Soft Poly's that are easy on the arm

[Sander001]

Originally Posted by ChicagoJack

Torres,

I completely agree. Even at 16g it's Dunlop Black Widow by a country mile. No contest at all. Been playing with the 18 gauge at 54 lbs in a Donnay Pro One, and its pretty effing sweet. Soft or no soft, I prefer it performance wise to my last textured poly fave, BHBR. I know you aren't big on lab testing, but in this case, the available test results agree with you. I've provided a cross section of the strings mentioned in this thread, the whole enchilada can be reconstructed here. Thought I'd share with the thread fwiw. BTW... how's your achilles tendon holding up?

-Jack

Ah good ol' Cyberflash, the forgotten string of yesteryear. Topspin Cyberflash 17L is even softer, measuring 158.3lbs in stiffness. Used to be pretty popular, I wonder if anybody still plays with it.

[ChicagoJack]

Originally Posted by Sander001

Ah good ol' Cyberflash, the forgotten string of yesteryear. Topspin Cyberflash 17L is even softer, measuring 158.3lbs in stiffness. Used to be pretty popular, I wonder if anybody still plays with it.

Hi Sander,

Yeah cool thanks for the info, 17L Cyberflash does look pretty decent. I get the same 158.3., ranked 46th of all stringbeds. But, the smaller gauges are always softer. To keep a level playing field, apples to apples comparison, I've only cross reffed and posted 16g. Cyberflash 16 comes in at #224, 199.5 lbs stiffness, quite a big gap btwn Black Widow 16 at #64 and 164 lbs stiffness. I know this is just lab data, not the court, but its just an observable fact that of all the strings tested (and there are quite a few not not tested) Black Widow is the softest mono poly.

Having said that I always take this lab test stuff with a grain of salt, as most people do. For instance you'll notice that Black Widow shares the same airspace as TF x-1 Bi Phase 16 at the 80th spot. That's just effing goofy. String properties are complex, not easily nailed down as much as we try to figure out this stuff.

Jack

[scotus]

Originally Posted by ChicagoJack

Torres,

I completely agree. Even at 16g it's Dunlop Black Widow by a country mile. No contest at all. Been playing with the 18 gauge at 54 lbs in a Donnay Pro One, and its pretty effing sweet. Soft or no soft, I prefer it performance wise to my last textured poly fave, BHBR. I know you aren't big on lab testing, but in this case, the available test results agree with you. I've provided a cross section of the strings mentioned in this thread, the whole enchilada can be reconstructed here. Thought I'd share with the thread fwiw. BTW... how's your achilles tendon holding up?

-Jack

Sorry to bring back up this slightly dated thread.

But it seems that Dunlop Black Widow has been retested by TW University, and different numbers are showing with the new stiffness rating much higher than before.

With medium tension and medium swing speed, I am getting the stiffness of 220 for the 16 gauge.

Even on the arm-friendliness ranking, Black Widow seems to have gone down quite a bit with stiffness rated at 193.

Does anyone know whether Black Widow has been reformulated recently? Or how else to interpret this change?

[maxpotapov]

Originally Posted by scotus

Sorry to bring back up this slightly dated thread.

But it seems that Dunlop Black Widow has been retested by TW University, and different numbers are showing with the new stiffness rating much higher than before.

With medium tension and medium swing speed, I am getting the stiffness of 220 for the 16 gauge.

Even on the arm-friendliness ranking, Black Widow seems to have gone down quite a bit with stiffness rated at 193.

Does anyone know whether Black Widow has been reformulated recently? Or how else to interpret this change?

This is very interesting, thanks!

[Sander001]

In your face, ChicagoJack! JK, I appreciate the info and as you say it's all just lab testing anyway.

Originally Posted by scotus

Sorry to bring back up this slightly dated thread.

But it seems that Dunlop Black Widow has been retested by TW University, and different numbers are showing with the new stiffness rating much higher than before.

With medium tension and medium swing speed, I am getting the stiffness of 220 for the 16 gauge.

Even on the arm-friendliness ranking, Black Widow seems to have gone down quite a bit with stiffness rated at 193.

Does anyone know whether Black Widow has been reformulated recently? Or how else to interpret this change?

Good eye! I copied the TWU string database some time ago for my own reference and notes now I am seeing some differences. Competition 1.20 is 3lbs softer on the current chart for example.
Astonishingly, MSV Focus Hex 17L has gone from a very soft 208 to an armbreaking 242 now! WHOA
But now its total tension loss is an amazingly low 15lbs whereas before it was 27lbs.

And RPM Blast is now showing tension loss of only 10.8lbs, which is like natural gut territory.
[For reference, I always use high tension and fast swing speed.]

I wonder if the person or people in charge could shed some light on what the story is.

[ChicagoJack]

Sander - Yeah man, looks like The TW Professor just threw me under the bus! Ha Ha.

Andrew - Cool, thanks for the email heads up to bring me back here. That's really weird. I've no clue what the deal is on the data change. Just for a cross reference I checked the other source for this kind of stuff, USRSA / RSI Magazine. Found it in the Non-Member Freebie section, so I'm comfy re-posting here. Just a side note: Head FXP Tour is a multifilament (construction) poly (material) string.

http://www.racquetsportsindustry.com...ctor_2012.html



-Jack

[Lilguy1456]

I think the NXt control debate can be settled by answering this:

If you eat a donut that's coated in sh!t, are you eating a donut or eating sh!t?

[nalvarado]

Polystar Energy has my vote. Was able to play well after coming back from physical therapy on my shoulder.

[Torres]

Originally Posted by scotus

Sorry to bring back up this slightly dated thread.

But it seems that Dunlop Black Widow has been retested by TW University, and different numbers are showing with the new stiffness rating much higher than before.

With medium tension and medium swing speed, I am getting the stiffness of 220 for the 16 gauge.

Even on the arm-friendliness ranking, Black Widow seems to have gone down quite a bit with stiffness rated at 193.

Does anyone know whether Black Widow has been reformulated recently? Or how else to interpret this change?

This is why I don't treat lab data as an absolute. You change the methodology or the testing equipment, and you'll get different results. You also need to bear in mind that TW data often throws up quite a few anomalies. In the 'spin potential' section for example, the number data suggests (wrongly) that various synthetic guts produce more spin potential than numerous well known polys including Alu Rough, BHBR etc. Anyone who's played with those strings know that that's simply not the case.

Black Widow is a very comfortable, soft, super arm friendly poly. That's all I can say. It also plays and performs well in addition to arm comfort.

And lets not forget that TW's Andy Gerst had to up the tension noticeably before he got a tension that he preferred. You simply wouldn't do that if it was a stiff poly. And that's real world testing - which is what we're really interested in - and his comments about string comfort, super soft, super comfortbale, a 'poly for the people' etc. And let's not forget that this is a guy who was rated around ATP#1400 last year - he's no mickey mouse player we're talking about here.

http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/prod...ml?pcode=DBW17

Data has its place, but in this context it should be treated a guide for a wise, rather than an absolute given the potential for experimental bias, methodological weakness etc.

[TonyB]

Originally Posted by nalvarado

Polystar Energy has my vote. Was able to play well after coming back from physical therapy on my shoulder.

You just *know* I'll agree with this. I've been touting PS Energy for a while around here. I can't get enough of the stuff. It's a wonder-string. Soft, comfortable, ridiculous spin, good power, but offers incredible feel. I can honestly say my touch shots are better than they've ever been, even with natural gut. And it never, EVER, hurts my arm/wrist/shoulder/elbow.

[scotus]

Originally Posted by TonyB

You just *know* I'll agree with this. I've been touting PS Energy for a while around here. I can't get enough of the stuff. It's a wonder-string. Soft, comfortable, ridiculous spin, good power, but offers incredible feel. I can honestly say my touch shots are better than they've ever been, even with natural gut. And it never, EVER, hurts my arm/wrist/shoulder/elbow.

Tried it back when Wonder Toy was singing its praise.

It was incredibly soft, but I didn't find its performance as good as it was touted.

But I will test Black Widow maybe in the next couple of weeks.

[TonyB]

Originally Posted by scotus

Tried it back when Wonder Toy was singing its praise.

It was incredibly soft, but I didn't find its performance as good as it was touted.

But I will test Black Widow maybe in the next couple of weeks.

Of course, everyone promotes their favorite string. I guess I'm no different. Tour Bite, PHT, Black Magic, etc. all l had their day around this forum. Granted, PS Energy is probably not for everyone, and I'm absolutely certain it won't work in every frame at every tension. But for me and my playing style, with my frame (and actually a couple other frames that I've tried it in), it's an amazingly awesome string that does practically everything I could ask from it, except for the fast tension loss.

I guess if I strung it up at high tensions and had a different playing style, I might not like PS Energy as much as I currently do. But I'm loving it now and it has gotten rave reviews from a whole lot of people, so it must have *something* going for it.

I'm curious why you didn't think it was all it's cracked up to be?

[scotus]

Originally Posted by TonyB

Of course, everyone promotes their favorite string. I guess I'm no different. Tour Bite, PHT, Black Magic, etc. all l had their day around this forum. Granted, PS Energy is probably not for everyone, and I'm absolutely certain it won't work in every frame at every tension. But for me and my playing style, with my frame (and actually a couple other frames that I've tried it in), it's an amazingly awesome string that does practically everything I could ask from it, except for the fast tension loss.

I guess if I strung it up at high tensions and had a different playing style, I might not like PS Energy as much as I currently do. But I'm loving it now and it has gotten rave reviews from a whole lot of people, so it must have *something* going for it.

I'm curious why you didn't think it was all it's cracked up to be?

I was generating far more spin with Lux M2 Pro than with Poly Star Energy or Turbo.

M2 Pro also had a crisper feel to it and better control although it was rendered unplayable after 2 outings.

But Poly Star definitely had the edge on softness.

[fortun8son]

Don't forget that RSI/USRSA tests at 62lbs for conformity.
How many people realistically play poly at this tension?

[Sander001]

Originally Posted by fortun8son

Don't forget that RSI/USRSA tests at 62lbs for conformity.
How many people realistically play poly at this tension?

Not trying to be snide, but what's your point?

[Torres]

Originally Posted by fortun8son

Don't forget that RSI/USRSA tests at 62lbs for conformity.
How many people realistically play poly at this tension?

It's just a reference point. But its a necessary one because all their historical string tests including natural gut, synthetic gut etc, have been done at that tension. If you change the reference tension, you can't make comparison between the stiffness of different strings.

[BabolatTennis9]

pros pro strategem is the best

[Jazo]

Luxilon Big Banger Ace 18

[Rabbit]

Originally Posted by finalfantasy7

Beast xp, out of the ones I've tried

+1 - I strung up a set of Luxilon Timo 18 that I had laying around and hit with it for a couple of hours, drilling. The next day my arm was very fatigued.

I did the same with the Beast 17, and no ill effects at all. It is just plain plush, great control, great spin and better power than most any poly I've tried in the past.

I am going to also give Beast Attack 17 a try. And, I'm going to order some Isospeed Pulse as it's supposed to be the same thing as Beast for about half price. Has anyone used Pulse?

[COPEY]

Hey Rabbit, did you string both at the same tension? Just curious.