What is going to happen with green balls?

[Alohajrtennis]

Originally Posted by julian

MarTennis,
if a player/student comes to a 12 UNDER tournament and someone/tournament director brings GREEN
DOTS balls there is NOTHING a player can do.
The player has to play the given ball.
According to what I was told a player should expect/be ready for this scenario
even if he spent last five months playing REGULAR USPTA approved balls.
I do NOT mean to be disrespectful
I just plainly do NOT understand your post or I do NOT understand the phrase
"play green".
Maybe you meant green foam balls-please clarify.
It is possible that my problem is "local" and that I make big deal out of nothing but ...
regards,
Julian

There is not to my knowledge any section that is using "green balls" aka "green dot" balls at the 12U Open level. It used at all 10U levels, and some sections, not all, are using it on 12U satellite/challenger/novice entry-level tournaments. Again, the language varies by section and this is a section by section decision. But all 12U Open Level tournaments in all sections still use standard yellow ball.

[BMC9670]

Originally Posted by MarTennis

There is no mandate that they play green at 10 or 12. They can play regular ball open if they are advanced past the green ball. What 10u regular ball players don't deserve is there own regular ball division. Play up.

Just "play up" is all of common of an answer but not always a good one. There are mandates for USTA competition and many kids get caught in the middle. My son (and many of his tennis peers) was perfectly capable of playing good tennis with regulation at 9, but was not an "elite" player. All USTA competition in my section was orange ball on a 60' court for 10U. This was going backwards for him. Yes, he could have played 12U, but there is a big difference in 9 and 12 physically, speed, agility, an maturity. Now at 10 we're in a different section and he could not even qualify for the lowest tier 12U until 10 1/2 and guess what, those lower level are all green ball. So at 10, he would have to play the top level 12U tourneys to get regulation.

So, play up works if your kid is an elite player or if they can handle getting creamed every match. Personally, I don't want to pay high tourney fees for one match, either.

[gplracer]

Originally Posted by BMC9670

Just "play up" is all of common of an answer but not always a good one. There are mandates for USTA competition and many kids get caught in the middle. My son (and many of his tennis peers) was perfectly capable of playing good tennis with regulation at 9, but was not an "elite" player. All USTA competition in my section was orange ball on a 60' court for 10U. This was going backwards for him. Yes, he could have played 12U, but there is a big difference in 9 and 12 physically, speed, agility, an maturity. Now at 10 we're in a different section and he could not even qualify for the lowest tier 12U until 10 1/2 and guess what, those lower level are all green ball. So at 10, he would have to play the top level 12U tourneys to get regulation.

So, play up works if your kid is an elite player or if they can handle getting creamed every match. Personally, I don't want to pay high tourney fees for one match, either.

There is a lot of truth to this.

To my knowledge green ball/green dot ball is not being used in the 10 and under division at all. My 10 year old played in the southern championships in 2009-2011 and it was always orange ball.

[TenAll]

FYI

Southwest Section Mandates all 10 under with Orange ball (since 2011) and all 12 under with Green ball, even for L3 closed since beginning of this year. Nike Jr Masters did not sponsor this year due to green dot mandate.

[gplracer]

I thought orange ball was mandated for all sections in the 10 and under division.

[GATennisMom]

Texas - have both orange ball and green ball in the 10s. I believe you have to have so many points or tournaments won to move from orange to green. They must move to green ball the last 6 months they are eligible in the 10s. In both Southern and Northern Carolina sections they have both orange and green 10s divisions. The ******* section also has both orange and green ball based on the level of the tournament. Then there are sections that have 10s Orange only and the green is played in the lower level or novice type tournaments in the 12s like in the Southwest and Southern Sections.

[LMK5]

The way out of this mess is to base the colored balls on the skill of the player, not the age of the player. I know lots of kids age 6-10 who can beat lots of kids 12-14 years old, yet the younger ones are forced to play with dead balls and the older ones would play with regulation.

Reality: 10 year old advanced players are playing with the green ball, while 12 year old novices are playing regulation. This is what mandates creates. Makes sense?

[Bedrock]

Add divs 6 and 8 to USTA and keep all green/orange balls there.

[BMC9670]

Originally Posted by LMK5

The way out of this mess is to base the colored balls on the skill of the player, not the age of the player. I know lots of kids age 6-10 who can beat lots of kids 12-14 years old, yet the younger ones are forced to play with dead balls and the older ones would play with regulation.

Reality: 10 year old advanced players are playing with the green ball, while 12 year old novices are playing regulation. This is what mandates creates. Makes sense?

Here's an interesting one in our section - my son, who is 10 1/2, is playing in an L6 12U USTA event this weekend with GREEN. One of his peers, who is also 10, but not yet 10 1/2 is not allowed to play due to age (cut off is 10 1/2). Both players are intermediate to advanced level. So, his friend is forced to play ORANGE or sit out. That's what mandates do.

[Bedrock]

Average tennis-kid passes the point of green-balls on the age of 8-9 years old.
Therefore green ball works only for those who are playing a division up (in 10U age group).

However there is virtually no tournaments for 8U (probably because of a lack of players in this age).
I still do not understand why we have to sacrifice the whole division for such insignificant amount of players.

[ga tennis]

NO GOOD 10 YEAR OLD SHOULD BE PLAYING GREEN DOTS!!! A good 9 or ten year old should be playing regulation only. Green dots hurt these kids alot more than they help.Under 8 should be multi colored balls but 9 and 10 year olds need to be regulation.Unless they are just getting started and if thats the case they should be green dot.In Ga ALL the good 9 and 10 year olds play up in the 12s.Watching a ten and under tournament is SAD!!! I just wanna tell the parents do you realize you are hurting your child more than helping them unless the kid is just getting started.

[BMC9670]

[quote=Bedrock;7017893]

Originally Posted by ga tennis

NO GOOD 10 YEAR OLD SHOULD BE PLAYING GREEN DOTS!!! A good 9 or ten year old should be playing regulation only. Green dots hurt these kids alot more than they help.Under 8 should be multi colored balls but 9 and 10 year olds need to be regulation.Unless they are just getting started and if thats the case they should be green dot.In Ga ALL the good 9 and 10 year olds play up in the 12s.Watching a ten and under tournament is SAD!!! I just wanna tell the parents do you realize you are hurting your child more than helping them unless the kid is just getting started.

I agree with you. BUT, here in this section, all USTA 10U tournaments are orange, and lower level 12U are green. Not many competitive opportunities for a good 10 year old to play regulation. We have stayed out of USTA for the most part due to this and play club/team tennis or non-sanctined local tournaments, which are regulation.

I've said it a million times. The colored balls have their place in teaching/development, but the mandates hold many back with less choices and opportunities.

[LMK5]

Originally Posted by BMC9670

Here's an interesting one in our section - my son, who is 10 1/2, is playing in an L6 12U USTA event this weekend with GREEN. One of his peers, who is also 10, but not yet 10 1/2 is not allowed to play due to age (cut off is 10 1/2). Both players are intermediate to advanced level. So, his friend is forced to play ORANGE or sit out. That's what mandates do.

Hard to believe 12U must play green. That's not the case here in Socal. What we do have is 14 year old novices playing regulation while ranked 10 year olds play green on the adjacent court.

What I have noticed is that the 8U division has gone away here. There's no place for these kids to play anymore. Why? To play 8U, the tournament directors must mark off courts to a 36' format. They don't want to do this because it limits their flexibility in scheduling the other age divisions. Before the 36' court requirement, there was no extra work or sacrifice to include 8U in their events. The mandate has forced them into a corner. Just another instance where a policy--not driven by market demand--has hurt the very people that mandate was intended to benefit.

[BMC9670]

Originally Posted by LMK5

Hard to believe 12U must play green.

Not all. Only the lowest 2 levels, I think.

[GATennisMom]

Here is a video that USTA released on 10 and Under Green Ball - http://youtu.be/sTK-gRwaJ5o

What i don't understand is how sections can vary so much on what ball is used for what age group.

[ga tennis]

The video shows exactly why i dont like green ball. All they are doing is playing defensive trying not to miss.(DOWN THE MIDDLE) They are just hitting balls without a purpose. At around 20 sec into the video the kid gets a short ball to attack and gets to it and just rolls it back into play When they talk about constucting points i dont see it in the video. The green dots are hard to put away and they let these kids get a false sense about footwork. If thats what they consider point constuction then basically they are teaching kids to just grind and play defense.

[LMK5]

Originally Posted by ga tennis

The video shows exactly why i dont like green ball. All they are doing is playing defensive trying not to miss.(DOWN THE MIDDLE) They are just hitting balls without a purpose. At around 20 sec into the video the kid gets a short ball to attack and gets to it and just rolls it back into play When they talk about constucting points i dont see it in the video. The green dots are hard to put away and they let these kids get a false sense about footwork. If thats what they consider point constuction then basically they are teaching kids to just grind and play defense.

What I've noticed about these green ball matches is there's a lack of topspin on the shots. Because of the low compression and light weight of the ball, the kids can whack it and it will stay in the court, whereas a regulation ball would go long with the same stroke. The importance of topspin is greatly reduced with these low compression balls, so what happens when the kid must play regulation? How will they all of a sudden adjust their mechanics to put the necessary amount of spin on the ball to keep it in play? What a rude awakening that will be.

[ga tennis]

It really was a Terrible idea to mandate the 10s.It would have been awesome this year watching all the top 10 year olds compete against each other here in Georgia

[BMC9670]

Originally Posted by ga tennis

The video shows exactly why i dont like green ball. All they are doing is playing defensive trying not to miss.(DOWN THE MIDDLE) They are just hitting balls without a purpose. At around 20 sec into the video the kid gets a short ball to attack and gets to it and just rolls it back into play When they talk about constucting points i dont see it in the video. The green dots are hard to put away and they let these kids get a false sense about footwork. If thats what they consider point constuction then basically they are teaching kids to just grind and play defense.

Originally Posted by LMK5

What I've noticed about these green ball matches is there's a lack of topspin on the shots. Because of the low compression and light weight of the ball, the kids can whack it and it will stay in the court, whereas a regulation ball would go long with the same stroke. The importance of topspin is greatly reduced with these low compression balls, so what happens when the kid must play regulation? How will they all of a sudden adjust their mechanics to put the necessary amount of spin on the ball to keep it in play? What a rude awakening that will be.

What I see in the video is marketing. Many parents equate keeping a ball in play for long rallies with success. Just go to a few orange tournaments and listen to the sideline chatter. The players in the videos have the game to do a lot better, but they need to be coached to construct points, attack short balls, hit with topspin, use angles to open the court, etc.

I don't use a lot of green with my 10YO, but when I do, or when he plays a green match, he has an offensive mindset and knows he has to construct a point to be able to hit a winner off me in practice or another kid in a match.

Again, I think they can be a tool when used with a purpose and direction. But in the marketing, long rally = success = more $ coming in.

[ga tennis]

Originally Posted by BMC9670

What I see in the video is marketing. Many parents equate keeping a ball in play for long rallies with success. Just go to a few orange tournaments and listen to the sideline chatter. The players in the videos have the game to do a lot better, but they need to be coached to construct points, attack short balls, hit with topspin, use angles to open the court, etc.

I don't use a lot of green with my 10YO, but when I do, or when he plays a green match, he has an offensive mindset and knows he has to construct a point to be able to hit a winner off me in practice or another kid in a match.

Again, I think they can be a tool when used with a purpose and direction. But in the marketing, long rally = success = more $ coming in.

Get him away from green dot A.S.A.P!!!!!!!! Its gonna hurt his game. Now with my daughter we use new balls everyday.