Worst band ever: REM or Chili Peppers?

[adamX012]

after reading opening, I just realized that I am different-never heard of them... sorry,op. I am going to pass this thread.

[ninman]

Originally Posted by heycal

Let's talk about Brian Wilson for a moment since he comes up a lot in this thread.

Now, I like the Beach Boys as much as the next guy. They are all over my ipod. I love all the surf music, and later hits like God Only Knows and Good Vibrations are wonderful.

But what else is there? What did he do that put him anywhere near the Beatles, or the Stones, for that matter?

The vaunted Pet Sounds, which I read was suppposedly inspired by Rubber Soul, ain't no Rubber Soul. Check out the track listings if you don't believe me. A couple of excellent songs and that's it.

I mean, come on, folks. He's certainly one of the most talented American pop guys of all time, but let's not over-praise him. The surf music was great, but he was really only able to produce less than a handful of excellent songs once he moved beyond that.

Oh boy, you are clueless. The stuff he wrote from 1961-1967 is amazing work. Lyrically it's about surfing and girls mostly, but the composition and style was phenomenal.

As for the last comment, that is ridiculousness at it's most extreme. Brian Wilson had a mental breakdown, which basically incapacitated him for a good 20 years.

Try listening to his solo albums, Sweet Insanity, Imagination, also the released smile album. Musically they are fantastic.

In my opinion the Today album is their best album by far. Much better than Pet Sounds.

The reason people cite Pet Sounds as one of the greatest albums of all time (I believe it's number 2), is because the musical composition of that album was revolutionary. Every track on that album sounds fantastic.

[heycal]

Originally Posted by ninman

Oh boy, you are clueless. The stuff he wrote from 1961-1967 is amazing work. Lyrically it's about surfing and girls mostly, but the composition and style was phenomenal.

As for the last comment, that is ridiculousness at it's most extreme. Brian Wilson had a mental breakdown, which basically incapacitated him for a good 20 years.

Try listening to his solo albums, Sweet Insanity, Imagination, also the released smile album. Musically they are fantastic.

In my opinion the Today album is their best album by far. Much better than Pet Sounds.

The reason people cite Pet Sounds as one of the greatest albums of all time (I believe it's number 2), is because the musical composition of that album was revolutionary. Every track on that album sounds fantastic.

I already acknowledged that the surf music is great. What I'm saying is that he couldn't really move beyond it aside from a few excellent songs. He wrote tons of great surf songs, yes, but only a handful of interesting ones after that, and I'm talking pre-mental breakdown. It's akin to the Beatles being unable to produce more than a few great songs after a "Hard Days Night" something.

As for "revolutionary", and "compositionally" and "innovative" and "conceptually" and whatever other terms we want to apply to these artists and their music only one thing really matters: the songs. How good are the songs? And "Wouldn't it be nice?" and "Sloop John B." aren't going on my ipod before "Gimme Shelter" or "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds", my friend. Are they really on your "A" list?

[r2473]

Originally Posted by heycal

Gap or H&M. But can't go too skinny though when this old -- let a girlfriend or a teenager be your guide here.

Cool!! I'm currently dating Tracy from Woody Allen's Manhattan, so she qualifies on both counts.

[Geology_Rocks!]

The skinny jeans thread... Good memories...

[dParis]

H&M clothes (at least the men's stuff) are crap. Just sayin'...

[heycal]

Originally Posted by Geology_Rocks!

The skinny jeans thread... Good memories...

Indeed. Maybe we should start another one, even though the last one proved controversial for some reason.

Originally Posted by dParis

H&M clothes (at least the men's stuff) are crap. Just sayin'...

In terms of style or material? If the former, I defer to women's views, who seem to like their stuff on this old man. If the latter, yes, probably so. But it's also half the price of the Gap, for one example. (Speaking of which, my thinly made Gap blue jeans already have a hole in them after one year of normal wear. That store is going downhill...)

[chrischris]

Taylor Swift is nice to behold but the 'music' well i feel its quite common and mediocre.
Her looks carry it.

[heycal]

Originally Posted by chrischris

Taylor Swift is nice to behold but the 'music' well i feel its quite common and mediocre.
Her looks carry it.

I bet everyone following this thread was thinking the exact same thing right about now, but you beat us to it.

[chrischris]

Originally Posted by heycal

I bet everyone following this thread was thinking the exact same thing right about now, but you beat us to it.

Of course, but someones gotta take the lead.

[Mike Bulgakov]

Originally Posted by heycal

Gap or H&M. But can't go too skinny though when this old -- let a girlfriend or a teenager be your guide here.

Kaitlin can pull off jeans better than heycal.

[ninman]

Originally Posted by heycal

I already acknowledged that the surf music is great. What I'm saying is that he couldn't really move beyond it aside from a few excellent songs. He wrote tons of great surf songs, yes, but only a handful of interesting ones after that, and I'm talking pre-mental breakdown. It's akin to the Beatles being unable to produce more than a few great songs after a "Hard Days Night" something.

As for "revolutionary", and "compositionally" and "innovative" and "conceptually" and whatever other terms we want to apply to these artists and their music only one thing really matters: the songs. How good are the songs? And "Wouldn't it be nice?" and "Sloop John B." aren't going on my ipod before "Gimme Shelter" or "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds", my friend. Are they really on your "A" list?

Wouldn't it be nice? is a great song. Sloop John B is not a Brian Wilson composition. You are forgetting that he had a mental breakdown in 1967 while composing Smile right?

He did still write some awesome tracks though, "All I wanna do" on the sunflower album, "Till I die" on the Surfs Up album. "I went to sleep", "Breakaway", "Time to Get Alone", all brilliant songs.

As I said, in my opinion, his best album was the Today album. Every song on that sounds fantastic, and it was the first one to really break away from the surf and car stuff.

[heycal]

Originally Posted by ninman

Wouldn't it be nice? is a great song.

Say what??

I don't recognize the other songs you mention, but if "Wouldn't it be nice?" is your definition of a great song, I don't hold out much hope for those others. It's perfectly pleasant, but hardly a masterpiece.

As for the mental breakdown -- what's his excuse for not producing better non-surf music before that happened?

Don't get me wrong. I think Brian Wilson and the Beach Boys are great overall, and could be the best American band of all. It's just that the Beatles and Stones were significantly better. It's not unlike Andy Roddick being the best American tennis player in his day -- yet not in the same league as the Europeans.

[ninman]

Originally Posted by heycal

Say what??

I don't recognize the other songs you mention, but if "Wouldn't it be nice?" is your definition of a great song, I don't hold out much hope for those others. It's perfectly pleasant, but hardly a masterpiece.

As for the mental breakdown -- what's his excuse for not producing better non-surf music before that happened?

Don't get me wrong. I think Brian Wilson and the Beach Boys are great overall, and could be the best American band of all. It's just that the Beatles and Stones were significantly better. It's not unlike Andy Roddick being the best American tennis player in his day -- yet not in the same league as the Europeans.

The record company had a lot of say over what kind of musics bands produced in those days. The beach boys got popular because of the surf and car stuff. So Brian made a lot of it because that's what sold records.

When we made Pet Sounds the record company were seriously against it, as were a lot of the fans. You'll notice it didn't do particularly well, there's a good reason for that.

He was moving away from the surfing stuff, and it sounded totally different. Then just as Pet sounds started to pick up, the record company released a Beach Boys best of. So people stopped buying Pet Sounds and bought the best of instead.

Brian was really disappointed with the performance of Pet Sounds, and really angry with the record company for effectively sabotaging any chance it had to be a big seller.

[Feather]

I don't know which is worst

The best band is Drean Theater

[Tennis_Hands]

Originally Posted by dParis

H&M clothes (at least the men's stuff) are crap. Just sayin'...

It depends what you mean.

If you mean, that the materials are crap, or around that level I am inclined to agree.

If you mean, that the construction is crap, I strongly disagree.

Actually, I got a present from a friend some time ago. A Slim fit long sleeve H&M shirt. It puts my RTW Cerruti and other even more expensive shirts to shame.

[Power Player]

"Wouldn't it be nice" is a fantastic song. This is a successful troll thread created by someone with no music experience outside of being a common fan.

[heycal]

Originally Posted by ninman

The record company had a lot of say over what kind of musics bands produced in those days. The beach boys got popular because of the surf and car stuff. So Brian made a lot of it because that's what sold records.

When we made Pet Sounds the record company were seriously against it, as were a lot of the fans. You'll notice it didn't do particularly well, there's a good reason for that.

He was moving away from the surfing stuff, and it sounded totally different. Then just as Pet sounds started to pick up, the record company released a Beach Boys best of. So people stopped buying Pet Sounds and bought the best of instead.

Brian was really disappointed with the performance of Pet Sounds, and really angry with the record company for effectively sabotaging any chance it had to be a big seller.

That's all well and good, but why isn't Pet Sounds a better album?

Originally Posted by Power Player

"Wouldn't it be nice" is a fantastic song.

Fantastic? Not quite. A fine song, yes, but I don't think it's going on anyone's "100 songs I'm bringing to a desert island" list.

[Power Player]

Originally Posted by heycal

That's all well and good, but why isn't Pet Sounds a better album?



Fantastic? Not quite. A fine song, yes, but I don't think it's going on anyone's "100 songs I'm bringing to a desert island" list.

I know plenty of people who would disagree with both of those statements, Many are much more accomplished in the music business than yourself. One is personally responsible for over 7 platinum albums. In the music industry, Pet Sounds is considered one of the greatest records in the past 50 plus years. The fact that the label of the past did not properly market it, has no affect on that current opinion. It was essentially far ahead of it's time when released.

The only reason I bring this up is because you are making subjective statements as if they are facts. Your opinion of song quality is no better than any other average fan. At least the people I cite have made careers in music so I would carry their opinion far more over yours.

If you have ever had your job on the line where you have had to predict hit songs, song order and allocate promotional budget than you may have some set of ears that makes your opinion more respected. But I sincerely doubt this is the case.

[heycal]

Originally Posted by Power Player

I know plenty of people who would disagree with both of those statements, Many are much more accomplished in the music business than yourself. One is personally responsible for over 7 platinum albums. In the music industry, Pet Sounds is considered one of the greatest records in the past 50 plus years. The fact that the label of the past did not properly market it, has no affect on that current opinion. It was essentially far ahead of it's time when released.

The only reason I bring this up is because you are making subjective statements as if they are facts. Your opinion of song quality is no better than any other average fan. At least the people I cite have made careers in music so I would carry their opinion far more over yours.

If you have ever had your job on the line where you have had to predict hit songs, song order and allocate promotional budget than you may have some set of ears that makes your opinion more respected. But I sincerely doubt this is the case.

I don't think people in the music industry have any monopoly on taste. In fact, there is is ample evidence of quite the opposite.

And I really don't care about sales or popularity, so I don't know why you guys are feeling a need to defend the album on that count. Good seller or bad seller, hits or not, I'm just saying a lot of the songs on the album ain't that great.