"So you only play 5.0?"

[Sumo]

Originally Posted by sureshs

Do most juniors even know about NTRP ratings? I find it strange that any of them would make fun of 5.0s. Adults are usually not on their radar screen at all. The juniors I have played with have always been super respectful to me.

I wouldn't be surprised if high level jrs. know about the ratings.

I imagine it's difficult for them to find a lot of playing partners, forcing them to look to adults. The ratings would be a quick and easy barometer to use.

[Mongolmike]

In my experience they are aware of ratings vs rankings because they usually hit with a variety of club pros... who have ratings. Most larger clubs have a wider variety of pros rated from 4.0s to 5.5s and higher... so in conversation I'm sure the juniors know the difference between their rankings and an adults rating.

Let alone if they've played in tournaments with adults the juniors have to play in the Open division (at least in this area), and some of the adults are playing up into the Open draw if there isn't a draw for their rank because of not enough participants (not enough 4.5's to fill a draw, they get bumped up into the next highest draw). So I think most of the kids know.

[LeeD]

I'm with Suresh.
No way a junior who might be a Number 1 singles in high school can go far in A/Open events. He might beat guys who don't belong there, like 4.5's who want to see how their game matches up, and they might beat another junior, but any experience adult would kill them 2's foreever.
Adult 5.0 is playing against experienced (more than 5 years of competitive tennis) full grown MEN, who can place serves, are not afraid of hitting head high topspin shots, and can volley and overhead better than anyone in juniors.
I played the #2 Junior in Peru, a then 16 year old, 5'11" and 170lbs. He was visiting CalBerkeley for a look at the campus. He crushed me, 2 and 2, but I was never better than 4.5, was over 55 at the time, and I could easily have taken more games if my ad court play was better. We played at least 6 doubles matches in the previous week, very evenly played.
I played the #4 singles player from DomincanCollege when I was maybe 45, almost 20 years after I made 4.5. He WON the junior Wimbledon the year before, and the match setup was via the coach, who wanted him to face a real lefty serve (he was lefty also). Very close match, him winning straight sets.
A full grown man who has tennis experience is not intimidated by little kids (under 17), no matter how hard they hit topspin groundies. Their serves and volleys are lacking, they don't position well at net, don't like to face skidding slices, and usually don't take practice matches seriously.
OTOH, now that I'm 63, I'm sure any top junior can hand me double bagels.

[Timbo's hopeless slice]

A 'Top Junior' isn't going to be messing about with HS tennis, Lee!

Maybe I'm spoilt since our top juniors are top 50 ITF kids, I don't think the number 1 player from Peru is at quite that level...

[LeeD]

As you well know, it's a question of matchups.
The majority of juniors play a strong hitting baseline game, from both wings, have superior speed, and excellent endurance. Most, not all, have somewhat weak serves for their tennis ability.
Adults often are out of shape, might slice more on backhands, usually have much better net play (talking 5.0, or A/Open levels), have played more top players than any junior has seen, serves bigger, uses smarter tactics, but don't nearly match up in baseline bashing consistency skills.
So, which adult 5.0 is facing the top junior today?
Which junior is facing the 5.0 men's player, who can serve into the 130's, and run like TonLars?
And throw in the lefty angle, either side. And how wisely they serve?
As we all know, a 5.0 player can beat one top level junior, then lose bagels to another.
As we all know, a top junior can beat one top level Men's 5.0, and lose bagels to another.

[Timbo's hopeless slice]

ye, fair enough

I have played one young guy a couple of times, but he is quite tall and strong so he serves big, and he is keen on doubles, so he can volley.

and yes, he beats me pretty easily, lol!

he has his first senior ATP point (as of September) and is, umm, 60 something on the ITF Juniors..

[LeeD]

Back when I was playing OK and maybe 27 years old, I played a junior named HermanBauer from MillValley, in the HarborPointOpen. He was maybe 6'2" and 180lbs., served me right off the map (0 and 5), and was nothing like the juniors who I'd played in the previous tourneys.
Yes, those juniors do indeed exist. OTOH, he was also the only junior to make it to the 3rd round of A/Open in that tournament, a pretty big draw A. I left after that match to lick my wounds, and did not pedal back the next day to see how he would have done.

[sureshs]

I have played many people in many places, but they had spaces between the first and last names.

[SoBad]

Back in the 1920's we used to hang around with DonBudge and WillTilden at speakeasies all over Charleston, SC.

[sureshs]

Originally Posted by SoBad

Back in the 1920's we used to hang around with DonBudge and WillTilden at speakeasies all over Charleston, SC.

These days it is all about AndyMurray and NovakDjokovic at the USOpen and whether RafaNadal will come back for the AustralianOpen and if RogerFederer has anything LeftInTheTank

[SoBad]

Originally Posted by sureshs

These days it is all about AndyMurray and NovakDjokovic at the USOpen and whether RafaNadal will come back for the AustralianOpen and if RogerFederer has anything LeftInTheTank

Butthey havethe London/Peking WTF where the real player play inthedoor?~?

[LeeD]

Ah, the youth of today.....
They think they are living on the discovering edge of life, every new experience a new experience for mankind in general.
If you don't learn from previous mistakes, if you don't learn from history, you will be doomed to repeat the mistakes of your elders.

[SoBad]

Young ppl are a bit disgusting in their ignorance these days. They should be required to read at least one book by MartinNavratilov by age 5. That's what summers are for.

[LeeD]

Did Martina start writing before age 5?
I'd rather read a book by BobbyRiggs, or one of the Pancho's, or AltheaG.

[SoBad]

Martina was detained with a gun at LAX. She should have just carried a pipe instead.

[arche3]

Originally Posted by LeeD

Back when I was playing OK and maybe 27 years old, I played a junior named HermanBauer from MillValley, in the HarborPointOpen. He was maybe 6'2" and 180lbs., served me right off the map (0 and 5), and was nothing like the juniors who I'd played in the previous tourneys.
Yes, those juniors do indeed exist. OTOH, he was also the only junior to make it to the 3rd round of A/Open in that tournament, a pretty big draw A. I left after that match to lick my wounds, and did not pedal back the next day to see how he would have done.

Lol too old to hit the space bar?

[Bobby Jr]

Originally Posted by Fuji

Any who, just wanted to share, that no matter how good you think you are, there is a 14 year old girl who is probably better then you at it! :lol

And similarly, no matter how good a 14 year old girl or boy think they are, there is a 45 year old old-timer with a bung knee who can make them look clueless on a tennis court.

A club I played earlier this year had one of the top juniors in the country - a 16 year old winning tournaments left right and centre. Club champs time he rocks up like he's got it covered and a 40-something guy basically makes him implode in the semis. He was cursing, whacking balls around etc... It was extremely amusing (and satisfying) to watch someone simply not have a clue how to play someone so much craftier and who didn't bother trying to outplay him at his own game.

[sureshs]

Originally Posted by arche3

Lol too old to hit the space bar?

He is conserving bandwidth and disk space for TW

[0d1n]

Originally Posted by tamdoankc

My new goal is to play the best 10 year olds in the world to hopefully say I have a winning record against the number 1 player in the world

ROFL. Good goal. I don't have a winning record against her, but
I can proudly say I've beaten an ITF junior girl currently ranked in the top 30ish. She's 16 now, and I've beaten her 2-3 years ago. She still has more wins over me since we continued to play until I was in over my head playing against her. A few months is a HUGE difference for these juniors sometimes, even though that amount of time doesn't really matter for me.
I would probably struggle to win games from her now...and most of our matches would probably be 12-0 in her favor. I don't know EXACTLY how I would do since it is needless to say her coach doesn't bother asking me for match-play against her anymore since she's WAY past my level currently and is training against male juniors...some of which already have ATP points.
I'll stick to 12-14 year olds...and even some of those are tough. A very good 13-14 year old boy with chances to "make it pro" will more often than not allow me 1-3 games per match...tops. On a faster surface I'd do better, but on clay it's tough against these super trained tennis machines. They just don't miss the way us "rec players" do, they are way too well trained for that.

[TheCheese]

Their serves are probably much faster than 78 if you placed the gun on the baseline...