Southern Sectionals

[andfor]

Originally Posted by JuliusWinto

Wow, that's crazy that he is on two teams going to sectionals. Never heard of that before. That's not the guy I meant, though. I meant John D. F. They pulled him out to play in the final match of our group, instead of the state final. He beat a really good player in a tiebreak that I lost to.

I'm pretty sure JDF did not play college tennis. Where did he play?

Tennessee does not have anyone out of level.

[andfor]

Originally Posted by Tennis Phanatic

In my opinion this is what is ruining USTA league tennis, when USTA league officials look the other way instead of doing the right thing and at least trying to end obvious cases of sandbagging.

The 4.0 TN team is a perfect example of a team that pushes the rules as far as possible and no one does anything about it. They have players from three states (Tennessee, Arkansas and Kentucky) on the team, which should not be allowed, although it is not against the rules. This team already had one sandbagger (Stepehn Juel) get DQ'd, even though he did his best to stay down by retiring several matches he was winning. They also have another self-rated player (Michael Garner) who has only played 3 matches. You don't have to be a genius to figure out he is sandbagging and will probably destroy everyone at sectionals. This is a perfect example when USTA should step in and not allow this player to play at sectionals.

Stephan Juel played 4.5. He was hurt. One 4.5 match he barley completed due to injury. The only one he won he was cramping against an average 50 yr old + 4.5 at best. But you were there, right? So I'm sure you know best.

Michael has been bumped to 4.0. I'm sure you know him too and his playing ability.

File a protest if you're so sure of yourself. Let us know your results.

[rainman007]

Originally Posted by tennis_tater

I never said anything about Kentucky being “cheaters” and don’t know anything about their players or the Tennessee team or their players, or really any other teams in the Sectionals for that matter. All I know is that the Alabama player/captain who was posting on here last year made allegations about the Kentucky team they beat in the finals having improper self-ratings; however, as you said, and as I asked him last year, what does that say about the Alabama team since they beat the very Kentucky team he was complaining about???

As far as this year’s Kentucky team, I just said, on paper, they looked strong as they had a number of players who played at higher levels years ago (4.5/5.0) and then they had a self-rate, who had an odd score that makes it look like they were trying to protect him. Now, why some of those guys who used to play 4.5 and sometimes 5.0 are rated 4.0’s today, I don’t know. Maybe they got bumped down by the computer b/c they didn’t do well in those higher levels years ago. Maybe they were injured at some point and were granted medical appeals. Maybe they sat out of league for a couple of years and were able to re-rate two years ago before the USTA closed that loop-hole last year. Maybe there is some legitimate explanation why their “self-rate” player who won all of his 4.0 matches against 4.0’s lost 6-0, 6-0 to two 3.5’s. Whether he was trying to sandbag to protect his rating doesn’t necessarily mean that he is not a 4.0 player. I don’t know.
As far as the state with the most titles and “biggest dynasty cheater” over the past ten years, I looked at the past winners going back to 2002 and don’t think there is one “biggest dynasty cheater” out there.

2010 – Alabama defeated Kentucky in Southern finals and won the NC;
2009 – Arkansas defeated Kentucky in Southern finals and lost to the Eastern section team in the NC finals;
2008 – North Carolina defeated Alabama in the Southern finals and lost to So. Cal. and Caribbean at Nationals;
2007 – Louisiana defeated Kentucky in Southern finals and lost to No. Cal and Texas at Nationals;
2006 – Alabama defeated North Carolina in Southern finals and lost to No. Cal in Nationals;
2005 – Louisiana defeated Georgia in Southern finals and won the NC;
2004 - Kentucky defeated North Carolina in the Southern finals and lost to the Middle States and ******** at Nationals;
2003 – North Carolina defeated South Carolina in the Southern finals and lost to Southwest, Caribbean, and ****** at Nationals.

Looking at those statistics alone, Kentucky has made it to the finals 4 of the past 8 years. Louisiana, Alabama, and North Carolina have all won it twice. Alabama and Louisiana have won a NC, Ark. lost in the NC finals, and the other winners didn’t fair very well at Nationals.

interesting research thanks..

[rainman007]

Originally Posted by Tennis Phanatic

To continue my thoughts from my previous post, the 4.0 KY and TN teams will probably destroy most of the teams at sectionals because they know how to work the system and USTA officials don't do anything about it. I realize not everyone who plays USTA league tennis cares about advancing as far as possible, but most players do want to play competitive matches. It is no fun playing a match when you know you have no chance of winning. Over the past few years I have known personally and heard second-hand dozens of players who no longer play USTA league tennis because they are tired of the sandbagging that goes on with USTA continuing to do nothing about it. I think the problem will only get worse in the future as more and more players realize you can have fun playing tennis outside of USTA leagues.

Do you play on Louisiana or Georgia LOL i would guess Louisiana
kentucky is 0-2 and tennessee won a match that involved 4 tiebreaks... what are these other teams doing if its that close..

Looks like its gonna be Louisiana, Georgia, or Tennessee

but if kentucky and tennessee know how to "work" the system why is it in the last 8 years their combined southern championships thanks to research by tennis tater is a big fat 0...)COMBINED)
however Louisiana, Alabama, and North Carolina have 2 titles each in the last 8 years Alabama and Louisiana have won a national championship ????????????????????????????????

[SmackDown]

The Alabama 4.0 team from Huntsville is rolling again - just beat
a very good Louisiana team 4-1. Whoever they will meet in the Finals
better bring it bigtime or it's gonna get ugly.

[tennis_tater]

Originally Posted by SmackDown

The Alabama 4.0 team from Huntsville is rolling again - just beat
a very good Louisiana team 4-1. Whoever they will meet in the Finals
better bring it bigtime or it's gonna get ugly.

Bama is looking very good in the standings and are a very good team. But its not like they are blowing out the competition. And it hasnt "gotten ugly" with anyone in their division, I'm not sure why one would expect that to happen in the finals. They got 3 third set wins over Louisiana (with 4 matches going to 3 rd sets) and 2 third set wins against Kentucky. A few points here and there, they could have two losses. They even squeaked by Arkansas 3-2. Like I said, they are a very good team and it wouldn't surprise me if they won the tournament. But I'm sure whoever comes out of the other side will be a very good team as well and will push bama as the other teams have.

[tennis_tater]

Originally Posted by rainman007

Do you play on Louisiana or Georgia LOL i would guess Louisiana
kentucky is 0-2 and tennessee won a match that involved 4 tiebreaks... what are these other teams doing if its that close..

Looks like its gonna be Louisiana, Georgia, or Tennessee

but if kentucky and tennessee know how to "work" the system why is it in the last 8 years their combined southern championships thanks to research by tennis tater is a big fat 0...)COMBINED)
however Louisiana, Alabama, and North Carolina have 2 titles each in the last 8 years Alabama and Louisiana have won a national championship ????????????????????????????????

I'm not saying this years Kentucky did anything to "work the system" as they seemed on the same level as everyone else in division 1. And having seen all the 4.0 teams at sectionals this week, there hasn't been any team that I've seen where I thought there was improper ratings, or someone working the system.

[tennis_tater]

Originally Posted by tennis_tater

I'm not saying this years Kentucky did anything to "work the system" as they seemed on the same level as everyone else in division 1. And having seen all the 4.0 teams at sectionals this week, there hasn't been any team that I've seen where I thought there was improper ratings, or someone working the system.

However, I think Kentucky having 4 teams in the finals in past 8 years says something, and same for bama if another team from same club as last years national champs wins the tournament. Maybe these towns/clubs have guys who are more focused on recruiting with the one purpose to "go all the way" than maybe in some other areas. And maybe prior success by previous teams in their areas has fed into that. Or maybe their respective players are coming through in the clutch and winning key points in deciding 3rd sets.

[JuliusWinto]

I was looking up results for Memphis (They're leading their group), and so I decided to look at the leader from the other group, Alabama. I clicked on Butch Barker randomly, and he is listed as a 4.5 for some reason, even though he played a match at 4.0 sectionals today. Anybody know what's up with this?

[SmackDown]

Originally Posted by JuliusWinto

I was looking up results for Memphis (They're leading their group), and so I decided to look at the leader from the other group, Alabama. I clicked on Butch Barker randomly, and he is listed as a 4.5 for some reason, even though he played a match at 4.0 sectionals today. Anybody know what's up with this?

Very common situation - a player "qualifies" on
A Fall team as a 4.0 - year end ratings bump
Them up to a 4.5 rating. However - because they
Qualified when they were 4.0 they can
Play as 4.0

[tennis_tater]

Originally Posted by SmackDown

Very common situation - a player "qualifies" on
A Fall team as a 4.0 - year end ratings bump
Them up to a 4.5 rating. However - because they
Qualified when they were 4.0 they can
Play as 4.0

So the Bama team at sectionals won a league in fall of 2010 and some players got bumped at the year end ratings in November? I saw they had a number of 4.5's and just figured they had some sort of early start ratings.

[JLyon]

Originally Posted by tennis_tater

So the Bama team at sectionals won a league in fall of 2010 and some players got bumped at the year end ratings in November? I saw they had a number of 4.5's and just figured they had some sort of early start ratings.

GA is the same way, noticed for instance their 5.0 Team that won last year had two 5.5 players.

[tennis_tater]

Originally Posted by tennis_tater

Bama is looking very good in the standings and are a very good team. But its not like they are blowing out the competition. And it hasnt "gotten ugly" with anyone in their division, I'm not sure why one would expect that to happen in the finals. They got 3 third set wins over Louisiana (with 4 matches going to 3 rd sets) and 2 third set wins against Kentucky. A few points here and there, they could have two losses. They even squeaked by Arkansas 3-2. Like I said, they are a very good team and it wouldn't surprise me if they won the tournament. But I'm sure whoever comes out of the other side will be a very good team as well and will push bama as the other teams have.

Looks like Bama pulled out 2 more 3rd set victories this afternoon to take a 4-1 team win over Mississippi to advance to the finals out of Division 1 group play. Bama has definitely been clutch in the 3rd set TB the entire tournament. Sets up what appears to be a good final with Georgia, who I guess "upset" the Memphis team (based upon Memphis being dubbed a favorite).

[rainman007]

tennis tater i was quoting another guy about kentucky and tennesse working the system not you..


Looks like another year and no title for kentucky and tennessee who is ruining USTA tennis by "working the system"

they may be working it just not as good as the other 10 teams over the last 9 years

[tennis_tater]

Originally Posted by rainman007

tennis tater i was quoting another guy about kentucky and tennesse working the system not you..


Looks like another year and no title for kentucky and tennessee who is ruining USTA tennis by "working the system"

they may be working it just not as good as the other 10 teams over the last 9 years

Looks like Georgia ended up beating Alabama in the finals, 4-1, to win the men's 4.0.

As far as teams "working the system," again, seeing the players play in 4.0 this past weekend, I didn't really feel like there were under-rated players playing. However, I do think that the teams from Bama, and Georgia as well, may have a slight advantage over some of the other teams as both teams had a number of guys who are computer rated 4.5's following the Nov. 2010 year end ratings. However, b/c both Bama and Georgia do some sort of "early start" league's in the Fall, they are able to sneak some 4.5 guys into the championship levels. I'm not sure why Bama (or Georgia) needs to do some sort of early start league in the fall since the neither state has much of a winter. It looks like Bama even has a spring league. If the other states in the Southern section don't get the benefit of having 4.5's, Bama, and maybe Georgia, and whoever else does the early start, should send the teams that win the spring leagues who are playng under the current ratings. Looking at the results from both the first and second session, it looks like Alabama teams, as a whole, did extremely well....maybe having players a .5 level up gave them the slight advantage in some of these levels:

M 2.5 - Bama champion
M 3.0 - Bama champion
M 3.5 - Bama runner-up
M 4.0 - Bama runner-up
W 3.0 - Bama runner-up
W 4.0 - Bama champion

[HitItHarder]

Originally Posted by tennis_tater

Looks like Georgia ended up beating Alabama in the finals, 4-1, to win the men's 4.0.

As far as teams "working the system," again, seeing the players play in 4.0 this past weekend, I didn't really feel like there were under-rated players playing. However, I do think that the teams from Bama, and Georgia as well, may have a slight advantage over some of the other teams as both teams had a number of guys who are computer rated 4.5's following the Nov. 2010 year end ratings. However, b/c both Bama and Georgia do some sort of "early start" league's in the Fall, they are able to sneak some 4.5 guys into the championship levels. I'm not sure why Bama (or Georgia) needs to do some sort of early start league in the fall since the neither state has much of a winter. It looks like Bama even has a spring league. If the other states in the Southern section don't get the benefit of having 4.5's, Bama, and maybe Georgia, and whoever else does the early start, should send the teams that win the spring leagues who are playng under the current ratings. Looking at the results from both the first and second session, it looks like Alabama teams, as a whole, did extremely well....maybe having players a .5 level up gave them the slight advantage in some of these levels:

M 2.5 - Bama champion
M 3.0 - Bama champion
M 3.5 - Bama runner-up
M 4.0 - Bama runner-up
W 3.0 - Bama runner-up
W 4.0 - Bama champion

The Bama M 3.0 team was in our group at Sectionals. Honestly, they were just a solid team on all courts. All of their players would be what I consider competitive 3.5 level players or better, based on skill level. But only one of them has an early start rating of 3.5. Of course, there were around 3 self rated players (3.0 or lower) on the team that were awful good. But that is part of the game, especially when you get to the sectional level. I would say talent-wise, these guys were the best we played all year. They are a good team. Hope they do well at Nationals.

To compair, our team at sectionals were all computer rated 3.0s, and most of us have been playing together around three years. How the computer has left us all as 3.0s, I'll never know. We all are competitive in 3.5 matchs. We regualrly practice with with 4.0s without a real problem, at least in doubles and the level of our team as a whole is far above 3.0.

So I am not sure the early start leagues had much to do with the Alabama 3.0 M team win. But it is interesting that Alabama did so well overall across the NTRP level. Probably a coincidence, at least in our case, as they were (in my opinion) the best team on our level at Sectionals.

[tennis_tater]

Any teams punch their tickets to sectionals in mobile yet?

[coach k]

Arkansas evens 3.0, 4.0, 5.0 finished early this year (two weeks ago). The odd levels finish tomorrow.

[SmackDown]

Alabama 4.0 & 4.5 teams out of Huntsville
from the same club will be rolling through
State once again next weekend.
Next stop Sectionals in Mobile!

[tennis_tater]

I guess that 4.0 team from Huntsville is basically the same team, or those who didn't get bumped, from the team that got to the finals last year.

Anyone know what states got the 4.0 and 4.5 WC?