Orange Bowl 2012

[Number1Coach]

Originally Posted by TCF

I think it is sheer numbers who play and playing opportunities. Our basketball kids can play 15 hours every weekend in pick up games, then go shoot 1000 baskets on their own. When they show promise, they can join AAU and be tested by other highly skilled players every practice and game. Never going to duplicate that in tennis, so many less players, distance to cover.

But one big problem is in America we shy away from our kids hitting with each other!! I have had so many older girls who make excuses not to hit vs my girl. I found a guy from South Africa who volunteered to hit with her yesterday and they had a blast, he was a excellent player over there. But its almost impossible to find adults who will bother hitting with a kid.

TCF your second paragraph is what we went through for years , my advice is the ball machine make the setting to where she can get a rhythm , trust me focus on clean strokes and movement , I was doing a lot of hand feeding till he was 14 , wish I had bought a ball machine , we use one regularly now and now he is a top player every one wants to hit "kinda irritates me " but its all good .

[NLBwell]

Originally Posted by ga tennis

Basketball has choice of the best athletes. Tennis in America rich kids average at best athletes.

Tennis isn't a rich person's sport. Jimmy Connors wasn't rich, Pancho Gonzales wasn't rich. I don't think Brad Baughman is rich (at least people seem to be concerned he couldn't pay for DB's college). It is a cult sport. Everyone plays basketball, everyone plays football. All it takes to get good at tennis is a racket, a ball, and a wall (or a shopping cart in Richard Williams' case). After that, some people to hit with at the local public courts.
However, you have to be part of the cult. Almost always, it comes from the family. You need some good initial instruction - that usually means family members who are good at tennis (Connors was taught by his tennis pro mom and grandmother). You need support from the family to keep playing tennis when the other kids are out doing other things. You need someone to hit with - often parents or siblings. You also need the driving desire to be great at tennis - part of which is inculcated by your surroundings. Also, it can be diminished by peer pressure where tennis isn't considered a "cool" sport.
When you get to the highest levels of juniors, some money is needed, but it isn't at that point that the best drop out.
Yes, the cult began in country clubs, and so most of the members come from wealthier backgrounds, but money isn't the big issue. It is a difficult sport to learn and success in it isn't reinforced highly in our society.
Face it, we are all just cult members.

[Number1Coach]

Originally Posted by NLBwell

Tennis isn't a rich person's sport. Jimmy Connors wasn't rich, Pancho Gonzales wasn't rich. I don't think Brad Baughman is rich (at least people seem to be concerned he couldn't pay for DB's college). It is a cult sport. Everyone plays basketball, everyone plays football. All it takes to get good at tennis is a racket, a ball, and a wall (or a shopping cart in Richard Williams' case). After that, some people to hit with at the local public courts.
However, you have to be part of the cult. Almost always, it comes from the family. You need some good initial instruction - that usually means family members who are good at tennis (Connors was taught by his tennis pro mom and grandmother). You need support from the family to keep playing tennis when the other kids are out doing other things. You need someone to hit with - often parents or siblings. You also need the driving desire to be great at tennis - part of which is inculcated by your surroundings. Also, it can be diminished by peer pressure where tennis isn't considered a "cool" sport.
When you get to the highest levels of juniors, some money is needed, but it isn't at that point that people drop out.
Yes, the cult began in country clubs, and so most of the members come from wealthier backgrounds, but money isn't the big issue. It is a difficult sport to learn and success in it isn't reinforced highly in our society.
Face it, we are all just cult members.

I agree with you , one of the things we keep doing on here is thinking all the best athletes are in other sports I disagree purely from the definition of what and athlete is , i have trained around some of the most well conditioned fighters and these guys would struggle with tennis ,thier bodys are not cut out for tennis !

TCF and Ga tennis have 2 players they should be focusing on turning into athletes it is something we dont look to do in tennis ,that is why DB is stepping up and having the success he is having , when he played Coric the diffence in the match ultimatley was DB became to physical for him in the 2nd and 3 rd set .
Trust me RG 3 and Luck would suck at this sport their bodys would not allow it but as football quarterbacks they are unbeievable .

[Freak4tennis]

Originally Posted by GRANITECHIEF

Now we're getting somewhere. Nice evolution of this forum.

Along those lines, I am looking for a host for my jr. player for F1-F3 the first 3 weeks of Jan. Looks like they are all in the same general area: Plantation, Sunrise, Weston FL.

If anybody knows anybody that may be interested in hosting a 17 year old USA boy going for his first atp points, lets talk more. Thanks!

Hi Granite; Actually we are looking for the same thing for the same aged player. Mine has 2 singles, and 10 doubles points so he has a bunch of contacts already and is trying to come up with a host for the all 4 including Palm Coast.

I'd prefer not to say who it is here although I'm certain a few already know. I will monitor this board. If you can share an email address I will email you maybe we can split expenses somehow.

We aren't certain he's going for all 4, and he may find something on his own, also depends a bit on his training facility there. However, if neither can find a host maybe sharing expenses between 2 or 3 may work as well.

[TCF]

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[Number1Coach]

Originally Posted by Freak4tennis

Hi Granite; Actually we are looking for the same thing for the same aged player. Mine has 2 singles, and 10 doubles points so he has a bunch of contacts already and is trying to come up with a host for the all 4 including Palm Coast.

I'd prefer not to say who it is here although I'm certain a few already know. I will monitor this board. If you can share an email address I will email you maybe we can split expenses somehow.

We aren't certain he's going for all 4, and he may find something on his own, also depends a bit on his training facility there. However, if neither can find a host maybe sharing expenses between 2 or 3 may work as well.

There is a coach in that area who houses kids named Bill Adams very solid if you would like could give you his no. Or you could look him up he has a passion for tennis and I trust would be very reasonable , let me know

[Number1Coach]

Originally Posted by TCF

Thanks BB, good advice. I imagine your guy can pick his hitting partners these days!

Yes he can now so that has been nice but trust me if I had it to do over I would have invested in a machine , the one regiment we stayed regular on was plyos and running stairs at 9-12 yrs old kept his feet like and has always had lungs of iron , TCF you are a freak for tennis focus and build within her and addiction for off court training , START NOW with that it will pay off !

If you do this trust me you will start seeing the vision of her on the tour cause what truly separates the best from the rest will be the insane work ethic if you want you can contact me through my YouTube page ' truly no hard feelings towards you or your family ' I mean that and will be willing to tell you what I did with my daughter and DB .

We need more Americans in the pipe and deep down inside I know your thinking that way .

[TCF]

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[andfor]

^^^Great stuff guys. When I was teaching tennis 20 years ago, still playing competitive open level tennis and doing triathlon's, I was then (still am) a huge advocate of getting more fit than your opponent. This included finding ways to be more athletic. There's a lot that goes into the game. Often the easy part is hitting a lot of tennis balls. What many don't realize is when your player is not hitting the ball as clean as they can on a certain day, having a superior fitness base to fall back on can often carry the day.

We are now again talking about good stuff guys. Keep it up.

[Postpre]

She loves the fitness part of it. Hurdles, jumps, bongo board, bozu, agility ladder, resistance runs, core work, etc. I owned a fitness center for 15 years, so am able to coordinate that aspect of her training.

TCF, have you structured such activities (i.e., followed a specific plan), or have you integrated these plyo/agility/balance drills into day to day fun and play? I've started working with my son to develop a better athletic base (fast twitch exercises, SQA type stuff), but it's sometimes hard to know when to do it (on off days or before hitting balls?) and how often (I don't want him to overtrain at his young age).

FYI, Donald Chu, who co-authored Progressive Plyometrics For Kids, recommended starting his program at age 8-10.

[Pro_Tour_630]

What is the world coming to, TCF is back, then, TCF and BB kiss and make up but the real shocker TCF wants his 7 year old to compete,,,,,,,,,,,,,, hope she is ready for the ugliest most unfit 10 year old with the worst strokes in the world to push, moonball, bully, cheat and will crawl on her knees from here to china to get a ball high deep to your daughters backhand to a point where she will quit tennis. Welcome to U12 Jr. tennis competition

[TCF]

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[TCF]

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[Postpre]

Postpre, right now it is done by feel. Sometimes she gets enough activity just from horsing around with friends. Other times we need more structured. Today her friends were not around so we did hurdles, ladder, cones, corner to corner drills.

That's a good plan, TCF. It's pretty much what I've implemented the last 3/4 of a year or so. When do you think is a good age to plan a consistent, structured, workout session focusing on speed, quickness, and agility?

[TCF]

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[GRANITECHIEF]

Originally Posted by tenniscp

who s the kid? i may be able to help, i know a few people down that way

Originally Posted by Freak4tennis

Hi Granite; Actually we are looking for the same thing for the same aged player. Mine has 2 singles, and 10 doubles points so he has a bunch of contacts already and is trying to come up with a host for the all 4 including Palm Coast.

I'd prefer not to say who it is here although I'm certain a few already know. I will monitor this board. If you can share an email address I will email you maybe we can split expenses somehow.

We aren't certain he's going for all 4, and he may find something on his own, also depends a bit on his training facility there. However, if neither can find a host maybe sharing expenses between 2 or 3 may work as well.

Thanks for the responses. I can be reached at granitechief at yahoo dot com.

[tenniscp]

Originally Posted by GRANITECHIEF

Thanks for the responses. I can be reached at granitechief at yahoo dot com.

The two families I had in mind for housing and driving the kids, both are already engaged. This is such a small world! They were actually approached last week, during the OB and both have committed to housing one junior and one college player.

Sorry!

[Pro_Tour_630]

Originally Posted by TCF

Ha, thanks Protour. Believe me, I do not want her to get into tournaments yet. She turned 8 just 2 months ago. But her friends are playing in a local 'recreational tournament'. Its a little different set up, non USTA, most of the kids use these for training and hit full out. Because of our location, 'local' can draw from a pool of players from Boca through Port Saint Lucie. So depending on time of year, there can be some nice talent around.

Its actually a preferred setup in my eyes. Its structured so it adds that layer of pressure, yet the kids almost would be 'embarrassed' to cheat, dink, and push the way the center sets it up. They actually test the kid's levels ahead of time, or know them already, and group the kids off by ability. She could be playing anyone from age 8-17, if the abilities are similar. This to me is the better way to set up kid's tournaments.

They have these once per month, sometimes 15 kids show up, sometimes 50 or more.

As far as regular USTA girls 12s....I am dreading getting involved in those and hope these tournaments are enough to satisfy her for a while. I would love to get through USTAs with the minimum of involvement and get into ITFs once she can handle them.

By the way, funny you mention the high ball to the back hand. We have been working that for a long time, as it is the achilles for the smaller player. She is to the point now that she can either position herself or attack the bounce and renders that strategy worthless for the most part. We have spent entire afternoons working just on that.

ok jr. ITF, is INTERNATIONAl, there is an international little mo going on right now in your neck of the woods, where an 8 year old can compete with other 8 year old using YELLOW ball on full court. no colored balls if she wishes, the evil USTA is not involved, with international players, BUT not many showed up In my neck of the woods there are over 40 U10 girls that show up to these colored tournaments every weekend. I asked about the level of play at these international little mo tournaments and it seems that it is not that high level, compared to the top players in NE.

How is the orange bowl level this year? heard it might be weaker than last year

[TCF]

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[Pro_Tour_630]

Originally Posted by TCF

Yes, the little Mo was a mile from us and some of the kids practiced at our center. The 8s that I saw had pitty pat pancake serves. There were not many players there who looked that great. I did see one of the older boys who looked pretty good.

The little Mo is weird, good marketing and name, but not of interest to many serious players. Frankly my kid gets better hits at the local tennis center than she would have if she played in it.

The OB is getting strange. Used to be all the top 10 ITF guys would be there. This year the 3rd seed was something like 22nd ITF.

I can send you a boy to look at who is better than the one you saw who is from our area and will be moving to your area . Not sure how I can contact you though, I will be in GA and might come down to your neck of the woods.