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Old 07-26-2013, 08:03 AM   #3216
abmk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NonP View Post
If the ace % is any guide the unreturned-serve % is probably not much different. Remember, the % of points won by aces is nearly identical between the AO and the USO, and as I like to point out the % of unreturned serves has almost certainly increased since the '90s, which, much like the % of service games won, doesn't support the "surface slowdown" talking points.
I'm not sure if you've done stats for multiple matches, but if you had, you'd immediately notice that the no of errors forced by the serve is always significantly more than the no of aces.

what was the gap b/w AO and USO , ace % for those years, 0.7% ?

that'd increase quite a bit more , if you included errors forced by the serve to get the total % of won off the serve alone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NonP View Post
And again I return to my main point: if players are holding serve and winning more free points than possibly ever per these stats, then what does it matter whether the surfaces are slower? And you can't point to the racquets as the main culprit, either, because 1) again whatever advantages they afford the returner are somehow offset by the server's own advantages, and 2) the net stats today do not show such a big divergence from those of previous eras (or at least the last couple decades). Then what's the problem?
yes, it matters, because those service games are being won more from the baseline through rallies and not because of the conditions aiding the serve that much.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NonP View Post
That's why I say people are missing the big picture when they focus so much on the courts/racquets. Despite all the complaints the fundamentals of tennis haven't changed all that much. What have really changed are the players, and these changes began long before the so-called surface slowdown/racquet revolution.
I agree that the focus on courts/racquets is more than what it should be and the focus on coaches/players themselves is less than what it should be. But you IMO you are stretching in the opposite direction.

Last edited by abmk : 07-26-2013 at 10:00 AM.
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