tio old?

[LeeD]

Seriously....
I'm almost 63, have been working out with Cybex machines for 3 months, and some parts seem to be getting stronger, while other's, like my deltoids and pecs, seem to be almost regressing, but staying the same.
I work out 3 rotations per day, 3 days a week, and try to rest the 4 in between days. I usually push the weights for about 20 reps, maxing out as much as I can handle.
I seem to be just as unfit and skinny as before I started.
Am I too old to gain muscle mass?

[Maui19]

High reps tend not to build muscle mass.

I will get flamed big time for this, but it is true.

[chollyred]

Us old guys can build muscle mass just like the younger guys. It just takes us a little longer. If you're able to push 20 reps, you're not pushing enough weight. You should be lifting to exhaustion in about 8 reps. Push 8, rest a couple of minutes, push 6, rest, etc.

After 3 sets, should be feeling a good pump in your muscles. Then you'll really need the next day or two for rest.

Machines are good for specific muscles, but you really should go to free weights. Free weights help build the muscles that stabilize the muscle you're targeting. The machine does that stabilization for you.

Go slow and be careful not to hurt yourself. Build up to the 8 rep max. Start with a weight you can pump 12 times, then 10, then work your way down to your 8 rep max.

[maggmaster]

R2 got me reading this guys articles and they are really excellent. Here is a two part series that addresses most of your questions.

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/mus...ng-part-1.html

[BobFL]

Originally Posted by LeeD

Seriously....
I'm almost 63, have been working out with Cybex machines for 3 months, and some parts seem to be getting stronger, while other's, like my deltoids and pecs, seem to be almost regressing, but staying the same.
I work out 3 rotations per day, 3 days a week, and try to rest the 4 in between days. I usually push the weights for about 20 reps, maxing out as much as I can handle.
I seem to be just as unfit and skinny as before I started.
Am I too old to gain muscle mass?

You are lucky if you can maintain what you have. Sarcopenia is hard to beat, almost impossible. It can start very early in late 20s! The key parts are muscle activity and practice and quality food. After say 30, a man who doesn't do anything with their muscles loses between .5 and 1% of muscle mass and strength every year - that's a lot. Plus, naturally we are losing testosterone which is in positive correlation with our muscles. Tall order but it can be done with discipline and good food.

[Robbnc]

LeeD,


Go have your testosterone checked. And don't go to your regular doc, most will just tell you your T is normal if it makes the very bottom of the scale. Really at 63 , find your T level before you worry about wacky workout routines.

[charliefedererer]

Originally Posted by Robbnc

LeeD,


Go have your testosterone checked. And don't go to your regular doc, most will just tell you your T is normal if it makes the very bottom of the scale. Really at 63 , find your T level before you worry about wacky workout routines.

Why so quick to push for a test when he has been on an endurance rather than a strength or hypertrophy regimen?

I'll be interested in what others think, but I believe most of this testosterone buzz is fueled by those ready to take a pill/injection but not willing to actually work out and get in shape.

And there are plenty of quacks out there ready to prey on the unsuspecting - a quick goolge search will show a gaggle of "Dr. Feelgood" fountain-of-youth clinics.

And how about these side effects:
Fluid Retention
Liver Toxicity
Shriveled Testicles
Sleep Apnea
Tender Breasts or Enlargement of Breasts
Prostate Growth
Increased Red Blood Cell Concentration leading to heart attacks, strokes and blood clots
- http://www.andropausespecialist.com/...de-effects.php

[charliefedererer]

Originally Posted by BobFL

You are lucky if you can maintain what you have. Sarcopenia is hard to beat, almost impossible. It can start very early in late 20s! The key parts are muscle activity and practice and quality food. After say 30, a man who doesn't do anything with their muscles loses between .5 and 1% of muscle mass and strength every year - that's a lot. Plus, naturally we are losing testosterone which is in positive correlation with our muscles. Tall order but it can be done with discipline and good food.

So if Lee D works out and has a muscle hypertrophy rate of 15% this year, that will only result in a net increase of 14.0 -14.5%?

[charliefedererer]

LeeD you will never be too old.

At 63 you are just a kid.

And like any kid intent on keeping up with the other kids playing tennis and wind surfing, doing some work in the gym will keep you fitter to enjoy your activities.


Others have already posted the 20 rep sets are great for endurance, but not great for strength gains or muscle hypertrophy.


But your intuitive regimen so far is exactly what you needed to start to build a base to make the gains you seek.


If your goal is to get ready for tennis, you may want to consider this routine, and with the work you have already done, you probably now can move to phase 2, maximal tennis strength training:

"Phase 1 - Foundational Tennis Strength Training
•Duration: 6-8 weeks
•No. sessions: 2x week
•No. exercises: 10-12
•Resistance: 40-50% 1 Rep Max
•Repetitions: 12-15
•Rest between exercises: 90 secs
•Rest between circuits: 2-3 mins
•Speed of lifts: Smooth and controlled

Phase 2 - Maximum Tennis Strength Training
•Duration: 6 weeks
•No. sessions: 2-3x week
•No. exercises: 6-8
•Resistance: 80-90% 1 rep max
•Repetitions: 4-8
•No. sets: 3-4
•Speed of movements: Smooth/controlled

Phase 3 - Convert to Power & Strength Endurance
•Duration: 4-8 weeks
•No. sessions: 1-2x week
•No. exercises: 2-3
•Resistance: bodyweight
•Repetitions: 10-12
•Rest between exercises: 3-4 minutes
•Speed of movements: Explosive"

The reasoning behind the different routines and the workout details can be found at:
The Elite Approach to Tennis Strength Training http://www.sport-fitness-advisor.com...-training.html




If muscle hypertrophy really is your goal, rather than strength gains without bulk to keep you fast on the tennis court, maybe this is what you are looking for:

" Football Strength Training The Hypertrophy Phase
•Duration of Phase: 4-6 weeks
•Sessions per week: 2-4
•Load: 70-80% 1-RM
•No. Exercises: 6-9
•No. Reps per Set: 6-12
•No. Sets per Exercise: 3-6
•Rest between Sets: 2-4 minutes
•Rest between sessions: 48 hours
•Speed of Lifts: Moderate
This is a sample football strength training program to build size and bulk...
Why is substantial muscle mass important to footballers?
Firstly, larger muscles have a greater capacity for maximal strength. Size is not the only indicator of strength but it helps.
Secondly, as long as you can maintain your speed, the heavier you are the greater force and momentum you have - a must in contact sports like football and rugby."
- http://www.sport-fitness-advisor.com...-training.html


Of course in sunny San Diego there is no real "off-season" so you can extend the training regimens as long as you want, rather than having to compress them into a number of weeks to get ready for the next season. You can also cycle through the different regimens with different goals in mind.


I haven't seen a post yet except from chollyred decrying the use of "machines" rather than "free weights".
One appeal of the Cybex machines is that there is little fear of being injured by a weight falling on you.
But you may want to seriously consider the benfits of doing some of the classic exercises like the squat, deadlift and bench press.
The squat is the "king of exercises", and is particularly good for tennis players and wind surfers, because it not only strengthens the legs and core, but also the muscles that connect the legs and core in the back and the back of the abdomen that isolated machine exercises don't.
Also the squat sequentially works all of these muscles in a coordinated kinetic chain fashion, just like you would on a serve or in a hard lean on your board.
I kept hearing during her AO match last night how much Dominika Cibulkova squats - if she can benefit at 5'1", 121# so can you!

I talked to my Dad this morning - he was working out with his dumbells, and was going on the stationary bike as soon as my Mom got off. He played in his last singles tennis league when he was 79 - he still had good strokes, just felt his reaction time is too slow and more appropriate for doubles.

So like I said at the beginning of my post:

At 63 you are just a kid.

[LeeD]

Heartfelt THANKS for all of you who replied.
I just never worked out with weights successfully in my life, so even after reading lots of "theories", I can't put them into practice.
Now I've got to heal my two sprained ankles and a left medial strain, then it's to powerlifting wth moderate weight.
Cybex, I can lat pull over 170lbs 20 times, but barely chest press and shoulder press 30lbs 20 times.
Leg presses average 170 30 reps, but I haven't tried heavier because of my ankles and knee.
Most girls do better in bicepts, tris, and chest presses.
I'm buiilt wierd.

[LeeD]

And of course, still running away from the spectre of advancing age.
Really hurts to see something like a standing long jump decrease by over 40%, and football distance throws now down to 45 yards last try.
Is it really true we cannot revisit our pasts? Just doesn'st seem right.

[charliefedererer]

Originally Posted by LeeD

And of course, still running away from the spectre of advancing age.
Really hurts to see something like a standing long jump decrease by over 40%, and football distance throws now down to 45 yards last try.
Is it really true we cannot revisit our pasts? Just doesn'st seem right.

Seems like you are doing all right for yourself to me.

[beernutz]

Originally Posted by charliefedererer

Seems like you are doing all right for yourself to me.

Billionaires have it pretty good it would seem.

[chollyred]

Originally Posted by charliefedererer

I haven't seen a post yet except from chollyred decrying the use of "machines" rather than "free weights".
One appeal of the Cybex machines is that there is little fear of being injured by a weight falling on you.
But you may want to seriously consider the benfits of doing some of the classic exercises like the squat, deadlift and bench press.
The squat is the "king of exercises", and is particularly good for tennis players and wind surfers, because it not only strengthens the legs and core, but also the muscles that connect the legs and core in the back and the back of the abdomen that isolated machine exercises don't.
Also the squat sequentially works all of these muscles in a coordinated kinetic chain fashion, just like you would on a serve or in a hard lean on your board.
I kept hearing during her AO match last night how much Dominika Cibulkova squats - if she can benefit at 5'1", 121# so can you!

A good comparison of machine vs free weights by Rice University.
http://recreation.rice.edu/fitness/r...e_machine.html
It's been a contentious battle between weight lifters for years. In either respect, if you don't use it, you lose it.

Never had the desire to try kite boarding, but Charlie's last post just might do it! YOWZA!!!

[LeeD]

Kiteboarding seems to be for the young.
Windsurfing is for old farts.
In PuertoRico the last 3 weeks, actually saw plenty of girls hop onto a kiteboarder's back for a ride at OceanPark, SanJuan.
True, none were without suits, but that age group tends to favor the reckless.
She probably would have stayed on shore if the water temps were 55, the airs just below that.

[charliefedererer]

^^^Lee,
I saw your post in the ankle sprain thread today:
"I did exactly as the last picture "low ankle sprain" 4 years ago. I hasn't started to heal, but I could play serious singles and slow run. Swelling is below the inside ankle bone.
I did this again 2 weeks ago pushing my g/f into waves hoping to teach her to surf."
- http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=410802

SO THAT IS YOU IN THE PIC ABOVE!

Fedace swore it was you at Scripps Beach, and you know he is an irreproachable source. How could I have doubted?

[LuckyR]

Originally Posted by LeeD

Seriously....
I'm almost 63, have been working out with Cybex machines for 3 months, and some parts seem to be getting stronger, while other's, like my deltoids and pecs, seem to be almost regressing, but staying the same.
I work out 3 rotations per day, 3 days a week, and try to rest the 4 in between days. I usually push the weights for about 20 reps, maxing out as much as I can handle.
I seem to be just as unfit and skinny as before I started.
Am I too old to gain muscle mass?

What was your capacity to bulk up back in the day? This will speak to your genetics. Some are resistant to building mass, if you are one of them, then you have two strikes against you at this point. On the other hand if you lifted before and built up muscle mass easily, I would feel more confident you could do so again with optimal diet and perhaps a check of your androgen level (w/ appropriate supplementation, if low).