backhand smash myth?

[Off The Wall]

Originally Posted by SystemicAnomaly

Not always possible. I agree that many players hit a high BH when they should be running around the ball to hit a FH smash. However, for quick, lower trajectory lobs, this might not be practical. This is where the BH smash comes in.

Absolutely. There is a time and place for the BH smash. It is off a certain type of lob. You have done a good job of identifying on which type of lob to try it. I tried to illustrate when not to try it.

[davced1]

I played a lot of badminton before I started tennis and it is an essential shot in badminton so I don't find it hard at all. But I can imagine that it is hard if you are not used to it so there is probably some truth in the myth.

[Off The Wall]

Originally Posted by davced1

I played a lot of badminton before I started tennis and it is an essential shot in badminton so I don't find it hard at all. But I can imagine that it is hard if you are not used to it so there is probably some truth in the myth.

I played some badminton, too. What I got from that sport was a forehand smash over my backhand side. A great shot, BTW.

[sureshs]

I have hit several of them, it is not difficult.

[5263]

Originally Posted by Frank Silbermann

Taking a half-volley on the backhand side and returning it as a topspin lob, maybe.

very good answer..

[floridatennisdude]

Originally Posted by SystemicAnomaly

Here is a backhand smash that comes off the racket well in excess of 140 mph (he has also hit some in excess of 160 mph).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEsARpxuYTM

There are some top tennis pros that can hit high BH volleys/smashes with this kind of authority (even if not quite at this speed).

Great example. I'd bet most competitive badminton players feel the shot is more natural. Tennis players practice serves and OHs from a forehand stance and it is not very natural to rotate the body 180 degrees and reverse the swing motion.

I play a OHBH and when I used to horse around playing beach volleyball, I could spike a ball with the back of my hand on an overpassed ball. Opponents were always surprised by that shot since it was unorthodox to them.

Ultimately, not a difficult shot to those that practice it. Difficult for a 2HBH player that doesn't practice it.

[kiteboard]

Originally Posted by LeeD

I'm a skinny, old weak guy.

No putaways from center of NML, unless you are Kiteboard, who can hit 90 mph backhand overheads from anywhere inside the court, using a Hawaiin grip, a strong W. Geoff just happens to be 6' and 215 lbs, strong as an ox, and just as stubborn.

I use the continental at net, including the back hand smash. Yandell filmed me for that shot and we did a whole piece on it. I hit them for an hour. In the next few weeks, every league match I played, I hit a bh smash over the rear fence or side fence. I also use a full western, uni grip, same for both sides on ground shots, and don't change grips at all from the baseline, except transition net to continental. If the rest of my game was as good, I'd be making money at the game, instead of posting here. I've also hit aces with the bh smash, serving with it from the baseline. Not too many people can make that claim honestly! I don't run around it that's for sure. I don't need to.

[Off The Wall]

Originally Posted by kiteboard

I use the continental at net, including the back hand smash. Yandell filmed me for that shot and we did a whole piece on it. I hit them for an hour. In the next few weeks, every league match I played, I hit a bh smash over the rear fence or side fence. I also use a full western, uni grip, same for both sides on ground shots, and don't change grips at all from the baseline, except transition net to continental. If the rest of my game was as good, I'd be making money at the game, instead of posting here. I've also hit aces with the bh smash, serving with it from the baseline. Not too many people can make that claim honestly! I don't run around it that's for sure. I don't need to.

Seriously, you should submit your bh serve video to Whacked Out Sports. It's a homemade sports video show featuring spectacular flops and successes.

[LeeD]

Bad post above.
I've seen Kiteboard hit backhand overheads as good as most 4.5 normal overheads. He's stronger than you. Older, maybe. But stronger.
He's an inch taller than me, maybe 70 lbs heavier, and 50 of it muscle.
The reason you don't take every overhead on the forehand side is that you end up out of position after leaping 4' to your oft hand side, then backpedalling to recover to a stop/split. It leaves the court wide open if it's not a clean putaway.

[Off The Wall]

Originally Posted by LeeD

Bad post above.
I've seen Kiteboard hit backhand overheads as good as most 4.5 normal overheads. He's stronger than you. Older, maybe. But stronger.
He's an inch taller than me, maybe 70 lbs heavier, and 50 of it muscle.
The reason you don't take every overhead on the forehand side is that you end up out of position after leaping 4' to your oft hand side, then backpedalling to recover to a stop/split. It leaves the court wide open if it's not a clean putaway.

I was trying to compliment Kiteboard. I mean, that show does exist. And his BH serve would qualify as a spectacular success. (To me anyway.)

Otherwise, I think we all agree there is a time and place for BH overheads. So what are you getting at?

[dominikk1985]

no shot is hard if you master it.

however it is certainly harder to exert force and control on a BH smash than on most other strokes. just not a good anatomical constellation to exert force. this is because the muscles that internally rotate and flex the shoulder forward are much stronger then the muscles that externally rotate and extend the shoulder back. those muscles (rotator cuff) are causing a lot of injuries in overhead throwing because they are weaker and can't handle the heavy internal rotation forces during the deceleration of the follow through.

On top of this the ROM on this motion is also limited thus basically no follow through is possible.

[LeeD]

OTW.... guys who posted before you say that you don't need a backhand overhead, I'm responding to them.
Dominic.... you don't always need to apply serious power to every equation. A sharp angle forcing the opponent to run well wide of his doubles alley and short of his service line can set yourself up for the next open court winner. Once he thinks you're going short angle wide, you poke one deep DTL for a clean winner, wrongfooting him.
Most overheads that you expect to be a forcing shot or winner is hit from within 3' of the service line. If you're hitting backhand overheads at your own baseline, it's probably not going to be a winner/forcing shot.
From the service line, you have lots of CC short angles to play with. You practice hitting a BALANCED 1hbh backhand overhead, that goes short of the service line, and wide enough to run the opponent past his doubles alley.

[rufus_smith]

Dunno if its the hardest, but it is a thing of beauty when done right. Here' the Master to show how its done:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b24NzRu0BF8
enjoy

[kazamzaa]

Originally Posted by SystemicAnomaly

Not always possible. I agree that many players hit a high BH when they should be running around the ball to hit a FH smash. However, for quick, lower trajectory lobs, this might not be practical. This is where the BH smash comes in.

This is very true. I just won a point yesterday with a backhand smash as my opponent tried to pass me with a fast and high ball down the line.
Beautiful point. This is a shot one rarely needs to execute. Not in every match.

[5263]

Originally Posted by rufus_smith

Dunno if its the hardest, but it is a thing of beauty when done right. Here' the Master to show how its done:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b24NzRu0BF8
enjoy

kiteboard, is this roughly how your technique works?

Weird how DJ can't get there on this with Fed just packing it nearly straight
down with that soft high bounce. 2ond bounce was not very deep.
I watched it 7 times looking to see if DJ just
got a late start or what, but I guess the I/O angle was just enough.
Pretty shot though.

[LeeD]

To me, it looks like DJ made the initial effort, then decided a desperation dive to get ONE more ball back wasn't worth the toll it would take on his body, only to lose the following point because Fed had position.
I'd reckon Kiteboard is bigger and stronger than Fed. Certainly outweighs Fed by 40 lbs.
I have little power in my backhand overhead, but placement can trump power if the placement is good, and you hit the unexpected shot.
Notice also that n the last couple years, lots of drop volley winners. You don't need to hit hard to hit a winner.

[5263]

I was just wondering if that was basically how kite did it. Seems an odd way to
serve. I just reach over and hit them like a badminton player, but still as a Fh.

[LeeD]

Possibly to Geoff, a 13 oz racket is light and easy to swing.
To me, a 10 oz racket is the most I can swing.
Different player, different perception and skills.