Can't call your 1st serve out? - Page 2

gmatheis · 11-17-2012, 02:45 PM

To set some things straight.

- Rule 25( 2011 ed) or rule 26 (2012 ed) refers to both doubles and singles.

- Your opponent cant hit out balls all day and see where they go before calling them out because part of rule 17 states "A call shall be made either before the player’s return shot has gone out of play or before an opponent has had an opportunity to play the return shot."

- If your opponent considers your first serve in but misses the return and you saw that your first serve was clearly out then you can and should call it out.

esgee48 · 11-17-2012, 03:35 PM

Say 1st serve is long, but is returned without a call. I will play it and if the returner then says 'it was out', it's time for a warning because the return interrupts the service. I am no longer in position to serve a second because I am chasing down his return and have or am preparing to return the ball. If he halts play, I would warn him. Next time, it's a hindrance because he is saying something as you prepare to hit the ball. You really have to tell idiots like this what you plan to do so they understand that returning long serves are not needed. They should (1) let it go or (2) block it into the net.

dlam · 11-17-2012, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by esgee48

Say 1st serve is long, but is returned without a call. I will play it and if the returner then says 'it was out', it's time for a warning because the return interrupts the service. I am no longer in position to serve a second because I am chasing down his return and have or am preparing to return the ball. If he halts play, I would warn him. Next time, it's a hindrance because he is saying something as you prepare to hit the ball. You really have to tell idiots like this what you plan to do so they understand that returning long serves are not needed. They should (1) let it go or (2) block it into the net.

Okay then what if it's a 100 mph serve?
I don't think this will work

dizzlmcwizzl · 11-17-2012, 07:18 PM

If you serve and I think it is in I will return the ball. Your job is to play my return until I have told you it was out. You are not disadvantaged if I play an out ball ... unless you stop playing yourself.

If you were allowed to call first serves out then you would be in the position to see my returns and then decide to call the ball out. This would put me at a clear disadvantage if every good return I made was met with a late out call from the server.

It seems to me that however the rule was written a nefarious person could take advantage of the rule ... The USTA, ITF, and every other organization has decided the player on the ball side of the court should have the responsibility as to whether the ball in is or out. They have been very consistent in this regard.

esgee48 · 11-17-2012, 07:32 PM

Read my first post. I actually have time to call 100 MPH serves in or out. And stop my swing. You have about 1/2 second to read and react. 120 MPH is a different story, but how many people here face 1st serves of that speed.

I don't disagree with the rule. What I don't like is a returner that returns a ball and partially thru the rally, say 'That was out, I think.'

stapletonj · 11-18-2012, 05:25 AM

AS to the guy who retunrs and then after a while calls your serve long...

Don't be "that guy". duh

Don't be afraid to invoke the make the call immmediately, no 2 chances rule....

Cindysphinx · 11-18-2012, 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by esgee48

Say 1st serve is long, but is returned without a call. I will play it and if the returner then says 'it was out', it's time for a warning because the return interrupts the service. I am no longer in position to serve a second because I am chasing down his return and have or am preparing to return the ball. If he halts play, I would warn him. Next time, it's a hindrance because he is saying something as you prepare to hit the ball. You really have to tell idiots like this what you plan to do so they understand that returning long serves are not needed. They should (1) let it go or (2) block it into the net.

Mmmm, I'm not sure about a lot of this.

If a fast first serve is just barely out, the receiver may well have to start his
swing and return the ball. Yes, she should say "Out," but she may not say it loudly enough or clearly enough, especially if she is a grunter.

If she returns the ball and then clarifies that it was out before you have hit the ball and while the ball is traveling toward you, I do not think you are within your rights to call a hindrance. The reason is that there is no live ball being played. She is calling it out, so you cannot be hindered in playing a ball that is not a live ball to play.

Now, if it is an obviously out fault, I think you are within your rights to object to someone who constantly hits obviously out faults over the net. If you are taking the position that someone who returns a 100 mph serve that is out by two inches is returning an obvious fault, I can't agree with you.

kylebarendrick · 11-19-2012, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by esgee48

Say 1st serve is long, but is returned without a call. I will play it and if the returner then says 'it was out', it's time for a warning because the return interrupts the service.

It is time for a warning, but not because of the interruption. If they play the ball without making a call, then the serve was "in" (regardless of what you thought) and the point is on. If they then catch the ball and say "oh that was out", tell them you need them to make a call immediately if a serve is out and if they catch another live ball you are taking they point.

Bedrock · 11-20-2012, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlam

This rule I'm not to fond of
If you are allow to call any of your own shots out including the 2nd serve than why do we have to play the point if it my 1st serve looks clearly long but my opponent still returns it?

It is so obvious
To prevent cheating on winning returns.

dlam · 11-20-2012, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bedrock

It is so obvious
To prevent cheating on winning returns.

Bed,
read the thread.
The rule makes it easier for the returner to cheat.

Bedrock · 11-21-2012, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlam

Bed,
read the thread.
The rule makes it easier for the returner to cheat.

Stop reading start playing

11-17-2012, 02:45 PM	#21
gmatheis Semi-Pro Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 755	To set some things straight. - Rule 25( 2011 ed) or rule 26 (2012 ed) refers to both doubles and singles. - Your opponent cant hit out balls all day and see where they go before calling them out because part of rule 17 states "A call shall be made either before the player’s return shot has gone out of play or before an opponent has had an opportunity to play the return shot." - If your opponent considers your first serve in but misses the return and you saw that your first serve was clearly out then you can and should call it out. __________________ 3 x Völkl PB10 Mid +3.5g lead / BHBR 17 @ 40lbs

11-17-2012, 07:18 PM	#24
dizzlmcwizzl Hall Of Fame Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: DE Posts: 1,709	If you serve and I think it is in I will return the ball. Your job is to play my return until I have told you it was out. You are not disadvantaged if I play an out ball ... unless you stop playing yourself. If you were allowed to call first serves out then you would be in the position to see my returns and then decide to call the ball out. This would put me at a clear disadvantage if every good return I made was met with a late out call from the server. It seems to me that however the rule was written a nefarious person could take advantage of the rule ... The USTA, ITF, and every other organization has decided the player on the ball side of the court should have the responsibility as to whether the ball in is or out. They have been very consistent in this regard. __________________ "You should be playing linebacker, not singles."

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