JMac the *******

[kanamit]

Watching him commentate the Soderling-Davy match and instead of commenting on the match itself, he's complaining about GS attendees cheering for Nadal's opponents. "I bet 90% of the French Open audience had no idea what Soderling's first name was!" (JMac, you don't even know how to pronounce Soderling: it's SODERLING, not SAHHDERLING). "Can you believe that people here were chanting for Kiefer? What did Nadal ever do to them except give 110%."

Believe it or not, JMac, some people just like to support the underdog! Hard to believe, I know, considering that you're the ultimate bandwagon jumper and brown-noser who effusively praises every top 5 player when they're on court. Also, can you learn to shush during points? K thanx.

[theroleoftheunderdog]

actually a lot of ppl just don't like nadal, especially the french

[clayrules]

Originally Posted by theroleoftheunderdog

actually a lot of ppl just don't like nadal, especially the french

actually a lot of people love Nadal except the french

JMac is right, too many *******s watching when Nadal plays.

[theroleoftheunderdog]

Originally Posted by clayrules

actually a lot of people love Nadal except the french

JMac is right, too many *******s watching when Nadal plays.

what a brilliant reply. im sure jmac uses the word "*******s".

[Rippy]

Originally Posted by clayrules

actually a lot of people love Nadal except the french

JMac is right, too many *******s watching when Nadal plays.

I don't think JMac said that.....

[RFRF]

Originally Posted by theroleoftheunderdog

actually a lot of ppl just don't like nadal, especially the french

yeh thats true.

[uNIVERSE mAN]

That's just the stupid accent the americans have. Like Vaahlee, instead of Volley.

[jamesblakefan#1]

Originally Posted by uNIVERSE mAN

That's just the stupid accent the americans have. Like Vaahlee, instead of Volley.

Not all Americans have that ''stupid accent'', just the ones from New York, like McEnroe.

[Lifted]

Originally Posted by uNIVERSE mAN

That's just the stupid accent the americans have. Like Vaahlee, instead of Volley.

You are clearly an uneducated louse.

[namelessone]

The French giving zero support to Nadal has to do more with their general attitude than their supposed love for Soderling. Let's be honest for a second. Nadal never got much love in Paris,even though he is a 4 times champion there. The French(well actually the parisians not all the french) are snobs and they like their champions to play beautifully,which is pretty funny,since clay champions are usually grinders a la Nadal/Muster/Borg and so on.

There are several facts going against Nadal in his quest for the approval of the RG crowd:

-he's a grinder and the french like players with elegant game and strokes.

-he's Spanish and for all those who know European realities,know that there is a underlying rivalry between the French and Spanish in a lot of areas,not just sports. It's like this with all big,important countries who are neighbors. It's not easy to see how the Spanish own them in football(both in the national team and clubs),win their GS slam event year after year,hell even in cycling Contador won the Tour de France.

-he doesn't speak French and in France that helps. It's no coincidence that Federer and Henin are so loved over there and it's only natural because you can connect to the player better if he speaks your language.

The French crowd wanted Nadal to lose so that Federer could win RG. It's as simple as that really. McEnroe knows more about tennis than any of us and if even he thought this behaviour strange then there is something to it and I don't think he is a *******. And he is not the only commentator who has mentioned that this is weird.To put it into perspective for Fed fans,it's like Federer getting little to no support in USO when he is in trouble because the newyorkers wanted Nadal to finally win and get a Career Slam. That would be an abomination,because Fed has always had the crowd on his side at his favourite slams.

The underdog theory falls flat on its face and I will tell you why in a minute. If the french wanted a better quality upset they would have rooted for Nadal in the end of the 4th because a 5 setter is a better dethroning of a champion and they would have seen more thrilling tennis,because they would have made it to a deciding set. But,unbelievably,the crowd rooted for Soderling in the 4th set tiebreak,even after they guy had gained a large lead(he won that tiebreak 7-1 or something like that). In the one moment when their 4 times champion needed a bit of support,because he could have pushed the match to 5 sets,the french chose not to give that support. Many commentators said on the spot how weird that moment was but they were probably *******s,right?

So Soderling eliminated Nadal. Does he receive a lot of love in the next rounds? Well not really,at least not like in the Nadal match. Then the final comes along. Soderling,the crowd favourite according to the underdog theory,is ignored by the crowd who turn to Federer,the huge favourite in that match. Besides soderling's box no one in that whole arena was rooting for Soderling,everybody wanted Fed to win. They cheered twice as hard for Fed's winners,gasped when Fed made errors and cheered on Soderling's mistakes. Kinda weird how they dumped the lovable underdog once their actual favourite player(fed) stepped on-court,isn't it? If they really liked Soderling,they would have pulled for him on that day but they didn't. They only turned to him when he got the job done,which was to take Nadal out.

But hey,who am I to accuse the crowd,right? Then again I trust McEnroe's words more than I trust some TW'ers who want to believe that Soderling was cheered on in RG because he was the underdog,not because the French wanted Nadal out.

[theroleoftheunderdog]

Originally Posted by namelessone

The French giving zero support to Nadal has to do more with their general attitude than their supposed love for Soderling. Let's be honest for a second. Nadal never got much love in Paris,even though he is a 4 times champion there. The French(well actually the parisians not all the french) are snobs and they like their champions to play beautifully,which is pretty funny,since clay champions are usually grinders a la Nadal/Muster/Borg and so on.

There are several facts going against Nadal in his quest for the approval of the RG crowd:

-he's a grinder and the french like players with elegant game and strokes.

-he's Spanish and for all those who know European realities,know that there is a underlying rivalry between the French and Spanish in a lot of areas,not just sports. It's like this with all big,important countries who are neighbors. It's not easy to see how the Spanish own them in football(both in the national team and clubs),win their GS slam event year after year,hell even in cycling Contador won the Tour de France.

-he doesn't speak French and in France that helps. It's no coincidence that Federer and Henin are so loved over there and it's only natural because you can connect to the player better if he speaks your language.

The French crowd wanted Nadal to lose so that Federer could win RG. It's as simple as that really. McEnroe knows more about tennis than any of us and if even he thought this behaviour strange then there is something to it and I don't think he is a *******. And he is not the only commentator who has mentioned that this is weird.To put it into perspective for Fed fans,it's like Federer getting little to no support in USO when he is in trouble because the newyorkers wanted Nadal to finally win and get a Career Slam. That would be an abomination,because Fed has always had the crowd on his side at his favourite slams.

The underdog theory falls flat on its face and I will tell you why in a minute. If the french wanted a better quality upset they would have rooted for Nadal in the end of the 4th because a 5 setter is a better dethroning of a champion and they would have seen more thrilling tennis,because they would have made it to a deciding set. But,unbelievably,the crowd rooted for Soderling in the 4th set tiebreak,even after they guy had gained a large lead(he won that tiebreak 7-1 or something like that). In the one moment when their 4 times champion needed a bit of support,because he could have pushed the match to 5 sets,the french chose not to give that support. Many commentators said on the spot how weird that moment was but they were probably *******s,right?

So Soderling eliminated Nadal. Does he receive a lot of love in the next rounds? Well not really,at least not like in the Nadal match. Then the final comes along. Soderling,the crowd favourite according to the underdog theory,is ignored by the crowd who turn to Federer,the huge favourite in that match. Besides soderling's box no one in that whole arena was rooting for Soderling,everybody wanted Fed to win. They cheered twice as hard for Fed's winners,gasped when Fed made errors and cheered on Soderling's mistakes. Kinda weird how they dumped the lovable underdog once their actual favourite player(fed) stepped on-court,isn't it? If they really liked Soderling,they would have pulled for him on that day but they didn't. They only turned to him when he got the job done,which was to take Nadal out.

But hey,who am I to accuse the crowd,right? Then again I trust McEnroe's words more than I trust some TW'ers who want to believe that Soderling was cheered on in RG because he was the underdog,not because the French wanted Nadal out.

boo hoo, when you win, the less fans are likely to embrace you. and if you win ugly, even less fans are likely to embrace you. sampras was never loved at wimbledon

[Aabye]

Originally Posted by theroleoftheunderdog

boo hoo, when you win, the less fans are likely to embrace you. and if you win ugly, even less fans are likely to embrace you. sampras was never loved at wimbledon

Very true, and any true professional wouldn't let it bother him/her unless the crowd gets out of hand.

[jamesblakefan#1]

Originally Posted by namelessone

The French giving zero support to Nadal has to do more with their general attitude than their supposed love for Soderling. Let's be honest for a second. Nadal never got much love in Paris,even though he is a 4 times champion there. The French(well actually the parisians not all the french) are snobs and they like their champions to play beautifully,which is pretty funny,since clay champions are usually grinders a la Nadal/Muster/Borg and so on.

There are several facts going against Nadal in his quest for the approval of the RG crowd:

-he's a grinder and the french like players with elegant game and strokes.

-he's Spanish and for all those who know European realities,know that there is a underlying rivalry between the French and Spanish in a lot of areas,not just sports. It's like this with all big,important countries who are neighbors. It's not easy to see how the Spanish own them in football(both in the national team and clubs),win their GS slam event year after year,hell even in cycling Contador won the Tour de France.

-he doesn't speak French and in France that helps. It's no coincidence that Federer and Henin are so loved over there and it's only natural because you can connect to the player better if he speaks your language.

The French crowd wanted Nadal to lose so that Federer could win RG. It's as simple as that really. McEnroe knows more about tennis than any of us and if even he thought this behaviour strange then there is something to it and I don't think he is a *******. And he is not the only commentator who has mentioned that this is weird.To put it into perspective for Fed fans,it's like Federer getting little to no support in USO when he is in trouble because the newyorkers wanted Nadal to finally win and get a Career Slam. That would be an abomination,because Fed has always had the crowd on his side at his favourite slams.

The underdog theory falls flat on its face and I will tell you why in a minute. If the french wanted a better quality upset they would have rooted for Nadal in the end of the 4th because a 5 setter is a better dethroning of a champion and they would have seen more thrilling tennis,because they would have made it to a deciding set. But,unbelievably,the crowd rooted for Soderling in the 4th set tiebreak,even after they guy had gained a large lead(he won that tiebreak 7-1 or something like that). In the one moment when their 4 times champion needed a bit of support,because he could have pushed the match to 5 sets,the french chose not to give that support. Many commentators said on the spot how weird that moment was but they were probably *******s,right?

So Soderling eliminated Nadal. Does he receive a lot of love in the next rounds? Well not really,at least not like in the Nadal match. Then the final comes along. Soderling,the crowd favourite according to the underdog theory,is ignored by the crowd who turn to Federer,the huge favourite in that match. Besides soderling's box no one in that whole arena was rooting for Soderling,everybody wanted Fed to win. They cheered twice as hard for Fed's winners,gasped when Fed made errors and cheered on Soderling's mistakes. Kinda weird how they dumped the lovable underdog once their actual favourite player(fed) stepped on-court,isn't it? If they really liked Soderling,they would have pulled for him on that day but they didn't. They only turned to him when he got the job done,which was to take Nadal out.

But hey,who am I to accuse the crowd,right? Then again I trust McEnroe's words more than I trust some TW'ers who want to believe that Soderling was cheered on in RG because he was the underdog,not because the French wanted Nadal out.

Great post.

[vive le beau jeu !]

Originally Posted by namelessone

-he's Spanish and for all those who know European realities,know that there is a underlying rivalry between the French and Spanish in a lot of areas,not just sports. It's like this with all big,important countries who are neighbors. It's not easy to see how the Spanish own them in football(both in the national team and clubs),win their GS slam event year after year,hell even in cycling Contador won the Tour de France.

honestly, i'd bet the french crowd was very happy to see contador beat their beloved armstrong !!!

of course there is some rivalry between neighbour countries, but i really think you overestimate it (and i'd think the rivalry is stronger with england, germany and italy).
i mean... let's face it, nadal being very antipathetic, his agressive antics, his ugly game, etc. are probably the main reasons. for instance, ferrero and moya were well appreciated despite winning...

but after all, i admit i can't really speak for the french crowd because i certainly hate nadal a lot more than they do...

oh and by the way... speaking french certainly didn't help leconte to be crowd-loved in 1988 !

[joeri888]

Originally Posted by vive le beau jeu !

honestly, i'd bet the french crowd was very happy to see contador beat their beloved armstrong !!!

They'd be more happy to see England bombing the Eifeltower than Armstrong winning another Tour

[Dilettante]

Originally Posted by vive le beau jeu !

of course there is some rivalry between neighbour countries, but i really think you overestimate it (and i'd think the rivalry is stronger with england, germany and italy).
i mean... let's face it, nadal being very antipathetic, his agressive antics, his ugly game, etc. are probably the main reasons. for instance, ferrero and moya were well appreciated despite winning...

but after all, i admit i can't really speak for the french crowd because i certainly hate nadal a lot more than they do...

oh and by the way... speaking french certainly didn't help leconte to be crowd-loved in 1988 !

OK, let's make clear this is just a sports matter, because I've been in France (and had a French girlfriend) and everyone there was always so nice to me. Heck, I even have close French relatives.

But in sports, some (or many) French sports fans don't like and never liked to see Spaniards winning the big French events, nor at Tour neither at Roland Garros. Always has been like this. Nothing to do with style or personality, it's just because they're Spaniards.

honestly, i'd bet the french crowd was very happy to see contador beat their beloved armstrong !!!

By pure coincidence I was in Paris when Contador won his previous Tour de France and went to the Champs Elisees to take a look to the trophy ceremony, and I could tell the French fans didn't love Contador at all. Don't tell me Contador has "aggressive antics" or "ugly game".

But, again, this is a SPORTS matter. I love going to France and French people is always very helpful to me when they realize I'm a Spaniard and not very good with French.

[kanamit]

Originally Posted by namelessone

The French giving zero support to Nadal has to do more with their general attitude than their supposed love for Soderling. Let's be honest for a second. Nadal never got much love in Paris,even though he is a 4 times champion there. The French(well actually the parisians not all the french) are snobs and they like their champions to play beautifully,which is pretty funny,since clay champions are usually grinders a la Nadal/Muster/Borg and so on.

There are several facts going against Nadal in his quest for the approval of the RG crowd:

-he's a grinder and the french like players with elegant game and strokes.

-he's Spanish and for all those who know European realities,know that there is a underlying rivalry between the French and Spanish in a lot of areas,not just sports. It's like this with all big,important countries who are neighbors. It's not easy to see how the Spanish own them in football(both in the national team and clubs),win their GS slam event year after year,hell even in cycling Contador won the Tour de France.

-he doesn't speak French and in France that helps. It's no coincidence that Federer and Henin are so loved over there and it's only natural because you can connect to the player better if he speaks your language.

The French crowd wanted Nadal to lose so that Federer could win RG. It's as simple as that really. McEnroe knows more about tennis than any of us and if even he thought this behaviour strange then there is something to it and I don't think he is a *******. And he is not the only commentator who has mentioned that this is weird.To put it into perspective for Fed fans,it's like Federer getting little to no support in USO when he is in trouble because the newyorkers wanted Nadal to finally win and get a Career Slam. That would be an abomination,because Fed has always had the crowd on his side at his favourite slams.

The underdog theory falls flat on its face and I will tell you why in a minute. If the french wanted a better quality upset they would have rooted for Nadal in the end of the 4th because a 5 setter is a better dethroning of a champion and they would have seen more thrilling tennis,because they would have made it to a deciding set. But,unbelievably,the crowd rooted for Soderling in the 4th set tiebreak,even after they guy had gained a large lead(he won that tiebreak 7-1 or something like that). In the one moment when their 4 times champion needed a bit of support,because he could have pushed the match to 5 sets,the french chose not to give that support. Many commentators said on the spot how weird that moment was but they were probably *******s,right?

So Soderling eliminated Nadal. Does he receive a lot of love in the next rounds? Well not really,at least not like in the Nadal match. Then the final comes along. Soderling,the crowd favourite according to the underdog theory,is ignored by the crowd who turn to Federer,the huge favourite in that match. Besides soderling's box no one in that whole arena was rooting for Soderling,everybody wanted Fed to win. They cheered twice as hard for Fed's winners,gasped when Fed made errors and cheered on Soderling's mistakes. Kinda weird how they dumped the lovable underdog once their actual favourite player(fed) stepped on-court,isn't it? If they really liked Soderling,they would have pulled for him on that day but they didn't. They only turned to him when he got the job done,which was to take Nadal out.

But hey,who am I to accuse the crowd,right? Then again I trust McEnroe's words more than I trust some TW'ers who want to believe that Soderling was cheered on in RG because he was the underdog,not because the French wanted Nadal out.

So not one person at the French Open cheered for Nadal's opponent because they wanted to support the underdog?

[namelessone]

Originally Posted by kanamit

So not one person at the French Open cheered for Nadal's opponent because they wanted to support the underdog?

Don't nitpick. You know what I mean. Soderling didn't get support like this in his own country,just as McEnroe said. Most of the people there wanted Nadal to lose. I'm sure some of them liked Soderling when they saw how well he played but most just wanted Nadal out,regardless of who did it. If Soderling was indeed the crowd favourite he would have been cheered on in the next matches but he wasn't,at least not like in the Nadal match.

As I have said the lovable underdog theory is crap and that was shown in the final. Soderling was a huge underdog against Federer,who made the previous 3 finals here and he was something like 0-10 against Fed,so he could have used all the support he could get. But in the final,from the first point,everyone cheered for Fed. They cheered when Fed made winners and when Soderling made errors because they wanted Fed to win. So Soderling wasn't that loved in France or they would have supported him till the end. Soderling just got the same love that any other player would have got if he had taken out Nadal at the French,because the parisians don't like Nadal.

@Dilletante,thanks for a balanced point of view,from someone who actually knows the relationship between the French and the Spanish.

[rafan]

Originally Posted by namelessone

The French giving zero support to Nadal has to do more with their general attitude than their supposed love for Soderling. Let's be honest for a second. Nadal never got much love in Paris,even though he is a 4 times champion there. The French(well actually the parisians not all the french) are snobs and they like their champions to play beautifully,which is pretty funny,since clay champions are usually grinders a la Nadal/Muster/Borg and so on.

There are several facts going against Nadal in his quest for the approval of the RG crowd:

-he's a grinder and the french like players with elegant game and strokes.

-he's Spanish and for all those who know European realities,know that there is a underlying rivalry between the French and Spanish in a lot of areas,not just sports. It's like this with all big,important countries who are neighbors. It's not easy to see how the Spanish own them in football(both in the national team and clubs),win their GS slam event year after year,hell even in cycling Contador won the Tour de France.

-he doesn't speak French and in France that helps. It's no coincidence that Federer and Henin are so loved over there and it's only natural because you can connect to the player better if he speaks your language.

The French crowd wanted Nadal to lose so that Federer could win RG. It's as simple as that really. McEnroe knows more about tennis than any of us and if even he thought this behaviour strange then there is something to it and I don't think he is a *******. And he is not the only commentator who has mentioned that this is weird.To put it into perspective for Fed fans,it's like Federer getting little to no support in USO when he is in trouble because the newyorkers wanted Nadal to finally win and get a Career Slam. That would be an abomination,because Fed has always had the crowd on his side at his favourite slams.

The underdog theory falls flat on its face and I will tell you why in a minute. If the french wanted a better quality upset they would have rooted for Nadal in the end of the 4th because a 5 setter is a better dethroning of a champion and they would have seen more thrilling tennis,because they would have made it to a deciding set. But,unbelievably,the crowd rooted for Soderling in the 4th set tiebreak,even after they guy had gained a large lead(he won that tiebreak 7-1 or something like that). In the one moment when their 4 times champion needed a bit of support,because he could have pushed the match to 5 sets,the french chose not to give that support. Many commentators said on the spot how weird that moment was but they were probably *******s,right?

So Soderling eliminated Nadal. Does he receive a lot of love in the next rounds? Well not really,at least not like in the Nadal match. Then the final comes along. Soderling,the crowd favourite according to the underdog theory,is ignored by the crowd who turn to Federer,the huge favourite in that match. Besides soderling's box no one in that whole arena was rooting for Soderling,everybody wanted Fed to win. They cheered twice as hard for Fed's winners,gasped when Fed made errors and cheered on Soderling's mistakes. Kinda weird how they dumped the lovable underdog once their actual favourite player(fed) stepped on-court,isn't it? If they really liked Soderling,they would have pulled for him on that day but they didn't. They only turned to him when he got the job done,which was to take Nadal out.

But hey,who am I to accuse the crowd,right? Then again I trust McEnroe's words more than I trust some TW'ers who want to believe that Soderling was cheered on in RG because he was the underdog,not because the French wanted Nadal out.

I cannot take on board this total lack of affection from the French for Nadal. For a start, his looks must have stirred the blood of many a young French girl(and not so young at that). His game may not be that of a ballerina but his incredible self control and demeanour on court puts him in a class ( and I mean 'class' )of his own. Nadal has already set an example to the young by showing how you can be successful, rich and still be true to yourself. It is impossible to get a crowd just to support one player. There will also be the people who attend just to stir things up for the sake of it. No I cannot believe that the majority of the French were anti - Nadal. It is just that some people can shout that bit louder!

[8PAQ]

Originally Posted by namelessone

The French giving zero support to Nadal has to do more with their general attitude than their supposed love for Soderling. Let's be honest for a second. Nadal never got much love in Paris,even though he is a 4 times champion there. The French(well actually the parisians not all the french) are snobs and they like their champions to play beautifully,which is pretty funny,since clay champions are usually grinders a la Nadal/Muster/Borg and so on.

There are several facts going against Nadal in his quest for the approval of the RG crowd:

-he's a grinder and the french like players with elegant game and strokes.

-he's Spanish and for all those who know European realities,know that there is a underlying rivalry between the French and Spanish in a lot of areas,not just sports. It's like this with all big,important countries who are neighbors. It's not easy to see how the Spanish own them in football(both in the national team and clubs),win their GS slam event year after year,hell even in cycling Contador won the Tour de France.

-he doesn't speak French and in France that helps. It's no coincidence that Federer and Henin are so loved over there and it's only natural because you can connect to the player better if he speaks your language.

The French crowd wanted Nadal to lose so that Federer could win RG. It's as simple as that really. McEnroe knows more about tennis than any of us and if even he thought this behaviour strange then there is something to it and I don't think he is a *******. And he is not the only commentator who has mentioned that this is weird.To put it into perspective for Fed fans,it's like Federer getting little to no support in USO when he is in trouble because the newyorkers wanted Nadal to finally win and get a Career Slam. That would be an abomination,because Fed has always had the crowd on his side at his favourite slams.

The underdog theory falls flat on its face and I will tell you why in a minute. If the french wanted a better quality upset they would have rooted for Nadal in the end of the 4th because a 5 setter is a better dethroning of a champion and they would have seen more thrilling tennis,because they would have made it to a deciding set. But,unbelievably,the crowd rooted for Soderling in the 4th set tiebreak,even after they guy had gained a large lead(he won that tiebreak 7-1 or something like that). In the one moment when their 4 times champion needed a bit of support,because he could have pushed the match to 5 sets,the french chose not to give that support. Many commentators said on the spot how weird that moment was but they were probably *******s,right?

So Soderling eliminated Nadal. Does he receive a lot of love in the next rounds? Well not really,at least not like in the Nadal match. Then the final comes along. Soderling,the crowd favourite according to the underdog theory,is ignored by the crowd who turn to Federer,the huge favourite in that match. Besides soderling's box no one in that whole arena was rooting for Soderling,everybody wanted Fed to win. They cheered twice as hard for Fed's winners,gasped when Fed made errors and cheered on Soderling's mistakes. Kinda weird how they dumped the lovable underdog once their actual favourite player(fed) stepped on-court,isn't it? If they really liked Soderling,they would have pulled for him on that day but they didn't. They only turned to him when he got the job done,which was to take Nadal out.

But hey,who am I to accuse the crowd,right? Then again I trust McEnroe's words more than I trust some TW'ers who want to believe that Soderling was cheered on in RG because he was the underdog,not because the French wanted Nadal out.

I like your posts. Once again, very good analysis.