Got to agree with SA that the racquet is moving up for twist and kick serves, and that the ball initially rises, even if the racquet face is slightly closed.
(I made a similar argument in posts 67 and 68 in this thread: http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showt...=366690&page=4
Here is a sequence of Sam Stosur serving that Toly had previously posted:
One could argue exactly which pic ball contact occurs at. My reading is that ball contact occurs at pic 19, but certainly by pic 20 at the latest.
Clearly on pic 25 the ball is off the racquet. But in this pic, notice that the ball is definitely lower than the top of the "25" stamped into the upper corner of this pic.
Now look at pic 26 where the ball is almost even with the top of the "26" stamped into the upper corner.
Then on pics 27 and 28 the ball is higher still!
That ball is rising!