PV Audio's Playtest Thread

[fortun8son]

Was that an African swallow or a European... Argh!...
Sorry for the hijack.

"DINSDALE!"
Some of these posts do remind me of the Fish Slapping Dance

[Up&comer]

Your mother was a hamster, and your father smelled of elderberries. I fart in your general direction!

[mikeler]

Hitting with Archman from TTW tonight. I'll be using the Unifibre/B5E setup.

[pvaudio]

This'll be interesting to hear about

[Up&comer]

It'll be interesting to hear what you think, Mike.

[mikeler]

Originally Posted by pvaudio

This'll be interesting to hear about

This guy probably should be playing U&C and not me. I did some scouting on him and of the 15 or so USTA matches he has played at the 4.5/5.0/Open level, he is undefeated!

[Up&comer]

Originally Posted by mikeler

This guy probably should be playing U&C and not me. I did some scouting on him and of the 15 or so USTA matches he has played at the 4.5/5.0/Open level, he is undefeated!

Gonna need the extra power, eh?

[mikeler]

Originally Posted by Up&comer

Gonna need the extra power, eh?

I'm going to need a good serving night to hang with him.

[mikeler]

About last night, let's just say I normally only have 1 bagel for breakfast, not 2 for dinner. We played a practice set after that where I served well and he did not, so I had a set point but could not convert it. Guy just makes no unforced errors and can move you around.

Now to the gut/poly setup. It was very nice but I like the poly/gut setup best still. The serve is better with gut mains but volleys were not as good. Spin is better with the poly mains. Against a very consistent player, I needed to volley much better than I did last night. My flat forehand never really got going last night, could have been the opponent though so I'm not going to pin that on the setup just yet. Best thing about this setup is no elbow pain after the match or this morning.

[Up&comer]

Originally Posted by mikeler

About last night, let's just say I normally only have 1 bagel for breakfast, not 2 for dinner. We played a practice set after that where I served well and he did not, so I had a set point but could not convert it. Guy just makes no unforced errors and can move you around.

Now to the gut/poly setup. It was very nice but I like the poly/gut setup best still. The serve is better with gut mains but volleys were not as good. Spin is better with the poly mains. Against a very consistent player, I needed to volley much better than I did last night. My flat forehand never really got going last night, could have been the opponent though so I'm not going to pin that on the setup just yet. Best thing about this setup is no elbow pain after the match or this morning.

Interesting. You start to notice what separates a 4.5 and a 5.0 is consistency.

[mikeler]

Originally Posted by Up&comer

Interesting. You start to notice what separates a 4.5 and a 5.0 is consistency.

Another 5.0 I used to play had the exact same game style. On days were I was on, I could get close to taking sets off him.

[Up&comer]

Originally Posted by mikeler

Another 5.0 I used to play had the exact same game style. On days were I was on, I could get close to taking sets off him.

Yeah, then the difference between a 5.0 and a 5.5 is that the latter has some weapon that makes it tougher to dictate play. One you get past 5.0, it's te little things that make a big difference.

By weapon, I mean something that others don't have, wether it be speed (me), a huge serve, or a blazing forehand, it's just one thing that can put you up a level.

[RetroSpin]

Originally Posted by Up&comer

Interesting. You start to notice what separates a 4.5 and a 5.0 is consistency.

My experience is a bit different. I played a lot competitively as a 4.5. When I played 5.0's, the thing that always got me was the weight of shot, that and the added pop or kick on serves. I would find myself getting pushed around as points unfolded.

Of course, I am an oldtimer and had consistency drilled into me. Now, every 4.5 is probably trying to hit the cover off the ball. When they learn to keep it in play most of the time, they become 5.0's.

[mikeler]

Originally Posted by RetroSpin

My experience is a bit different. I played a lot competitively as a 4.5. When I played 5.0's, the thing that always got me was the weight of shot, that and the added pop or kick on serves. I would find myself getting pushed around as points unfolded.

Of course, I am an oldtimer and had consistency drilled into me. Now, every 4.5 is probably trying to hit the cover off the ball. When they learn to keep it in play most of the time, they become 5.0's.

If you look at the definition for 5.5, it is as follows:

This player has developed power and/or consistency as a major weapon. This player can vary strategies and styles of play in a competitive situation and hits dependable shots in a stress situation.

I think to some degree that is true with the 5.0 as well except I would remove the "and" part. They usually seem to have a heavy power game that is difficult to handle or incredible consistency.

[pvaudio]

I hate the NTRP rating descriptions because they're so vague. The interesting thing, however, is that with very few exceptions, a 30 yr old 5.0 player will easily handle even the best of the junior players. Why? I don't know exactly, but having hit against my former coach who was a top 5 D1 college player and is now in his 30s and my current coach who was a former professional, it's not the same league as even hitting against an incoming D1 player. In a match, the young gun will likely have the stamina to win, but the years of wisdom just create an extra....edge.

Perfect example: a kid who I used to play with as a junior (he was very good for his age, so he played with us older kids) is now a 4 star (maybe 5, not sure as I don't really care because he's a pompous ***** with even worse parents). He's coached by the guy who runs where I used to play (aka, said former coach's boss). He was a former ATP player, top 300 maybe. Played in some majors nonetheless. Anyway, he's now in his 40s, doesn't play competitively in the slightest, and spends most of the day doing administrative work or teaching classes to 3.0 ladies. He and his student decided to play three practice matches. The first two were against my former coach, and the last against his own. The first match went something like 7-6, 6-4 to my old coach. This was actually surprising because he stays in shape and can still do serious damage even to the best juniors he coaches.

Next match, 6-1, 6-1. Turns out, the first match was a complete learning experience only. In other words, he was just given opportunities to work on shots, but purposely not allowed to win. The second go around was legitimate. When he played his current coach "all-out", it was bagels and breadsticks in an order I can't remember. Regardless, these guys are old, used to be great, and yet can still toy with nationally ranked juniors. It's amazing to watch that ability: go from making a 3.5 player look good by keeping rallies going during a lesson to making a great junior look amateurish by doing the same thing: just keeping rallies going. It's that ability, I think, that separates you from being a junior to being a senior player.

[Torres]

Originally Posted by Up&comer

Interesting. You start to notice what separates a 4.5 and a 5.0 is consistency.

But consistency in the sense of consistently and constantly putting you under pressure throughout the match more than what you can consistently do to them.

I hit with the top guys at my club and everything they hit is a pressuring ball - and I mean everything - serves, returns, groundstrokes are 'big' all of the time. I can serve big but I can't "get to them" enough of the time with the rest of my game. There's nothing to tee off on as I'm on the defensive too much of the time. And they move so well, and never seem to tire.

Even playing against the #1 women's singles player at my club, every groundstroke she hits results in a pressuring ball. Consistently heavy, consistently deep. Her forehand is superb and yet she's skinnier than me and plays with a light stick than me. Just goes to show how much of a difference a lifetime of technique development and grooved mecahnics makes.

[TenFanLA]

Originally Posted by Torres

Even playing against the #1 women's singles player at my club, every groundstroke she hits results in a pressuring ball. Consistently heavy, consistently deep. Her forehand is superb and yet she's skinnier than me and plays with a light stick than me. Just goes to show how much of a difference a lifetime of technique development and grooved mecahnics makes.

Just goes to show you we spend WAY TOO MUCH time, money, energy, etc. on equipment such as rackets, strings, shoes, dampeners instead of working on the fundamentals. I, for one, am completely guilty.

[pvaudio]

Blah! Broke a string today playing against someone clearly better. It was illuminating though, as it showed just how offensive gut/co focus is. On defensive shots, the control just isn't as great.

[polytheist]

Originally Posted by pvaudio

Blah! Broke a string today playing against someone clearly better. It was illuminating though, as it showed just how offensive gut/co focus is. On defensive shots, the control just isn't as great.

Never thought about it this way, but i can relate. When using Scorpion i would laugh at the net man. With co-focus i feel pressured to pass. Not that i don't mind, but it's not the same invincible feeling that Scorpion provides.

I almost want to say - Scorpion allows you to aim for the lines, Co-Focus allows you to "aim" your power.

[pvaudio]

Originally Posted by polytheist

Never thought about it this way, but i can relate. When using Scorpion i would laugh at the net man. With co-focus i feel pressured to pass. Not that i don't mind, but it's not the same invincible feeling that Scorpion provides.

I almost want to say - Scorpion allows you to aim for the lines, Co-Focus allows you to "aim" your power.

Spot on. What hybrid were you using? I've converted too many people locally to WhisperTouch, so it's becoming a bit of an issue for me to use it myself aka pure money lost. I think I'm going to have to switch back to poly and multis.