I beat the guy 60 60 and he called me "a pusher!"

[bukaeast]

If you were driving him side to side or up and back, but with no pace, that is not what I consider pushing. You were controlling the points, not merely getting it back.

[Mongolmike]

Originally Posted by SoBad

Thanks for bringing this up. Pushers is one of those taboo subjects that no one seems to be willing to bring up on these forums.

lol... yup... they should sticky this and dump all the pusher threads into one. (Not saying the OP is a pusher just because someone else did, but it does fit the category)

[sportlerin]

Originally Posted by Tennusdude

Pushers can be notoriously difficult to beat. You need to be patient and not get frustrated. You need to draw pushers to the net, they hate the net. Pushers generally love to run, so hitting at them can be successful as well.
But the most important thing to remember is not to overhit. It will often take more than one shot to put the ball away, sometimes even 3 or 4 great shots, that is why you cant over hit. I pusher only wins by the errors you make. A pusher can never hit a winner on you. I think Brad Gilbert was somewhat of a pusher. He made it to number 4 in the world. He was able to beat Boris Becker because Becker would get angry and lose his patience. Gilbert beat McEnroe at the master at Madision Square Garden one year. McBrat was so angry he took a sabbatical from tennis and actually said that Gilbert didnt even belong on the same court as him. Talk about sour grapes. Actually Gilbert was a master at using different games plans in order to defeat different style players. He wrote a book called Winning Ugly which is an excellent book and well worth the read.

Originally Posted by oragne lovre

Thanks for the tips.

Likewise. Nice post, Tennusdude.

[NJ1]

Originally Posted by sundaypunch

Waiting for an error does not equal pushing. Blooping the ball back with no pace is pushing. The OP said he won by playing good defense and only going for it at 30-0 and 40-15.

If you know that an opponent has a low shot tolerance, trying to hit to safe targets is the smart thing to do. This doesn't mean to play tentatively - you can still hit hard.

Exactly right, good post.

[Gonzalito17]

Originally Posted by bukaeast

If you were driving him side to side or up and back, but with no pace, that is not what I consider pushing. You were controlling the points, not merely getting it back.

Exactly Buka, I could move him around easily, can hit the targets pretty accurately. And was giving him no pace, so as to let him create his own pace, which of course, would cause him to take more risks and miss. Felt like a cat playing with a mouse ) haha

[tiebraek]

Originally Posted by Tennusdude

Pushers can be notoriously difficult to beat. You need to be patient and not get frustrated. You need to draw pushers to the net, they hate the net. Pushers generally love to run, so hitting at them can be successful as well.
But the most important thing to remember is not to overhit. It will often take more than one shot to put the ball away, sometimes even 3 or 4 great shots, that is why you cant over hit. I pusher only wins by the errors you make. A pusher can never hit a winner on you.

Your definition of a 'pusher' describes half plus of the ATP and WTA TOUR!! LOL

[Bedrock]

Originally Posted by Gonzalito17

This guy at the courts needed someone to play when i got there and there was one court open. SO we go to hit. I knew I could beat him so I was content to just hit on the far side facing the sun which was I mean straight in your eyes. Then he wanted to play sets. Okay, fine, I win 60 60. After it's over, he doens't say well played. He waits a few minutes and goes into a shpiel about that he plays for fun and exercise, only been playing 4 years. So I comment yeah that's good so do I but to get better you have to have a strong will to win, a very strong desire to improve. Yadayada as I'm walking away after saying goodbye he mumbles something about losing 30 pounds and not caring if he wins or loses, and that ... "you're a pusher." Whoa. It's a snide put down of course, then I say, Yeah well I only needed to play my B game to beat you, I just played defense 90% of the time (with the sun in eyes on the one side) and waited for your error. And also that I've won several tournaments and you don't win tournaments by being just a pusher. After a few more heated words, calling me a braggart, he eventually said he didn't mean pusher as an insult that it was an honest mistake he's only been playing for 4 years. and that was about the end of it. The nerve of someone losing 60 60 and calling you a pusher. End of story )

Why do you pay attention to it, pusher?
Play again.

[Sakkijarvi]

... will a pusher simply say, "damn right I'm a pusher, and damn proud of it..." Like, 'I wrote "The Hacker, Pusher and Dinker From Hell' and my name is Carlos Campos. Throw your hairless, sunken chest out when you say it and make sure those longjohns you wear under your tennis shorts on 62 degree May days when playing outdoors are not too crinkled (yeah, know that guy).

Instead, all this energy denying the obvious. Like, when you lose to a pusher and tell him he's a pusher you want to insult the little slug.

[Gonzalito17]

Originally Posted by Bedrock

Why do you pay attention to it, pusher?
Play again.

Watch it wise guy, were you at Bedrotriever? I'll show you some pushing )

[Rjtennis]

I don't really like playing pushers but if I'm playing smart tennis it's usually fairly easy because I know they are not going to attack anything short. I just have to remind myself to hit a few extra balls and wait until I get something short before I attack. Pushers are great at hitting slow-medium paced, deep moonballs. Even through I want to attack those balls, I have have to wait as it's not that smart to be attacking balls that are above my head. Pushers are planning on winning the match based on my unforced error so there is no point in playing super aggressive and adding to the unforced error. Pushers can be a hard group to figure out, but once you develop your own game plan on how beat them it's not so hard. The same strategy should work against all of them for the most part.

[Borrelli]

Pretty much everything about "pushers" has been summed up in this thread but the one thing I would add is that developing a really good drop shot is key to beating pushers. As someone else said, draw them into the net and then fire a few at them or lob them as they do to you. You really do have to finish a good amount of points off at the net or you'll be playing all day long.

There's a guy who I play occasionally who is a really good pusher. He ends up beating a lot of guys who are better then him just by using typical pusher techniques. He only plays local guys, mostly undeveloped players so he thinks he's great. He gets really mad if you tell him he's a pusher and says how he beats everyone so how could he be that bad? I mean this guy must shank 40% of his shots but they all end up over the net. I need to videotape this guy because he's really gotten fantastic at pushing. Personally, I just don't enjoy or have fun playing guys like that so I don't. I actually think it might be worse for my game since I'm slowing down my reflexes so much that when I hit with someone good I'm late on the ball.

[tennisoh]

Originally Posted by Gonzalito17

Whoa. Didn't expect this many responses,so can't address each point individually, sorry for that. He's a basic decent player, not a very good mover though. So when he challenged me to play this match I wanted to kill him. I felt the right tactic was to just play smart defense, which I can do very well, only go for my shots when up 30-love or 40-15. I played to kill him, knowing my movement and consistency would do the trick. Actually not a pusher, I can play and win USTA tournaments, can beat nationally ranked players. But when I play B or C level players I use my B or C game, why bother using your A game with a weak player? When he called me a pusher I took it as an insult and responded in kind. WHy take any disrespect from a C level dog? The deal is to respect everyone but not to endure any BS from anyone. Ever. At least that's my method.

So you wanted to kill him, but then you push and play your B or C level game? That makes no sense. Then again, this whole story describes not one, but two players I hope I never have to play against. This whole tennis outing sounded like a terrible time.

[corbind]

Originally Posted by Borrelli

I mean this guy must shank 40% of his shots but they all end up over the net.

I doubt I get even 1 in 20 shanks or a dismal <5%. Man, if I were as good as THAT pusher!

[Gonzalito17]

Borelli you need to be able to handle a pusher an their offspeeds, it will make you a more complete player. You must be able to handle anything thrown at you, not just good pace. Agree the drop shot is an important play. But to beat pushers I believe you have to be able to push also, you need to have this aspect in your arsenal. It's a great feeling to have the confidence that you can play 50-75 shots. Beat the pusher at his own game. If you can do that you are a more complete player. Of course you need to be able to mix it up and hit winners and targets, that's always nice but the key to tennis is variety and being able to mix it up, controlling the ball. One dimensional tennis is in most cases going to fail to beat a pusher. Unless you are like a pro and can fire winners all over the place. One dimensional player should work on their pushing game, it will make them more complete players. It will not be a step backwards. You need to have many weapons in your arsenal.

[Gonzalito17]

tennisoh, my B and C games can kill just about all 4.0 players. I can play great defense and never miss while also mixing it up. Also have excellent quickness and anticipation. I started off as a pusher but now I can win USTA tournaments and play even with Div 1 college players male or female. I just beat a former Lynn U player in two 21 games this week. I can beat teaching pros 6-0. My game is tough )People see it and think they can beat but then they end up getting killed. : 0

[IA-SteveB]

Originally Posted by Gonzalito17

tennisoh, my B and C games can kill just about all 4.0 players. I can play great defense and never miss while also mixing it up. Also have excellent quickness and anticipation. I started off as a pusher but now I can win USTA tournaments and play even with Div 1 college players male or female. I just beat a former Lynn U player in two 21 games this week. I can beat teaching pros 6-0. My game is tough )People see it and think they can beat but then they end up getting killed. : 0

I commend you for being so humble. A lot of people around here have big heads.

[SStrikerR]

I have a similar situation to you I can share actually. I'm a high school player, and at my local courts there are some older guys who aren't bad, but aren't that good either. If I were to play them in sets, I wouldn't waste my energy going for harder shots. Maybe I'd serve and volley some for giggles, but in general I'd hit rally balls. They're consistent for a bit, but if we eat hit about 5 balls in a rally I could be sure that they'd cough up an error soon after. Is that pushing?

I consider pushing to be just putting the ball back into play with no attempt at pace, spin, or direction. Just getting the ball over the net as much as possible. I don't consider patiently playing and waiting for an inevitable mistake pushing.

[robbo1970]

I think if youre playing someone randomly you don't know then it can just be instinct to hit the ball back rather than try to make winning shots. If you then win comfortably you have obviously done all you need to win. If that was just pushing then I would say its more your opponent not forcing more out of you.

I would take no notice if it was me. I play plenty of pushers and moonballers and they are frustrating to play against, but I take it that its down to me to work them more.

I'd ignore comments like that if I were you.

[rufus_smith]

Originally Posted by SStrikerR

I consider pushing to be just putting the ball back into play with no attempt at pace, spin, or direction. Just getting the ball over the net as much as possible. I don't consider patiently playing and waiting for an inevitable mistake pushing.

Seems like the perfect definition of pushing. What are you doing while "waiting" , getting the ball back anyway possible, right?

[OrangePower]

Originally Posted by Gonzalito17

"you're a pusher." Whoa. It's a snide put down of course, then I say, Yeah well I only needed to play my B game to beat you,

So when I first read this thread, I was on your side... only a sore loser would insult you after being beaten.

But the more I read of this thread...

Originally Posted by Gonzalito17

So when he challenged me to play this match I wanted to kill him. I played to kill him, why bother using your A game with a weak player? WHy take any disrespect from a C level dog?

Originally Posted by Gonzalito17

my B and C games can kill just about all 4.0 players. I can play great defense and never miss while also mixing it up. Also have excellent quickness and anticipation.

... the more I figure I would not want to play you, regardless of whatever your actual tennis game and skill level really is.

Someone who has a love for tennis and confidence in his own abilities would not need to make posts like that. You talk about respect but you're not showing much of it yourself.