The Forehand: Busting misconceptions once and for all

[10isfreak]

Many of you might have encountered the tennisspeed blog. In there, we do not get served the usual beliefs we hear during all too many lessons... we are greated with hard science, with a big pile of evidence and repports that overviews some beliefs regarding tennis. The question is whether they are accurate in part, as a whole or if they are simply wrong.

I will just give you 3 key elements that he overviewed among others.

Your swing path prior contact mostly controls the ball's launching angle -- i.e., ceteris paribus, the more vertical your swing path, the higher the ball flies before starting to fall. As you can read, it's not the most determining factor in generating top spin.

The racket head is not perfectly vertical at contact, but is ideally tilted forward. Why? Because spin is about accelerating the edge of the ball and most of your energy is directed forward... so, trying to accelerate the upper edge of the ball should, in principle, capitalize on a lot of energy compared to trying to accelerate upward the edge that is behind the ball.

There is a direct relationship between spin production and how low the ball makes contact with the string bed. The racket is nearly horizontal during ground strokes, so low actually means near the side which is closest to the ground, not near the throat -- just to clear up the potential confusion. A low contact ensures the highest spin/pace ratio (that is, you get more spin, less pace this way).

Theoretical material and concepts are not purely useless, abstract things... If you actually know what pros do and how they do it, you're one step closer to doing it yourself: you just need to figure out how to incorporate these into your swing. From that point and on, you can go on the court knowing that you have a factually valid answer that is guaranteed to yield results. AND YOU GOT IT FOR FREE!

[10isfreak]

I will leave pictures or explanations on some subjects the host covers if someone asks for them, but I'd recommand reading the author who's quite a bit better than me at explaning what happens.

I hope that this sort out the confusion. Of course, feel free to leave comments or, after reading, express how your understanding evolve. You may as well comment about how it influenced your game play.


In my case, I never got to hit as hard, as well and with as much spin as when I have put all this into practice. And, as good coaches will tell you, spin is control... if you own spin production, you own the whole court. And it did help me kick the hell out of pushers once and for all.

[sureshs]

Originally Posted by 10isfreak

The racket head is not perfectly vertical at contact, but is ideally tilted forward

I have heard around 10 degrees. How do you reconcile that with your pics below? Is it that the racket face (in these cases) changes from vertical to slightly closed over the dwell time? Or the photos below are slightly before contact?

[5263]

Originally Posted by sureshs

I have heard around 10 degrees. How do you reconcile that with your pics below? Is it that the racket face (in these cases) changes from vertical to slightly closed over the dwell time? Or the photos below are slightly before contact?

Do you think you can tell the tilt from those photos?

[sureshs]

Originally Posted by 5263

Do you think you can tell the tilt from those photos?

Not with 100% confidence, no. The grip might give a clue.

Do you think they are tilted?

[5263]

Originally Posted by sureshs

Not with 100% confidence, no. The grip might give a clue.

Do you think they are tilted?

I would expect they are, but can't say from those pics...not that I can tell.

[arche3]

Originally Posted by sureshs

I have heard around 10 degrees. How do you reconcile that with your pics below? Is it that the racket face (in these cases) changes from vertical to slightly closed over the dwell time? Or the photos below are slightly before contact?

You can't tell because the view is from the back. And the height of the camera affects the perceived racket face angle as well. You don't need a physics degree to know that. There is no way to know. Has nothing to do with dwell time.

[dominikk1985]

the racket tilt is more to push a rising ball (early striking) down to flatten the path of the ball (since a rising ball tends to continue to rise after hitting the stringbed) not so much to create spin.

watch the same player hitting the ball on the drop and he will hit with the same spin but a vertical racket face. the other reason for the racket tilt is that the ball is below the racket center when it leaves the stringbed (not at the moment of initial strike as the tennisspeed guy claims!) because the stringbed brushes upwards. this causes the racket to tilt.

I think with his opinion that the racket tilt increases spin the tennisspeed guy is pretty much alone.

[sureshs]

Originally Posted by dominikk1985

the racket tilt is more to push a rising ball (early striking) down to flatten the path of the ball (since a rising ball tends to continue to rise after hitting the stringbed) not so much to create spin.

watch the same player hitting the ball on the drop and he will hit with the same spin but a vertical racket face. the other reason for the racket tilt is that the ball is below the racket center when it leaves the stringbed (not at the moment of initial strike as the tennisspeed guy claims!) because the stringbed brushes upwards. this causes the racket to tilt.

I think with his opinion that the racket tilt increases spin the tennisspeed guy is pretty much alone.

That is why it is so interesting to me. On most the non-flattening forehand slow motion vids I have seen, the racket face has been almost vertical, which tells me that the upward swipe is producing the spin.

But there are also shots hit by Roddick and Isner where they go over the ball with a markedly closed face, and finish around the waist on the other side.

So I think a closed face, especially with a W grip, can also be used to impart a lot of spin.

[10isfreak]

Originally Posted by dominikk1985

I think with his opinion that the racket tilt increases spin the tennisspeed guy is pretty much alone.

You gave an explanation and that's it. He tested 180 forehands of some of the best tennis players he could find, picture per picture at 210fps.

Who do you think we should listen to? The guy who has an opinion or the guy who has a tested opinion?

Evidence speaks loud; ideas, not so much.

[bad_call]

Originally Posted by 10isfreak

You gave an explanation and that's it. He tested 180 forehands of some of the best tennis players he could find, picture per picture at 210fps.

Who do you think we should listen to? The guy who has an opinion or the guy who has a tested opinion?

Evidence speaks loud; ideas, not so much.

this supports personal hitting results and now have outside analysis to support.

dude - u made my day. i'm ready for a beer.

[Cheetah]

Originally Posted by dominikk1985

I think with his opinion that the racket tilt increases spin the tennisspeed guy is pretty much alone.

No. This is fact.

[TennisCJC]

Originally Posted by Cheetah

No. This is fact.

I agree - I view it as a well accepted fact.

[10isfreak]

Originally Posted by Cheetah

No. This is fact.

Some people are doctrinaires. They just like their ideas, even when reality diverge from it.

[corners]

Originally Posted by dominikk1985

the racket tilt is more to push a rising ball (early striking) down to flatten the path of the ball (since a rising ball tends to continue to rise after hitting the stringbed) not so much to create spin.

watch the same player hitting the ball on the drop and he will hit with the same spin but a vertical racket face. the other reason for the racket tilt is that the ball is below the racket center when it leaves the stringbed (not at the moment of initial strike as the tennisspeed guy claims!) because the stringbed brushes upwards. this causes the racket to tilt.

You're correct that the closed racquet faces we see on the forehand in the pro game are primarily a response to counter balls on the rise. But closing the racquet face is also effective, and sometimes a requirement, to counter incoming balls with heavy topspin. If you hit a ball with heavy topspin at a wall the ball will bounce "up" off the wall. The same thing happens when a heavy topspinning ball bounces off a stringbed. Closing the racquet face also lowers the bounce trajectory when returning heavily spun balls.

I think with his opinion that the racket tilt increases spin the tennisspeed guy is pretty much alone.

Closing the racquet face unquestionably increases topspin, and will produce topspin even with a completely horizontal swingpath.

You can illustrate this using TW University's shot simulator.

[dominikk1985]

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Illustrated for you

[sureshs]

Originally Posted by dominikk1985

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Illustrated for you

Well, what you are showing is the reaction of the racket at impact which causes a tilt.

I think your point is that the racket face is not deliberately closed at impact, except for the cases when flattening is required.

[luvforty]

the face is always closed in relation to the initial launch angle, because the string bed 'gives' on contact (pocketing)... so at separation the ball leaves the lower part of the pocket which is looking UP.

same reason face is always open to the launch angle for slices, because the ball leaves the upper part of the pocket which is looking DOWN.

try hit a few balls with a smooth sheet of metal, you will understand. (very little pocketing, therefore the launch angle almost always square to the face)

[sureshs]

No luvforty, I don't agree with you about the last part. The open face in a slice is deliberate, not just a consequence of recoil.

[sureshs]

Check this out - face definitely slightly closed at impact

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...PaZj4yn00#t=3s