, especialy for someone whose fans argue her as the so called GOAT.


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Martina was out of her prime in 1991. But who is to say she wasn't part of her prime in 1985-1989?
In 1987 Martina won only 4 of 12 tournaments she entered, little to do with Steffi who only denied her 2. She was suffering beatdown losses to all kinds of players, including Chris who was even older than Martina, and some much lower ranked ones. This is the same women who was losing 2 matches a year at her peak. You really think was still prime Martina? Never mind the Martina that came after the visible 1987 decline.



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Am still wondering, since Graf faced no real competition other than Seles, just who was Mons competition. Surely you can't say MJ Fernandez, Novotna, Sanchez, and granny Navratilova.
Again who cares, nobody is saying Seles is the GOAT. Just that she is an asterix on Graf's career. Anyway Seles faced Graf herself winning all those slams. Graf won only 1 slam ever facing prime Seles, and it was on grass where she is useless.

Last edited by NadalAgassi : 07-02-2012 at 07:51 PM.
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