Originally Posted by julian
1.There is a definition #1:
"Pat the dog is a backswing position which is mostly a result of pronation in the backswing which closes the racquet face (to lesser or greater degree). " by CHICO 9166
2.It is taken literally from post#21
3.There is a variation of defintion#1
If you pronate in the backswing then you pat a dog
4.OP created problems by himself/herself by phrasing HIS/HER POST as follows:
"notice that the Big 4 and more don't apply PTD to their BH like they do on their FH. It's just odd to me since you hear so much about the 2HBH being a opposite handed FH with a guide. I never really bought into that"
It is a classic example of making statements about the property X WITHOUT defining the property X
5.It is generally believed that Djokovic follows BOTH defintion #1 and the variation of the definition #1
in the case of HIS BACKHAND.Please see the FIRST LINK of my post #28
So I disagree with OP that "Djokovic DOES NOT pat the dog"
6.The same applies for Nadal in the case of HIS BACKHAND
7.Limiting the discussion to the CLOSED or NEUTRAL STANCE is possible but a mistake IMHO in the case of
8.There is disagreement between coaches which WTA players "pat the dog" and "which do NOT"
The banner examples are Kuznetsova,Stosur and Li NA
9.I went through a similar pain at tennisplayer.net
The only hesitation I have in the definition is to what extent we say that the racket face being closed to the court is due to pronation. It seems from my experience that the closing of the racket face is due to a combination of forearm pronation/internal shoulder rotation/and elbow extension. The "pat-the-dog" motion is the motion that combines all of these and closes the face to the court, during the transition phase.
Just so you know, by my definition, Stosur definitely "pats-the-dog," the video evidence isn't refutable. I'm not familiar enough with Kuznetsova (even though I've seen her play in person) and Li Na to be certain.
I'll watch the videos you've linked of Djok hitting backhands. I do see some closing of the racket face, so he may have some of that same motion.
Thanks for explaining your position more fully.