Will Ralph win AO 2013?

[zagor]

Originally Posted by monfed

Why would you prefer Ralph over Murray at AO(Murray's favourite slam)? Last I checked Ralph got quite badly demolished at AO 2010,isnt it? Or is your memory weakening as you age,professor?

Murray's fit but not on Nadal and Novak's level still in that regard, a grueling match against Novak in SF could drain his reserves.

Tell me, what do you think would have happened at this year's AO if Murray managed to get past Novak (which he was very close to do)?

Originally Posted by monfed

Nah,Ralph will be thrusted into Fed's draw as usual and he will make the final atleast. On a good day he might actually get the W against Djokovic/Murray. Nothing has changed since his extended vacation.

If he is in Fed's half, I'd favour him to reach the final no doubt.

He could get a win against Novak and Murray individually but beating them both back-to-back (on HC in BO5) after 6 months of no match-play would be too tall of an order IMO.

[NadalAgassi]

zagor, why havent you posted in my Sabatini/Murray thread yet. You were a huge fan of Sabatini and are a big fan of Murrray right.

[monfed]

Originally Posted by zagor

Murray's fit but not on Nadal and Novak's level still in that regard, a grueling match against Novak in SF could drain his reserves.

Tell me, what do you think would have happened at this year's AO if Murray managed to get past Novak (which he was very close to do)?

At this year's AO, I would've picked Ralph over Murray as Murray would've wilted away as usual. But this is the improved Murray and he can beat him,but like you said I didn't take into account his SF match against Djokovic, so good on you for bringing that up.

Originally Posted by zagor

If he is in Fed's half, I'd favour him to reach the final no doubt.

He could get a win against Novak and Murray individually but beating them both back-to-back (on HC in BO5) after 6 months of no match-play would be too tall of an order IMO.

Perhaps but he has shown superhuman stamina as in 2009,remember? Ralph never gets tired for some reason,it's inexplicable really.

[NadalAgassi]

Originally Posted by monfed

Why would you prefer Ralph over Murray at AO(Murray's favourite slam)? Last I checked Ralph got quite badly demolished at AO 2010,isnt it? Or is your memory weakening as you age,professor?

You are the one who started a stupid thread about Nadal not playing for 6 months winning the Australian Open, not me. I guess given your miniature pea brain it is very hard to remember what you are trying to argue, so I shouldnt be too hard on you. While explaining anything to a vegetable like yourself is almost impossible I will humor you and attempt it. Last 3 slams Murray and Nadal played on 3 different surfaces, Nadal won all 3, none going 5 sets. So if Nadal is playing well enough to reach Murray, which means he is in atleast the semis, he is likely playing well enough to beat Murray. Doesnt mean Murray cant win, he has beaten Nadal 2 out of their 9 slam meetings after all so anything is possible, but Nadal's chances vs anyone but Djokovic if he reaches that stage are very good.

The Australian Open is not Murray's favorite slam. His best and favorite slam by far is the U.S Open where he has won and been in 2 finals. He was in 2 finals in Australia as well and got murdered in both of them, was in one U.S Open final but it was his maiden slam final. He is better on fast courts than slow courts which everyone knows, so by what absurd logic would the Australian be his best and favorite slam. He often gets easier draws there and tougher ones at the U.S Open and Wimbledon, otherwise the disparity would be even more.

[zagor]

Originally Posted by NadalAgassi

zagor, why havent you posted in my Sabatini/Murray thread yet. You were a huge fan of Sabatini and are a big fan of Murrray right.

Didn't even know such thread existed until now to be honest.

I liked Gabi and like Murray's game (especially when he adds a good dose of offense to it) and what he brings to the game but wouldn't necessarily say I was/am a huge fan of them (so fan, but not a big fan), I'll be sure to check it out.

I do feel that at their best levels, Murray was/is more close to the top stars of his era compared to Sabatini and I do consider Murray to be more mentally tough overall, it's just that he had a mental block in a specific situation (slam final).

I'd also be very surprised if Andy stops at one slam title, I could definitely see him ending his career with 4-5.

[Tony48]

Clarky said he will, so the answer is yes.

[batz]

Originally Posted by NadalAgassi

You are the one who started a stupid thread about Nadal not playing for 6 months winning the Australian Open, not me. I guess given your miniature pea brain it is very hard to remember what you are trying to argue, so I shouldnt be too hard on you. While explaining anything to a vegetable like yourself is almost impossible I will humor you and attempt it. Last 3 slams Murray and Nadal played on 3 different surfaces, Nadal won all 3, none going 5 sets. So if Nadal is playing well enough to reach Murray, which means he is in atleast the semis, he is likely playing well enough to beat Murray. Doesnt mean Murray cant win, he has beaten Nadal 2 out of their 9 slam meetings after all so anything is possible, but Nadal's chances vs anyone but Djokovic if he reaches that stage are very good.

The Australian Open is not Murray's favorite slam. His best and favorite slam by far is the U.S Open where he has won and been in 2 finals. He was in 2 finals in Australia as well and got murdered in both of them, was in one U.S Open final but it was his maiden slam final. He is better on fast courts than slow courts which everyone knows, so by what absurd logic would the Australian be his best and favorite slam. He often gets easier draws there and tougher ones at the U.S Open and Wimbledon, otherwise the disparity would be even more.

Hmmmmmm.

I know what the numbers say mate, but IMO Murray has played some of his best tennis at the Australian Open.

[NadalAgassi]

Well personally I consider Murray better on faster courts than slow and best on hard courts so combining the two his bests slams would be:

1. U.S Open

-----gap-----


2. Wimbledon and Australian Open (virtual tie)


-----gap-----

4. French Open


I know he has better stats at the Australian, but at Wimbledon he lost to Nadal before the final 3 different times so those are skewed. I do think he can win alteast 1 Wimbledon and atleast 1 Austrailan Open in his career though, and it would be dissapointing for him if he doesnt win at those venues. U.S Open will be his best slam, could see him winning up to 3 there.

The stats obviously favor the U.S though with a title + runner up > 2 runner up defeats in blowout finals, and 1 remaining semifinal at both venues. He also had more good wins at the U.S Open, and generally gets tougher draws there.

[batz]

Originally Posted by NadalAgassi

Well personally I consider Murray better on faster courts than slow and best on hard courts so combining the two his bests slams would be:

1. U.S Open

-----gap-----


2. Wimbledon and Australian Open (virtual tie)


-----gap-----

4. French Open


I know he has better stats at the Australian, but at Wimbledon he lost to Nadal before the final 3 different times so those are skewed. I do think he can win alteast 1 Wimbledon and atleast 1 Austrailan Open in his career though, and it would be dissapointing for him if he doesnt win at those venues. U.S Open will be his best slam, could see him winning up to 3 there.

The stats obviously favor the U.S though with a title + runner up > 2 runner up defeats in blowout finals, and 1 remaining semifinal at both venues. He also had more good wins at the U.S Open, and generally gets tougher draws there.

I think you're probably right - wins in places like Cincy and Rotterdam would tend to support this view; but consider this - Murray doesn't like playing on Armstrong; and he doesn't like it because he finds it too quick.

I think Murray likes most hardcourts and that he generally goes into the AO feeling fresh and ready to go; that's why he tends to play well there.

[NadalAgassi]

Originally Posted by batz

I think you're probably right - wins in places like Cincy and Rotterdam would tend to support this view; but consider this - Murray doesn't like playing on Armstrong; and he doesn't like it because he finds it too quick.

I think Murray likes most hardcourts and that he generally goes into the AO feeling fresh and ready to go; that's why he tends to play well there.

Fair points. Has he ever specifically said which is his "favorite" slam. Irregardless of favorite I still think his best career results will continue to be the U.S, in part since Djokovic is almost unbeatable at the Australian and IMO will be the Australian Open GOAT by the time he retires (might be even if he wins this coming year as expected).

[batz]

Originally Posted by NadalAgassi

Fair points. Has he ever specifically said which is his "favorite" slam. Irregardless of favorite I still think his best career results will continue to be the U.S, in part since Djokovic is almost unbeatable at the Australian and IMO will be the Australian Open GOAT by the time he retires (might be even if he wins this coming year as expected).

Yes he has - he said it was the US Open I tend to agree with you re Noel and the AO - I'm tipping him to win it in January.

I'm being greedy now - but I'd like to see Murray win a Wimbledon title at some point - I've always felt he plays well on grass.

[Crisstti]

Originally Posted by Mike Sams

People seem to disregard the fact that Nadal was 1 point away from going down 2 sets to love against Berdych in their AO quarterfinal match this year. Nadal had to save a set point or he'd have been in a real mess. Berdych isn't as easy a matchup as people tend to think. Nothing less than Nadal's best will get it done if Berdych is in form. Obviously the AO hardcourts suit Nadal's game much much better than Berdych's game.

I seem to remember he got pretty much robbed of the first set and should have won in straights.

Any hard court suits Berdych's game better. Nadal is just much better as a player.

Originally Posted by monfed

Perhaps but he has shown superhuman stamina as in 2009,remember? Ralph never gets tired for some reason,it's inexplicable really.

Guess you missed the USO final last year.

[axel89]

Originally Posted by Crisstti

I seem to remember he got pretty much robbed of the first set and should have won in straights.

Any hard court suits Berdych's game better. Nadal is just much better as a player.



Guess you missed the USO final last year.

he was tired uso 2008 also Berdych played one of his best matches there's no way nadal should of won in straights

[Feather]

Originally Posted by zagor

If he is in Fed's half, I'd favour him to reach the final no doubt.

He could get a win against Novak and Murray individually but beating them both back-to-back (on HC in BO5) after 6 months of no match-play would be too tall of an order IMO.

I feel that Roger will win against Nadal if they meet in AO 2013..

[tennisMVP]

Originally Posted by Mike Sams

There are only so many comebacks one can make before things just start to get tougher and tougher. Last I checked, Djokovic, Murray and Del Potro all have been extremely active while Nadal has been on the shelf. Furthermore, they all share a common trait. They've all crushed Nadal in Slams and they've all won Slams and they're all younger than Nadal and have far less wear and tear on their bodies. Nadal's going to have to EARN anything he gets with these guys around who are improving and getting stronger mentally. These are his main foes and Nadal hasn't had much success trying to beat Murray and Djokovic back to back. Just to beat 1 of them takes a formidable effort...try beating the both of them. Even Federer struggles to beat them back to back.

Nadal already said his holiday will help his career a lot. Reason being, he had time to heal his niggling injuries. And it didn't cost him a Roland Garros title. He chose the best time to have a holiday. If he could take 6 months off every year he'd probably still be winning Roland Garros at age 37.

Regarding Murray, in 2011 Nadal beat him in 3 out of 3 slam meetings. Whatever Murray had going for him vs Nadal is clearly gone. Djokovic too, has lost momentum vs Nadal. And by the way, Djokovic is NOT improving. He's going backwards.

[batz]

Originally Posted by tennisMVP

Nadal already said his holiday will help his career a lot. Reason being, he had time to heal his niggling injuries. And it didn't cost him a Roland Garros title. He chose the best time to have a holiday. If he could take 6 months off every year he'd probably still be winning Roland Garros at age 37.

Regarding Murray, in 2011 Nadal beat him in 3 out of 3 slam meetings. Whatever Murray had going for him vs Nadal is clearly gone. Djokovic too, has lost momentum vs Nadal. And by the way, Djokovic is NOT improving. He's going backwards.

Remind me how many points Rafa got in the last set he played v Murray? What's Rafa's hardcourt slam record v Murray since 2008 - c'mon; you like a head to head stat - what is it?

[joeri888]

Originally Posted by batz

He had 8 and squandered about half of them. So - back to the question I asked - you think that these missed match points in best of 3 matches have more of a bearing on Murray's chances of winning the AO than his USO and OG wins? Really?

He didn't really say that, and if he really thinks that he's stupid. However, Murray also didn't convince me after the US Open that he is the man to beat and a favourite over Roger and Rafa. Of course is US Open showed he can win a slam. We already knew that, but it showed he's in the mix more than ever. However, I can relate to monfed's comment in a sense that his post US Open play was somewhat disappointing and kind of showed that he at this point is not yet where Djokovic is in that department. Does that mean he cant win the AO? Sure not. He cna totally win it. But to me it also showed that particularly Djokovic is still at a bit of a higher level in terms of consistency, which makes him the favourite over Murray. This might've been different had Murray also won say Shanghai and WTF

[batz]

Originally Posted by joeri888

He didn't really say that, and if he really thinks that he's stupid. However, Murray also didn't convince me after the US Open that he is the man to beat and a favourite over Roger and Rafa. Of course is US Open showed he can win a slam. We already knew that, but it showed he's in the mix more than ever. However, I can relate to monfed's comment in a sense that his post US Open play was somewhat disappointing and kind of showed that he at this point is not yet where Djokovic is in that department. Does that mean he cant win the AO? Sure not. He cna totally win it. But to me it also showed that particularly Djokovic is still at a bit of a higher level in terms of consistency, which makes him the favourite over Murray. This might've been different had Murray also won say Shanghai and WTF

He strongly implied it Joeri. For the record, I was also disappointed about Murray's performances after the USO, he could easily have won in Tokyo, Shanghai and Paris - his lapses versus Noel and Sexi at the WTF were also disappointing - but not too disapointing as he'd just won the USO

Murray himself has said in the last week that in the last couple of years he has been fixated on winning a slam - to the detriment of his performances in the lesser events, and that he will be looking to be much more consistent in 2013.

[tennisMVP]

Originally Posted by batz

Remind me how many points Rafa got in the last set he played v Murray? What's Rafa's hardcourt slam record v Murray since 2008 - c'mon; you like a head to head stat - what is it?

The same number of points that Djokovic won vs Nishikori in the deciding set of their 2011 meeting.

Which do you value more, a US Open meeting between Nadal and Murray, or a meeting one month later at Tokyo?

Exactly my point, Murray beat Nadal at the 2008 US Open. That is why Nadal beating Murray at the 2011 US Open wasn't a good sign for Murray. He's taken a step back vs Nadal.

And before you point to Murray's 2012 US Open title, just remember that Djokovic played rather horrid in the final.

[batz]

Originally Posted by tennisMVP

The same number of points that Djokovic won vs Nishikori in the deciding set of their 2011 meeting.

Which do you value more, a US Open meeting between Nadal and Murray, or a meeting one month later at Tokyo?

Exactly my point, Murray beat Nadal at the 2008 US Open. That is why Nadal beating Murray at the 2011 US Open wasn't a good sign for Murray. He's taken a step back vs Nadal.

And before you point to Murray's 2012 US Open title, just remember that Djokovic played rather horrid in the final.

Djoker's level of play had nothing ot do with murray's USO win - that was solely down to the wind.

I'm not quite sure why you are fixating about what happened in 2011 - a lot of water has flowed under the bridge since then. The fact is that since Murray entered the upper echelons of the game in the 2nd half of 2008, he is 2-1 versus Rafa in hardcourt slams and 5-4 overall on hardcourt.

If you want to conclude from this data that Rafa cannot lose to Murray at the AO13 then feel free to do so.