Calling footfaults is important

[sureshs]

From another thread now:

"saw a college match when player a complained about player b foot faulting, player b told player a to stfu there was no way he could see it from acros the net....next changeover player a walks up the SERVICE line not the base line bangs out an "ace" and declares 15- love... a sh#tstorm of epic proportions follows"

[mmk]

Originally Posted by woodrow1029

I do agree with you for calling an official once the match started, and I don't think that is gamesmanship at all. I do see, however, that someone could see it as gamesmanship when you warn them about it during the warm-up (trying to get into their head), although I'm not in any way saying that is what your intention was. Even a lot of pros foot fault during the warm-up, and I don't think you really are in a position to say anything to them in the warm-up. At that time, you don't know what they are going to do during the match.

Yep, there is plenty of video around of Federer hitting practice/warmup serves, and stepping inside the line.

[Roforot]

In retrospect, I could see how they could think it was gamesmanship. During his serves he clearly stepped into the court and then served. We were actually trying to hold off calling a ref by giving them the warning.

[Delano]

Originally Posted by woodrow1029

I will also add to my rant (even though this part isn't about foot faults), while I'm in the ranting mood, that I am tired of parents threatening to file lawsuits against officials because an umpire gave their kid a code violation with the reason that the official gave the code violation because their kid is a different race than the official. Or players filing lawsuits because they were defaulted from a tournament based on lateness rules when they showed up an hour after their scheduled time, again with the reason being that they are of a different race than the official. Or, any other stupid lawsuits to try to intimidate the official to not issue a code violation. Or lawsuits when a parent thinks their kid's draw was "politically motivated" or "racially influenced" when their kid has to play the #1 seed in an earlier round. And, yes, this crap happens. Ok. I'm done ranting for now.

Oh man. When you say that this really happens, do you mean people threatening law suits (which is bad enough), or actually filing them?

[woodrow1029]

Originally Posted by Delano

Oh man. When you say that this really happens, do you mean people threatening law suits (which is bad enough), or actually filing them?

Both! Crazy, huh?

[qwanta]

Originally Posted by Sakkijarvi

We can consume unlimited bandwidth here at TW and it won't change the facts. No one calls footfaults at the rec level.

Instead of getting hot and bothered at your keyboard, think of it along the lines of the phantom double play in baseball. Sure, the letter of the rule is one thing .. but decades of practice ... and thus tradition ... say otherwise.

Like the OP said, calling footfaults at this level will lead to some angry people. If your recreation includes aggravating people and acting like an asshat, have at it.

There are many players at the rec level who step a foot or so into the court a full second before they hit the ball. If they do this every single time they serve, it's perfectly OK to say "hey, watch the foot fault, you're faulting on every serve". The 'asshats' are the people who never said anything and prevented the player from correcting his flawed serve at an earlier point in time when it was probably easier to do so.

If the player steps an inch or two onto the baseline, probably not worth worrying about.

[sureshs]

I was once asked by a father to stand on the sides and point out any FFs that his junior might be committing during serve practice, as a preparation for a tournament. So you might say I am a specialist in this matter.

[Cindysphinx]

Originally Posted by woodrow1029

I do agree with you for calling an official once the match started, and I don't think that is gamesmanship at all. I do see, however, that someone could see it as gamesmanship when you warn them about it during the warm-up (trying to get into their head), although I'm not in any way saying that is what your intention was. Even a lot of pros foot fault during the warm-up, and I don't think you really are in a position to say anything to them in the warm-up. At that time, you don't know what they are going to do during the match.

I think warning people about FF during the warm-up is kind of inappropriate.

I mean, people do a lot of things against the rules in warm-up on account of how it is warm-up. They catch balls. They let balls bounce twice. They hit serves wide and long.

Wait until the match starts and then see if there are flagrant FFs. If so . . . well, do whatever you have the guts to do about it.

[Roddick85]

There's one guy I've been playing for a few years now, I never really noticed he was doing foot faults, to notice that from the other side of the court it's pretty much impossible I find. Anyways once we were playing other people and I saw him serving on the court next to me, and he makes a huge foot fault every serve he does, he's at least 1-2 feet inside the baseline when he hits his serve.

If we'd be playing some kind of tournament, perhaps i'd bring it up. But at our level, I don't think it really matters

[sureshs]

Originally Posted by Roddick85

There's one guy I've been playing for a few years now, I never really noticed he was doing foot faults, to notice that from the other side of the court it's pretty much impossible I find. Anyways once we were playing other people and I saw him serving on the court next to me, and he makes a huge foot fault every serve he does, he's at least 1-2 feet inside the baseline when he hits his serve.

If we'd be playing some kind of tournament, perhaps i'd bring it up. But at our level, I don't think it really matters

Try making him accountable for it, and see if he still remains at your level.

[Roddick85]

Originally Posted by sureshs

Try making him accountable for it, and see if he still remains at your level.

I can pretty much guarantee they wouldn't be at the same level as me as most of my opponents would probably lose almost every service games if I'd call foot faults. I actually told him once earlier this year and he just shrugged it off and e didn't correct the problem. Now I know I should maybe insist more on this, but if I do, at least 60% of the players I play against wouldn't win much if any service games during a match. Many years ago, my coach told me I was making foot faults on serve. It didn't take very long for me to correct my form and ensure I wasn't doing any, but then again i'm a perfectionnist and I want to do things right and I realize that's far from the case in most amateur level players.

[sureshs]

Yeah that is what I thought - their game will breakdown.

[NLBwell]

Playing mixed doubles, my partner starts her serve motion with her front foot about 6 inches behind the baseline. She normally moves her front foot about 4 inches forward - so a 2 inch margin for error.
In a league match, at 6-all in the 3rd set, in the tiebreaker, the opposing male calls a footfault on my partner (from his baseline) and says it is the required warning. Later in the tiebreaker, he calls a footfault on my partner on a second serve and claims the point, giving them the minibreak that was the difference in the match. It is entirely possible that her toe could have touched the line since she does move her foot even though it would be a very rare occurance, so I can't really overturn the call based on that, and, of course, no one other than the guy who called it was looking at it. If the tip of her toe did touch the line, it would have been at least difficult to see even from the opposing service line.
After the match, I told him I didn't want to have a beer with a person like him and left, forsaking the traditional refreshments.

[NLBwell]

For those who would like to make the inelegantly named "hand fault" legal, a couple of questions:

Since the player could stand right on the net and reach over to where he could contact the ball about 5 feet into the court, wouldn't that completely change the whole game of doubles where the net man could cut off almost all angles by reaching out that far?
When he hits the opponent with his racket, would he be able to claim a hinderance, or would the opponent not be allowed within 5 feet of the net?
When he hits the opponent with his racket and the opponent is unable to continue, who wins the match?
On dropshots, could he reach over and place his racket over the ball, so it would be impossible to hit the ball upward?
There would be a lot of issues like this.

Not sure you guys have thought this through.

[sureshs]

Originally Posted by NLBwell

For those who would like to make the inelegantly named "hand fault" legal, a couple of questions:

Since the player could stand right on the net and reach over to where he could contact the ball about 5 feet into the court, wouldn't that completely change the whole game of doubles where the net man could cut off almost all angles by reaching out that far?
When he hits the opponent with his racket, would he be able to claim a hinderance, or would the opponent not be allowed within 5 feet of the net?
When he hits the opponent with his racket and the opponent is unable to continue, who wins the match?
On dropshots, could he reach over and place his racket over the ball, so it would be impossible to hit the ball upward?
There would be a lot of issues like this.

Not sure you guys have thought this through.

1. I take responsibility for the inelegant term "handfault."
2. There is only one person who wants to make it legal. I won't mention who, but we must make sure she is not heard.

[SoBad]

In my experience guys who break one rule break many rules. They are unwanted persons. You just dump them as hitting partners to the extent that the situation allows.

[sureshs]

I would classify them as criminals

[tamdoankc]

I was playing in a north vs south Davis cup type tournament where the north was hosting. I was playing mixed doubles and noticed the guy on the other side was footfaulting big time. Complained to the umpire and he said that is his style of playing and to play on. Wtf?!

99% of the people I've watched or played with in VN footfault. 25% of those are really bad where theyre at least 2 feet in the court before ball contact.

[fleabitten]

I agree that it is important to call foot faults, but I sure feel like a jack***** doing it. I know that I shouldn't feel this way, but I do. We all need to change the perception that footfaults are not a big deal.

[spot]

If there was a person on my team who felt compelled to call every single footfault then they would not be invited back to play next season. We play rec tennis and 90% of people don't get individual coaching where working on a footfaulting problem is easy. None of us look at our own feet while serving to see what is really going on. Every single time I have seen it called in a match it has always been a total d-bag move after a match already got a bit contentious. (twice it was the other team, once it was someone on my team) There are just far more important things to worry about and if someone wants to win that way then I wouldn't be on a team with them.