View Single Post
Old 12-24-2012, 04:06 AM   #94
zagor
Talk Tennis Guru
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Weak era
Posts: 25,797
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NadalAgassi View Post
That is true, other than a couple more hard court majors really doesnt add much to Federer at this point. He is already considered the overall hard court GOAT. Whereas Nadal kept Federer from being a top 5 clay courter of all time, an insurmoutnable forever slam record of 24 or more slams, and created a stigma about Federer's career.
That's true but I wasn't comparing the damage Novak did to Fed's career to the damage Nadal did to (it isn't even close) it but rather comparing the damage Novak did to Fed's career to the damage he did to Nadal's.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NadalAgassi View Post
Yes though I see your point, Djokovic has probably cost both Federer and Nadal several majors.
Yes and the damage is comparable IMO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NadalAgassi View Post
I also agree Federer had a decent chance vs Nadal in the 2011 U.S Open final, 30-40% I would say...
Well let's say Fed would have had a 30% and presume Fed would have won 2008 AO (mono or not, Fed was still terrific when dealing with big hitters back then) and 2011 AO (Murray was a mental mess in the final) and presume Nadal would have won 2011 Wimbledon (Nadal served great in the final and Tsonga has a poor ROS) and 2012 AO (I don't think Murray would have had enough left in the tank had he won his marathon against Novak).

That leaves us with Novak taking 2 slams from each with 70% of taking 3 slams from Nadal and 30% of taking 3 slams from Fed which is why I say it's comparable (the damage).

In short Nadal may be standing on 13-14 slams now if not for Novak but the Fed's slam record he'd have to chase would be 19-20.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NadalAgassi View Post
although Nadal would still be thrilled to face Federer in the final and not Novak.
Oh I have no doubt about that, even Toni admitted he thinks "they" would have won USO if Fed beat Novak.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NadalAgassi View Post
The ironic part about your 2010 obviously not is that most ****s on this forum believe Federer would have beaten Nadal even in 2010 (completely delusional and ridiculous I know but that is their reality apparently).
Well my personal opinion is that while Nadal overall as a player is obviously different to guys like Safin or Krajicek his 2010 USO performance is similar to Safin's 2005 AO and Krajicek's 1996 Wimbledon in that while there are plenty of players in tennis history who are overall much better USO, AO and Wimbledon players respectively they all IMO reached the level in those specific tourneys comparable to anyone who ever played the game.

In short, it would take peak Fed firing on all cylinders to beat Nadal in the form he displayed that tourney and I feel it would take similar from other USO open greats as well (such as Sampras, Connors, Lendl etc.), that doesn't mean Nadal is overall comparable to them as a player at USO but IMO his 2010 USO level is comparable to their best levels at that tourney.

Now that doesn't mean for example Novak's win over Nadal in 2011 USO or Murray's win over Nadal in 2008 weren't wins over a peak Nadal - they were, one tourney doesn't constitute a peak (otherwise we could say Fed wasn't at his peak in all of his AO wins but 2007 which he won without dropping a set), 2010 USO performance was a one off, even if Nadal wins another USO in the future I doubt he'll ever match that level of play.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NadalAgassi View Post
It is nice to talk to a sane Federer fan for once.
It's hard to define sane but thanks anyway.
zagor is offline   Reply With Quote