Is Djokovic now in the tier with Becker, Wilander, Edberg? - Page 13

kiki · 04-07-2012, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by treblings

hey kiki, if i dream of vampires tonight, than it´s your fault

Don´t worry. The aussies wolves herd is there to protect you, led by their Alpha Rod Laver ( a disputed battle for leadership between Laver and Hoad)

5555 · 07-10-2012, 09:12 AM

Considering that jean pierre has not answered, it can be concluded that he lost the argument.

jean pierre · 07-10-2012, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5555

Considering that jean pierre has not answered, it can be concluded that he lost the argument.

??? If the question is "Who's the real n°1 in 1977", I answered many many many times, and so did many others people.

BauerAlmeida · 07-10-2012, 10:51 AM

Vilas was the N°1 in 1977. It's just common sense.

PrinceMoron · 07-10-2012, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BauerAlmeida

Vilas was the N°1 in 1977. It's just common sense.

But where would he have been without JL Clerc in the big one?

Aah, happy days..........

And this forum has been far too long without a photo of

OMG.................

5555 · 07-11-2012, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jean pierre

??? If the question is "Who's the real n°1 in 1977", I answered many many many times, and so did many others people.

Can provide a reliable source which states that most EXPERTS said that Villas was the real No. 1 in 1977? (I provided a reliable source which states that most experts said Borg was the real No. 1 in 1977).

Nadal_Power · 07-11-2012, 01:01 PM

Not again.. just not again

PrinceMoron · 07-11-2012, 02:23 PM

Sabatini was and always will be number one. How on earth can they justify giving equal prize money to men? Who cares about men's tennis, Vilas et al when there are better things in life?

NadalAgassi · 07-11-2012, 04:04 PM

I probably already answered this, but I think he is. In the tiers thread I put him in the same tier as them. None of these guys had a year like Djokovic's 2011, not even Wilander in 1988 as he wasnt anything dominant outside the slams, hence how he barely got to #1 over Lendl despite 3 slam wins. Djokovic was a better all surface player than any of them really too. I dont think any of them had a 6 year run of performances as consistently strong as Djokovic from 2007-2012 either.

timnz · 07-11-2012, 04:15 PM

Djokovic has only been a leading player since 2007 - that is not quite 5 years. Edberg was a leading player from late 1985 (won Australian Open beating Lendl in semi's and Wilander in the final) to late 1994 (qualified for end of year championships) - 9 years. Becker was a leading player for 11 years (Wimbledon 1985 to Season end championship 1996), Wilander (from French Open 1982 to US Open 198

- more than 6 years. So he is coming up on Wilander but still a fair way behind the others.

He has 5 slams, Becker & Edberg are on 6, Wilander on 7. Becker won many season end finals and made the final match in many others too - so he has a great indoor CV. Djokovic is just won 1 - but it is fair to note that Edberg and Wilander aren't ahead of Djokovic there.

So I think he is still a tad behind them - but not much.

NadalAgassi · 07-11-2012, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jean pierre

??? If the question is "Who's the real n°1 in 1977", I answered many many many times, and so did many others people.

I noticed in my poll of 2nd best clay courter of all time behind Nadal you voted Vilas. So I conclude from that you consider Vilas a better clay courter than Borg right.

Sorry couldnt help but asking.

kiki · 07-14-2012, 02:57 PM

He is not at Wilbeckberg trio´s level yet.Maybe he´ll get there, but not yet.

hoodjem · 07-16-2012, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by norcal

How many more weeks till Djoker can mathematically be knocked from #1? I imagine he will be near Edberg's total at a minimum.

Right now, Djoker 's reign halts with 53 weeks.

timnz · 08-13-2012, 05:35 PM

A way of measuring Djokovic against Becker, Wilander and Edberg is:

Slams + Season End Finals + Masters 1000 equivalents, with a weighting factor depending on the importance of the event ie 2 x for slams, 1.5 for Season end finals, 1 x for Masters 1000 equivalents

Djokovic = (5 x 2) + (1 x 1.5) + (12 x 1) = 23.5

Becker = (6 x 2) + (3 x 1.5) + (13 x 1) = 29.5

Wilander = (7 x 2) + (0 x 1.5) + (8 x 1) = 22

Edberg = (6 x 2) + (1 x 1.5) + (8 x 1) = 21.5

So by this it appears that Djokovic is slightly above Wilander and Edberg but behind Becker.

TeflonTom · 08-13-2012, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SusanDK

It's odd how Djokovic has seemingly done so much in such a short time, relative to Edberg, Becker and Wilander.

Wilander's first GS title was in 1982, last in 1988, with a total of 7 over seven years, and his 3 in one year were his last.

Edberg's first GS title was in 1985, last in 1992, for a total of 6 over eight years.

Becker's first GS title was in 1985, last in 1996, for a total of 6 over eleven years.

Djokovic doesn't look like he's done winning majors yet, so if he's not in the tier with these three yet, I have little doubt he will be.

its not odd coz the top players r in contention for more slams more often due 2 surface homogenization

in 20 yrs, every player who has spent any amt of time near the top of the rankings since the mid-2000s will have a djoko-like slam record n we will realize that they aint worth as much as they used to be

hoodjem · 08-14-2012, 07:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5555

Can you find one reliable source which claims that Vilas was undisputed No. 1? There many reliable sources which claim that Djokovic is undisputed No. 1 http://www.anywhere.me/gresult?sourc...ed 2011&page=1

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5555

Can you find a reliable source which claims that Vilas was undisputed No. 1 in 1977? If you can't, you lost the argument.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5555

You have not provided a reliable source which claims that Vilas was undisputed No. 1 in 1977. World Tennis just claims that in its opinion Vilas was No. 1. in that season.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5555

World Tennis is a reliable source. Does it claim that Vilas was undisputed No. 1 in 1977? No, it does not.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5555

Considering that you did not prove that Vilas was undisputed No. 1 in 1977, it can be concluded that you lost the argument.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5555

Can you provide a reliable source which says that "it's generally agreed that Vilas is n°1 in 1977"? Yes or no?

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5555

Can you provide a reliable source which says that Vilas was undisputed No. 1 in 1977? Yes or no?

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5555

2. You have not provided a reliable source which says that "it's generally agreed that Vilas is n°1 in 1977"

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5555

Can provide a reliable source which states that most EXPERTS said that Villas was the real No. 1 in 1977? (I provided a reliable source which states that most experts said Borg was the real No. 1 in 1977).

Is this an obsession?

Nadal_Power · 08-14-2012, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by timnz

A way of measuring Djokovic against Becker, Wilander and Edberg is:

Slams + Season End Finals + Masters 1000 equivalents, with a weighting factor depending on the importance of the event ie 2 x for slams, 1.5 for Season end finals, 1 x for Masters 1000 equivalents

Djokovic = (5 x 2) + (1 x 1.5) + (12 x 1) = 23.5

Becker = (6 x 2) + (3 x 1.5) + (13 x 1) = 29.5

Wilander = (7 x 2) + (0 x 1.5) + (8 x 1) = 22

Edberg = (6 x 2) + (1 x 1.5) + (8 x 1) = 21.5

So by this it appears that Djokovic is slightly above Wilander and Edberg but behind Becker.

Can we rank Masters Cup that djokovic won equal with amazing Masters Cups from the 80's.. with true Indoor players? And that's just one example

BauerAlmeida · 08-14-2012, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by timnz

Djokovic has only been a leading player since 2007 - that is not quite 5 years. Edberg was a leading player from late 1985 (won Australian Open beating Lendl in semi's and Wilander in the final) to late 1994 (qualified for end of year championships) - 9 years. Becker was a leading player for 11 years (Wimbledon 1985 to Season end championship 1996), Wilander (from French Open 1982 to US Open 198

- more than 6 years. So he is coming up on Wilander but still a fair way behind the others.

He has 5 slams, Becker & Edberg are on 6, Wilander on 7. Becker won many season end finals and made the final match in many others too - so he has a great indoor CV. Djokovic is just won 1 - but it is fair to note that Edberg and Wilander aren't ahead of Djokovic there.

So I think he is still a tad behind them - but not much.

Not 5 years??

2007
2008
2009
2010
2011
2012 (he'll end N°4 in worst case scenario and probably 1 or 2).

That's 6 years as a TOP 3

How many years did SE, BB, and MW end that high? It's probably pretty close. Of course they have more years as a TOP 10 if they already finished their careers and Djokovic is only 25.

07-10-2012, 10:51 AM	#244
BauerAlmeida Semi-Pro Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Argentina Posts: 566	Vilas was the N°1 in 1977. It's just common sense. __________________ There's no Dark Side of the Moon really, matter of fact it's all dark.

07-11-2012, 04:04 PM	#249
NadalAgassi Legend Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 9,585	I probably already answered this, but I think he is. In the tiers thread I put him in the same tier as them. None of these guys had a year like Djokovic's 2011, not even Wilander in 1988 as he wasnt anything dominant outside the slams, hence how he barely got to #1 over Lendl despite 3 slam wins. Djokovic was a better all surface player than any of them really too. I dont think any of them had a 6 year run of performances as consistently strong as Djokovic from 2007-2012 either. __________________ TMF on Jan. 2011- Serena is washed up for good, TMF in Oct. 2009- Nadal has won his final slam, TMF in 2011- Woz will beat Serena at U.S Open

07-11-2012, 04:15 PM	#250
timnz Hall Of Fame Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 2,625	Lots of factors Djokovic has only been a leading player since 2007 - that is not quite 5 years. Edberg was a leading player from late 1985 (won Australian Open beating Lendl in semi's and Wilander in the final) to late 1994 (qualified for end of year championships) - 9 years. Becker was a leading player for 11 years (Wimbledon 1985 to Season end championship 1996), Wilander (from French Open 1982 to US Open 198 - more than 6 years. So he is coming up on Wilander but still a fair way behind the others. He has 5 slams, Becker & Edberg are on 6, Wilander on 7. Becker won many season end finals and made the final match in many others too - so he has a great indoor CV. Djokovic is just won 1 - but it is fair to note that Edberg and Wilander aren't ahead of Djokovic there. So I think he is still a tad behind them - but not much.

07-14-2012, 02:57 PM	#252
kiki G.O.A.T. Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 10,482	He is not at Wilbeckberg trio´s level yet.Maybe he´ll get there, but not yet. __________________ " I have watched plenty of matches of the 70´s and 80´s" ABMK, the historian

08-13-2012, 05:35 PM	#254
timnz Hall Of Fame Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 2,625	Top 3 events weighted A way of measuring Djokovic against Becker, Wilander and Edberg is: Slams + Season End Finals + Masters 1000 equivalents, with a weighting factor depending on the importance of the event ie 2 x for slams, 1.5 for Season end finals, 1 x for Masters 1000 equivalents Djokovic = (5 x 2) + (1 x 1.5) + (12 x 1) = 23.5 Becker = (6 x 2) + (3 x 1.5) + (13 x 1) = 29.5 Wilander = (7 x 2) + (0 x 1.5) + (8 x 1) = 22 Edberg = (6 x 2) + (1 x 1.5) + (8 x 1) = 21.5 So by this it appears that Djokovic is slightly above Wilander and Edberg but behind Becker.